The Lord's day.

[Standing Up]

No, there isn't. There is no evidence in the Scripture, at all, that Sunday is the Lord's day of Revelation 1:10. No one has brought forward any yet.

Abundance of evidence has been brought forward for the 7th Day the Sabbath of the Lord thy God, however.

You are neglecting the fact that Pentecost (the giving of the Spirit) was always on a Sunday.

So yeah, I'd still camp on the Lord's Day IS a Sunday Pentecost perhaps 40 years from the initial one in Acts to which John is referring.

 

[Elder 111]

This has been considered very carefully more than once in my tenure here at CT.

Notice it says first day of the week. The fact of when they started the day has no bearing on what time of day they met during our Saturday. You can't have it both ways. The Sabbath was over. The fact it may have been actually on what we call Saturday and saying it was the Sabbath and not Sunday is fraud also called false witness. The point is it was the first day of the week. Furthermore the meeting went past midnight and part of the religious meeting actually was on our Sunday if you want to get technical.

On looking closer at the passage in question there is no indication of being at the synagogue on the Sabbath. That is nothing more than an assumption. There is no mention of the Sabbath in the 7 verses. ...on the morrow simply means the next day.

Your argument fails the test.

Not at all. The validity of my argument is not subject to your bias.
The text clearly says that they continued (continue from what and when, yes deny)and we know that it was Saturday night. They went on to midnight and then Paul was departing in the morning.
11 When he therefore was come up again, and had broken bread, and eaten, and talked a long while, even till break of day, so he departed.
We agree that it was Saturday night. The text now clearly states that at the break of day Paul was on his way. This cannot be a case of Sunday worship, the man was traveling. This was a last chance meeting for Paul with these persons and that is all.
The final say on this matter is the word of God not yours or others that might share your position.

 

[Elder 111]

You are neglecting the fact that Pentecost (the giving of the Spirit) was always on a Sunday.

So yeah, I'd still camp on the Lord's Day IS a Sunday Pentecost perhaps 40 years from the initial one in Acts to which John is referring.

Is this guessing, assuming or wishing? Is this method a fool proof way? You will leave your salvation on it might be Pentecost 40 years later? When were we asked to celebrate Pentecost every week?

 

[rstrats]

from scratch,

re: "So why don't you use the quote feature...?"

Because I find it easier to use my format. Here's the code: The first line of my post contains the name of the person to whom my post is directed. The second line of my post - if it starts with "re:" - will be quoting a comment from that person. The next line/s after the quote will be my response to the quote. If I am addressing more than one comment, each persons comment will have quote marks around it and be preceded with "re").
　

re: "You're promoting doctrine recognized as that of a certain religious body."

I wasn't aware that I was promoting any doctrine. What doctrine do you think I am promoting?

 

[from scratch]

Not at all. The validity of my argument is not subject to your bias.
The text clearly says that they continued (continue from what and when, yes deny)and we know that it was Saturday night. They went on to midnight and then Paul was departing in the morning.
11 When he therefore was come up again, and had broken bread, and eaten, and talked a long while, even till break of day, so he departed.
We agree that it was Saturday night. The text now clearly states that at the break of day Paul was on his way. This cannot be a case of Sunday worship, the man was traveling. This was a last chance meeting for Paul with these persons and that is all.
The final say on this matter is the word of God not yours or others that might share your position.

Bias? There is no mention of the Sabbath in the first 7 verses or even the whole chapter. There isn't even a mention of the synagogue. So who's inflicting bias? I've agreed that it was Saturday night before and will no longer agree to that. Saturday night isn't the Sabbath. Its the first day of the week.

So your yelling about Paul leaving at day break could easily be our Monday.

 

[Albion]

All this 'cat and mouse' stuff can be fun, I suppose, but it all comes down to whether or not the seventh day can be moved--ever, for any reason. The New Testament suggests that we are now in a new era when such legalities as "days" are not as important, while other matters, such as what's in one's heart, trusting in the Savior, etc. really are the focus. Discuss if you want.

