What have you understood about the charcater of The Ten Commandments??

[Frogster]

Notice you blame Israel for the rejection but still states that the law failed. Which is it?
It was not the law but the people. Heb 8:
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
8For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

but he knew they would fail when he made it, that is what they had sacrifices, and he did not want offerings, heb 10.

 

[from scratch]

That doesn't answer my question. If you can't answer my questions, don't expect me to answer yours.

I think I did. Jeremiah says .....make a new covenant....not according to.... Jesus testifies this covenant is currently in effect.

 

[Sophrosyne]

This is not the truth. How many sinned and were not zapped? David and adultery. There are hundreds more but no need to mention. You believe that God is letting us off the hook now?

It is true, although not everyone was zapped... from the very start a man was executed by God's edict for gathering firewood on the Sabbath. This example and others meant that even though some could get away with breaking the Law being caught meant more often than not... DEATH.

 

[Elder 111]

Primarily because the Ten Commandments aren't the property of Jesus. Jesus didn't give them to Israel. No I won't let you sneak in the back door either.

There is nothing to sneak in. Jesus and the Father act in unity. That is a fact of the bible. It was Jesus that was with the Israelite in the wilderness so says Paul.

 

[Sophrosyne]

There is nothing to sneak in. Jesus and the Father act in unity. That is a fact of the bible. It was Jesus that was with the Israelite in the wilderness so says Paul.

The problem with making the Law the property of Jesus is a double edged sword to those who demand the Law. Someone who makes Laws can change or even consider them fulfilled and non longer needed. If the Law was Jesus making then he certainly could decide what to do with it any time he pleased including fulfilling the demands of the Law and calling an end to it for those who enter into his circle (saved). If you make Jesus instead not the author but the Father then Jesus can keep the same Law for the Father and the Father can then consider it fulfilled and then call an end to it for Christians.

 

[from scratch]

There is nothing to sneak in. Jesus and the Father act in unity. That is a fact of the bible. It was Jesus that was with the Israelite in the wilderness so says Paul.

Who's property is the Ten Commandments? You know I'm going to requires Biblical support, so give that also.

 

[from scratch]

The problem with making the Law the property of Jesus is a double edged sword to those who demand the Law. Someone who makes Laws can change or even consider them fulfilled and non longer needed. If the Law was Jesus making then he certainly could decide what to do with it any time he pleased including fulfilling the demands of the Law and calling an end to it for those who enter into his circle (saved). If you make Jesus instead not the author but the Father then Jesus can keep the same Law for the Father and the Father can then consider it fulfilled and then call an end to it for Christians.

Its impossible to prove Jesus issued the Ten Commandments. I don't understand why that claim is still made. They've been shown both from the Book of the Law, the prophets and the Gospels the claim has no foundation.

 

[Strong in Him]

Think I might be going slightly mad.

I'm sure I wrote a reply to another forummer's post, but I can't find it. I wasn't aware it was rude, blasphemous or off topic - neither have I received a pm telling me that it would be removed. I know the thread has been cleaned up, but as I wasn't aware of a problem, I wasn't able to either apologise nor put it right.

Unless the post's still here but I can't see it??

 

[Sophrosyne]

Think I might be going slightly mad.

I'm sure I wrote a reply to another forummer's post, but I can't find it. I wasn't aware it was rude, blasphemous or off topic - neither have I received a pm telling me that it would be removed. I know the thread has been cleaned up, but as I wasn't aware of a problem, I wasn't able to either apologise nor put it right.

Unless the post's still here but I can't see it??

It was probably removed already, if you have questions you need to contact a mod or admin about it.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Its impossible to prove Jesus issued the Ten Commandments. I don't understand why that claim is still made. They've been shown both from the Book of the Law, the prophets and the Gospels the claim has no foundation.

I think the problem we have is that they are disassembling the trinity and reassembling it to suit their agenda instead of being logical. The OT doesn't specifically say Jesus was at Sinai. Their saying it was Jesus commandments works against them as the nature of the Trinity is the Father is the one that plans things out which means He would be the one making up the commandments and even if Jesus gave them out he was acting just as in the New Testament as the person doing the action but not deciding upon it. I believe that all the commands Jesus gave in the NT also came from the Father too but because of his personal appearance it was attributed to him in the Bible. In other words Jesus commands people (at the decision of the Father to love God and their neighbor while he was keeping the Mosaic Law for the Father so he could fulfill its demands on mankind.

