Why the Catholic Church changes the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday

[klutedavid]

Hello Bob.

Your sect said.

What we do NOT find in the NT is "The early Christians worshipped God on Sunday

(and week-day-1 is the Lord's Day)". Even you could not find it - so you simply quote "you" for that statement.

The very best translations of the Koine Greek have the following verse.

Acts 20
7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul began talking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight.

The only folk who disregard the Greek translation are the followers of the Sabbath.

Why do they accept the Koine Greek translation of the text everywhere else in the New Testament, but not in this one verse (Acts 20:7)?

Because they cannot follow the Sabbath commandment, if the church meets and breaks bread on the first day of the week.

This protest by the SDA over the translation of this single text (Acts 20:7), tells a person everything they need to know about this sect.

Nor do we find any of the texts you provide saying "every week day 1 gather for worship" or

"every week day 1 gather to break bread" or "every week-day-1 come together to remember the Lord's resurrection" or "week-day-1 is the Lord's Day"

None of that shows up in any of the texts you do-not-quote-but-reference.

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

We did notice Bob, you reject the translation here and accept the translation every where else.

"what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19
"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

Neither of these verses state the ten commandments, an oversight.

In your post you claim that the NT text says that NT Christians "worshipped God on Sunday (the Lord's Day), because the first day of the week became associated with Christ's resurrection"

That's the day that the Gentile churches gathered together, they were not Jews so the Sabbath was meaningless to them. They had a different calendar.

My response in the quote you just posted - was that nothing in your post was found in the actual Bible showing that any such weekly week-day-1 worship service of any kind was going on.

Your not a scholar of the Koine Greek, so don't write checks you can't cash.

The mere quote of the text - is sufficient cause to give rise to strong objection to it.

Your rejection of this verse says it all Bob.

 

[Open Heart]

No offense but how is a Jewish holy day a requirement for Christians when Romans, Galatians, Colossians all say Christians are not bound by the shadows of the law.

For Gentiles, it certainly isn't an obligation, per Acts 15. But if you notice, Acts 15 never removes the obligation from Jewish believers. Now, observing the Law does not bring salvation. It is done for love of God. But it is done by Jewish believers in the NT. In Acts 21:20 THOUSANDS of Jewish believers were all zealous for Torah.

 

[Open Heart]

The vast majority of 1st century Christians were Hellenistic or Greek speaking Jews. These Jews were often found in the surrounding nations. Many had abandoned the Torah, Sabbath, food restrictions and most things Jewish so to the untrained eye they looked like Gentiles. The 1st century landscape was not black and white it was all mixed up like today.

So you don't want to address Acts 21:20?

 

[BobRyan]

So you don't want to address Acts 21:20?

Acts 21:20
20 And when they heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to him, “You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law;

Missing a few texts...



Acts 21
24 take them and purify yourself along with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads; and all will know that there is nothing to the things which they have been told about you, but that you yourself also walk orderly, keeping the Law

Acts 24
14But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets


Acts 25
8 while he answered for himself, "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Caesar have I offended in anything at all.;


Acts 26
Therefore, having obtained help from God, to this day I stand, witnessing both to small and great, saying no other things than those which the prophets and Moses said would come; 23 that the Christ would suffer, that He would be the first to rise from the dead, and would proclaim light to the Jewish people and to the Gentiles;

Acts 28
17 And it came to pass after three days that Paul called the leaders of the Jews together. So when they had come together, he said to them: Men and brethren, though I have done nothing against our people or the customs of our fathers, yet I was delivered as a prisoner from Jerusalem into the hands of the Romans,... I have called for you, to see you and speak with you, because for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.
...
23 So when they had appointed him a day, many came to him at his lodging, to whom he explained and solemnly testified of the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus from both the Law of Moses and the Prophets, from morning till evening

Acts 18:4 EVERY Sabbath - both Jews AND Gentiles hearing Gospel preaching in the Synagogue.

 

[BobRyan]

You are the one that appealed to the Catholic Church accepting all of the 10 commandments.

True. I point out that when a certain Bible detail (like all TEN of the TEN commandments included in the moral law of God) is so obvious that BOTH sides can see it and admit to it... well "it just does not get any easier than that!".

No sense in getting "stuck on the EASY stuff" -- might want to just accept it and move on to the harder topics. Points of actual difference

If you do that, you are accepting its authority.

I find our logic "illusive" at that point.

Or do you think I should not "admit" to any place at all where these sources are getting something right just because there is some "other detail" that the happen to get wrong??

The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism.

If that is your policy -- I find the logic for it "illusive".

So far I am only stating the obvious - that every reader can see.

 

[BobRyan]

Hello Bob.

Your sect said.

When you find a point other than name-calling -.... let me know.

 

[BobRyan]

The early Christians worshipped God on Sunday (the Lord's Day), because the first day of the week became associated with Christ's resurrection (Matthew 28:1-10; Luke 24:1; John 20:1; Revelation 1:10). We see from Acts 20:7 and I Corinthians 16:1-3 that the early Church gathered together on the first day of every week in order to "break bread," and also to take up a "collection for the saints." Nowhere in the New Testament is the Church commanded to gather together to worship on the Jewish seventh day Sabbath.