 

[from scratch]

from scratch,

re: "So why don't you use the quote feature...?"

Because I find it easier to use my format. Here's the code: The first line of my post contains the name of the person to whom my post is directed. The second line of my post - if it starts with "re:" - will be quoting a comment from that person. The next line/s after the quote will be my response to the quote. If I am addressing more than one comment, each persons comment will have quote marks around it and be preceded with "re").

Really? I just click on the quote button and the whole post appears in the dialog box. No typing or c&p.

　

re: "You're promoting doctrine recognized as that of a certain religious body."

I wasn't aware that I was promoting any doctrine. What doctrine do you think I am promoting?

Really?

 

[VictorC]

Is this guessing, assuming or wishing? Is this method a fool proof way? You will leave your salvation on it might be Pentecost 40 years later? When were we asked to celebrate Pentecost every week?

Where did you get the idea that our salvation depends on a periodic day (which is annual, and not "weekly") that has been fulfilled?
Stranger and stranger....

 

[Standing Up]

Is this guessing, assuming or wishing? Is this method a fool proof way? You will leave your salvation on it might be Pentecost 40 years later? When were we asked to celebrate Pentecost every week?

My salvation rests not on the definition of Lord's day.

The point is Pentecost always fell once a year on a Sunday. John was in the Spirit and heard a voice as a trumpet. Great description of same.

 

[Elder 111]

Bias? There is no mention of the Sabbath in the first 7 verses or even the whole chapter. There isn't even a mention of the synagogue. So who's inflicting bias? I've agreed that it was Saturday night before and will no longer agree to that. Saturday night isn't the Sabbath. Its the first day of the week.

So your yelling about Paul leaving at day break could easily be our Monday.

You will base your salvation on a could be? Your call.

 

[from scratch]

You will base your salvation on a could be? Your call.

No sir. You need to read all my posts to have the required context to understand what I said.

Not much of what I say are stand alone statements. There is continuity to what I say.

 

[Standing Up]

Bias? There is no mention of the Sabbath in the first 7 verses or even the whole chapter. There isn't even a mention of the synagogue. So who's inflicting bias? I've agreed that it was Saturday night before and will no longer agree to that. Saturday night isn't the Sabbath. Its the first day of the week.

So your yelling about Paul leaving at day break could easily be our Monday.

I doubt it was a Sunday meeting and he left Monday morning.

Most likely it was a Sabbath sundown at the end meeting. Paul left Sunday morning.

Or it could have been a Sabbath sundown at the beginning meeting. Paul left Sabbath morning.

Either way, the Jewish Sabbath played no part (Paul either travelled on it or didn't meet them on it).

 

[By Faith Alone]

My Brothers:

Please listen. I am going to start out by throwing a stick of dynamite in the works here. There...IS...a dispensational boundary at Acts 28. This concerns the fact you may be arguing the Sabbath from the wrong side of the boundary. Hope nobody got hurt on that one. Before Acts 28 Israel/Jew was still first. The olive tree still stood (Romans 11) and Gentiles were dogs dispensationally. Let me explain.
It is true there is no Jew nor Greek while.... IN CHRIST...BUT.... that does not explain the olive tree and the Gentiles graft in contrary to nature. That shows there is a difference. What... IS...that difference? Well, the fact is that the whole of the book of Acts is not looking Heavenward. That includes the four Gospels. Jesus said so Himself.
Look here:
Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Israel and their Kingdom was in view there. What were the promises made to the fathers? It was an earthly Kingdom where Christ will be the King of Israel. It is to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel He was sent and the Gentile had a prospective outlook to the blessings promised to the nation. They came in as the wild branches. These promises are the root and fatness of the Olive Tree.
After the Cross His aim was for Israel to repent. He gave them every chance in the world. The nation rejected Him at the stoning of Stephen. Then came Paul and his missionary trips to the Jews (still being first) for God was concerned for the scattered as well as the nation. The scattered rejected Him at Rome. It was all or none as far as God was concerned.
At one point in time during the Acts period (Acts 21:21 onward). Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses. He set out to prove he was not doing any such thing by having a fellow circumcised and more. Paul was not a deceiver. He was obeying the law and I dare say the ENTIRE law as much as possible....including the Sabbath days.