 

[from scratch]

I think the problem we have is that they are disassembling the trinity and reassembling it to suit their agenda instead of being logical. The OT doesn't specifically say Jesus was at Sinai. Their saying it was Jesus commandments works against them as the nature of the Trinity is the Father is the one that plans things out which means He would be the one making up the commandments and even if Jesus gave them out he was acting just as in the New Testament as the person doing the action but not deciding upon it. I believe that all the commands Jesus gave in the NT also came from the Father too but because of his personal appearance it was attributed to him in the Bible. In other words Jesus commands people (at the decision of the Father to love God and their neighbor while he was keeping the Mosaic Law for the Father so he could fulfill its demands on mankind.

So who has a problem? Me, The Bible or them? I believe it is them. They say it is me and refuse to consult the Bible.

God said no man can see God and live. Ex 33:20 This causes several problems if Jesus gave the Ten Commandments at Sinai.

1. God the Father lied.
2. Jesus God the Son lied if He did as accused.
3. Moses lied.
4. John lied.
5. Interferes with the Trinity doctrine.

Personally I don't like any of those problems and believe the Bible agrees with itself on every issue.

 

[JohnRabbit]

I think the problem we have is that they are disassembling the trinity and reassembling it to suit their agenda instead of being logical. The OT doesn't specifically say Jesus was at Sinai (so of course, the NT couldn't? ). Their saying it was Jesus commandments works against them as the nature of the Trinity is the Father is the one that plans things out which means He would be the one making up the commandments and even if Jesus gave them out he was acting just as in the New Testament as the person doing the action but not deciding upon it. I believe that all the commands Jesus gave in the NT also came from the Father too but because of his personal appearance it was attributed to him in the Bible. In other words Jesus commands people (at the decision of the Father to love God and their neighbor while he was keeping the Mosaic Law for the Father so he could fulfill its demands on mankind.

So who has a problem? Me, The Bible or them? I believe it is them. They say it is me and refuse to consult the Bible.

God said no man can see God and live. Ex 33:20 This causes several problems if Jesus gave the Ten Commandments at Sinai.

1. God the Father lied.
2. Jesus God the Son lied if He did as accused.
3. Moses lied.
4. John lied.
5. Interferes with the Trinity doctrine.

Personally I don't like any of those problems and believe the Bible agrees with itself on every issue.

REPOST: from: http://www.christianforums.com/t7595576-11/



here are the some verses again for you:

when the bible refers to the "Angel of the Lord", it is referring to the One we

know as the Christ.

moses talked to the One we know as Jesus and here's proof from the bible!

John 1:1(NKJV)
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

word, strongs G3056
G3056

λόγος

logos

log'-os

From G3004; something said (including the thought); by implication a topic (subject of discourse), also reasoning (the

mental faculty) or motive; by extension a computation; specifically (with the article in John) the Divine Expression (that

is, Christ):—account, cause, communication, X concerning, doctrine, fame, X have to do, intent, matter, mouth, preaching,

question, reason, + reckon, remove, say (-ing), shew, X speaker, speech, talk, thing, + none of these things move me,

tidings, treatise, utterance, word, work.

He that speaks came to this world in the flesh jn 1:14!

now, look at this:

Hebrews 2:7-9(NKJV)
7 You have made him a little lower than the angels; You have crowned him with glory and

honor, And set him over the works of Your hands.
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet.” For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left

nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.
9But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death

crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.

moses didn't see the face of God! (ex 33:20-23), you have to remember that when He appeared in His Glory,

He often hid Himself in a thick black cloud!

notice this:

Exodus 24:9-11(NKJV)
9Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
10and they saw the God of Israel. And there was under His feet as it were a paved work

of sapphire stone, and it was like the very heavens in its clarity.
11But on the nobles of the children of Israel He did not lay His hand. So they saw God

, and they ate and drank.

now, compare to:

John 1:18(NKJV)
18No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He

has declared Him. (Who declared Whom?)

John 6:46(NKJV)
46Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the

Father.

1 John 4:12(NKJV)
12No one has seen God at any time. If we love one another, God abides in us, and His

love has been perfected in us.

so, who did moses and the others see? i think it's safe to say it wasn't the Father!

exodus says they saw God and 1jn says no one has seen God. there can be no contradiction.

so, the One we know as Jesus is the answer!

i definitely haven't found any scripture that suggests it was God's Holy Spirit.

now here's more scripture for proof!