We compare the Bible statements about "week-day-1" vs the statements in the NT about the Sabbath here -
Dec 22, 2016 #1

What we do NOT find in the NT is "The early Christians worshipped God on Sunday (the Lord's Day), because the first day of the week". Even you could not find it - so you simply quote "you" for that statement.

Nor do we find any of the texts you provide saying "every week day 1 gather for worship" or "every week day 1 gather to break bread" or "every week-day-1 come together to remember the Lord's resurrection" or "week-day-1 is the Lord's Day"

None of that shows up in any of the texts you do-not-quote-but-reference.

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"???

The very best translations of the Koine Greek have the following verse.

Acts 20
7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul began talking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight.

The only folk who disregard the Greek translation are the followers of the Sabbath.

Why do they accept the Koine Greek translation of the text everywhere else in the New Testament, but not in this one verse (Acts 20:7)?

Because they cannot follow the Sabbath commandment, if the church meets and breaks bread on the first day of the week.

Nonsense.

Here is what we DO NOT find in Acts 20:7... and we all know it

What we do NOT find in the NT is "The early Christians worshipped God on Sunday (the Lord's Day), because the first day of the week".

Nor do we find any of the texts you provide saying "every week day 1 gather for worship" or "every week day 1 gather to break bread" or "every week-day-1 come together to remember the Lord's resurrection" or "week-day-1 is the Lord's Day"

Acts 20:7 does not say "every week day 1 we gather to break bread"... no matter WHO you quote... and we both know it

No amount of "name calling" changes facts

 

[BobRyan]

For Gentiles, it certainly isn't an obligation, per Acts 15. .

Acts 15 does not mention the command "do not take God's name in vain" -- but that did not stop the RCC from admitting the Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN commandments are included in the moral law of God - written on the heart - under the New Covenant.

Suppose you meet a fellow Catholic who admits to the glaringly obvious point I just stated. Do you "really" choose to condemn them for following the teaching of their own church???

 

[BobRyan]

Those who were zealous of the law tried to kill Paul not long afterwards and almost succeeded. .

And when Paul was put on trial - standing before God and country - telling the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth - what were the strong statements Paul made as he gave his OWN testimony about what it was he was preaching...

Let's read it.

Yesterday at 10:59 PM #725

 

[Open Heart]

Those who were zealous of the law tried to kill Paul not long afterwards and almost succeeded. James was one of the old guard who was trying to help the Jews convert but the vast majority never did.

You are confusing the non-believing Jews with the believing Jews.

Of course the vast majority did not. God didn't want them too. God's desire is for the fullness of the Gentiles to come in.

 

[Open Heart]

The 1st century was a transition period where many believing Jews still clung to the remnants of Judaism especially physical circumcision.

First century Christianity is what is recorded in Scripture. It is, for us, the example to follow, since it is God's word.

 

[Open Heart]

No it's not for you to follow. Your job is to believe in Christ and if you think that is too easy why do so many fail at it?

You don't think it is my job to learn from Scripture? Now THAT I don't understand.

 

[BobRyan]

First century Christianity is what is recorded in Scripture. It is, for us, the example to follow, since it is God's word.

I keep saying that.

 

[Danthemailman]

No it's not for you to follow. Your job is to believe in Christ and if you think that is too easy why do so many fail at it?

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It's just hard for many people to ACCEPT. It's tragic that so many people refuse to come to Christ! Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

 

[BobRyan]

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. .

True... "and yet" we still are not supposed to take God's name in vain Ex 20:7 - it is still a sin to do that.

 

[bloodygrace]

True... "and yet" we still are not supposed to take God's name in vain Ex 20:7 - it is still a sin to do that.

You are perpetually stuck under the law. Those in Galatians who taught Christians this were condemned in the severest terms. There is a curse attached to law keeping and it is very real.

 

[BobRyan]

BobRyan said: ↑
True... "and yet" we still are not supposed to take God's name in vain Ex 20:7 - it is still a sin to do that.

You are perpetually stuck under the law. .

let me guess... you say that every time someone reminds you that it is still a sin to take God's name in vain.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

let me guess... you say that every time someone reminds you that it is still a sin to take God's name in vain.

In all eternity, before time? maybe, since creation, eternally forward after heaven and earth are 'rolled up',
has it ever been "not a sin" ?

Is it not always a sin ?

 

[listed]

You are confusing the non-believing Jews with the believing Jews.

Of course the vast majority did not. God didn't want them too. God's desire is for the fullness of the Gentiles to come in.

What is the reason you want to discuss those zealous for the law?

 

[listed]

The 1st century was a transition period where many believing Jews still clung to the remnants of Judaism especially physical circumcision.

True and that is the reason they were zealous for the law. It's not like flipping a light switch.