Exodus 14:19-20,24(NKJV)
19And the Angel of God, who went before the camp of Israel, moved and went behind them; and the pillar of cloud

went from before them and stood behind them. 20So it came between the camp of the Egyptians and the camp of

Israel. Thus it was a cloud and darkness to the one, and it gave light by night to the other, so that the one did

not come near the other all that night... 24Now it came to pass, in the morning watch, that the Lord looked down

upon the army of the Egyptians through the pillar of fire and cloud, and He troubled the army of the

Egyptians.

the phrase "Angel of God" is referring to God and not some angel. the Angel of God in this instance is the

one we know as the Christ.

Exodus 24:15-16(NKJV)
15Then Moses went up into the mountain, and a cloud covered the mountain.
16Now the glory of the Lord rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days. And on the

seventh day He called to Moses out of the midst of the cloud.

God talked to moses from the cloud. so, we know who's in the cloud. from the verses that john wrote, i.e.

jn 1:18, we know this could not be God the Father.

Exodus 33:9-10(NKJV)
9And it came to pass, when Moses entered the tabernacle, that the pillar of cloud descended and stood at the

door of the tabernacle, and the Lord talked with Moses.
10All the people saw the pillar of cloud standing at the tabernacle door, and all the people rose and

worshiped, each man in his tent door.

Numbers 14:14(NKJV)
14and they will tell it to the inhabitants of this land. They have heard that You, Lord, are among these people;

that You, Lord, are seen face to face and Your cloud stands above them, and You go before them in a

pillar of cloud by day and in a pillar of fire by night.

can't get much clearer on Who's going before the COI in a pillar of cloud!

1 Corinthians 10:1-4(NKJV)
1Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed

through the sea,
2all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
3all ate the same spiritual food,
4and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock

was Christ.

you see?

you don't have to believe me, just believe the bible.

the bible says it was Christ!

"and that Rock was Christ"

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Strong in Him

Think I might be going slightly mad.

I'm sure I wrote a reply to another forummer's post, but I can't find it. I wasn't aware it was rude, blasphemous or off topic - neither have I received a pm telling me that it would be removed. I know the thread has been cleaned up, but as I wasn't aware of a problem, I wasn't able to either apologise nor put it right.

​

Bummer

It was probably removed already, if you have questions you need to contact a mod or admin about it.

That would be my advice also.........

The Mod Squad TV Show Theme Opening Season One - YouTube

.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

REPOST: from: http://www.christianforums.com/t7595576-11/


can't get much clearer on Who's going before the COI in a pillar of cloud!

1 Corinthians 10:1-4(NKJV)
1Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed

through the sea,
2all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
3all ate the same spiritual food,
4and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock

was Christ.

you see?

you don't have to believe me, just believe the bible.

the bible says it was Christ!

"and that Rock was Christ"

No arguement from me on that



,

 

[JohnRabbit]

No arguement from me on that



,

you're so sweet!

 

[Strong in Him]

It was probably removed already, if you have questions you need to contact a mod or admin about it.

Thanks. It's not a problem, just slightly frustrating that I spent so much time on it.

 

[Strong in Him]

Bummer
That would be my advice also.........

The Mod Squad TV Show Theme Opening Season One - YouTube

.

Thanks.

 

[Strong in Him]

Bummer
That would be my advice also.........

Thanks.

 

[GratiaCorpusChristi]

I'm thinking of something moreso along the lines of a teacher who tries to remove the role Abraham Lincoln played in the Civil War because they consider it irrelevant now.

I guess I understand. But now I've lost the metaphor entirely. Who's comparing that to what, now?

 

[Elder 111]

It is true, although not everyone was zapped... from the very start a man was executed by God's edict for gathering firewood on the Sabbath. This example and others meant that even though some could get away with breaking the Law being caught meant more often than not... DEATH.

Look at the circumstances, God brings mana down, He is there by fire at night and cloud by day, He speaks to you directly, parts the sea, miracle after miracle. He then tells you do this or that and you refuse, right there in front of His face, and God should do nothing? You are absolutely reject ing God and life.
It is death to all who rejects God. Duet. 30: 19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
What do you think would happen to us who now rejects God. You think that because we do not drop down dead now that it is different? The death now is not the real death!