At Acts 28 the Olive Tree was hewn to the roots but the roots remain. The promises...WILL...be fulfilled.
Luke 3:8-9
8 Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
9 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Here is Paul"s statement of mission prior to the last meeting with the leaders of the dispersed::
Acts 28:20...for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.
Still earth bound.

The book of Hebrews chapter 11 has the New Jerusalem descending FROM Heaven as a reward for special service including martyrdom. Another sphere of blessings. STILL...not the heaven far above all.

Now. AFTER the last announcement we have a new calling that wipes out...ALL..distinctions between Jew and Gentile.

Acts 28:28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles (Ethnos..Nations) and that they will hear it.

The book of Ephesians and Colossians were next. These two epistles coupled together give full details of this brand new calling and can be considered the charter of our church. This side of Acts 28 we see this:

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Can't fight that can we? This new calling was hid..IN...God and never revealed to the prophets in age time past until revealed exclusively to Paul in 63 AD.

Eph 3:2-9
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me (PAUL) to youward (Gentile ward)
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now (AD 63) revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid.. in ...God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
The Gentiles is elevated to the level of the Jew and are temporarily on the same plane. It was a top secret calling until revealed to Paul. Remember the parable of the patch?

Matt 9:16 No man putteth a piece of new cloth unto an old garment, for that which is put in to fill it up taketh from the garment, and the rent is made worse.
That rent was at Acts 28 and Israel is temporarily Lo-Ammi (Hosea 1:9).
And here is their condition now:
Hos 3:4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince, and without a sacrifice, and without an image, and without an ephod, and without teraphim:

There would be no way to mix any kind of differences in this calling. This calling is to the Heaven far above all where Christ sitteth at the right hand of God. God has a brand new piece of cloth.

Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

Col 3:1-4
1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

On the other side of Acts 28 they are exhorted to:

Heb 10:19-23
19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised

Our calling is already there!!
Eph 2:13-17
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are ...made.... nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

 

[rstrats]

from scratch,

re: "Really?"


Yes really. What doctrine do you think I am promoting?

 

[Elder 111]

I doubt it was a Sunday meeting and he left Monday morning.

Most likely it was a Sabbath sundown at the end meeting. Paul left Sunday morning.

Or it could have been a Sabbath sundown at the beginning meeting. Paul left Sabbath morning.

Either way, the Jewish Sabbath played no part (Paul either travelled on it or didn't meet them on it).

Just had to deny the truth.

 

[By Faith Alone]

Elder 111:

Do you think worshiping on Sunday is the mark of the beast?

 

[from scratch]

My Brothers:

Please listen. I am going to start out by throwing a stick of dynamite in the works here. There...IS...a dispensational boundary at Acts 28. This concerns the fact you may be arguing the Sabbath from the wrong side of the boundary. Hope nobody got hurt on that one. Before Acts 28 Israel/Jew was still first. The olive tree still stood (Romans 11) and Gentiles were dogs dispensationally. Let me explain.
It is true there is no Jew nor Greek while.... IN CHRIST...BUT.... that does not explain the olive tree and the Gentiles graft in contrary to nature. That shows there is a difference. What... IS...that difference? Well, the fact is that the whole of the book of Acts is not looking Heavenward. That includes the four Gospels. Jesus said so Himself.
Look here:
Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Israel and their Kingdom was in view there. What were the promises made to the fathers? It was an earthly Kingdom where Christ will be the King of Israel. It is to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel He was sent and the Gentile had a prospective outlook to the blessings promised to the nation. They came in as the wild branches. These promises are the root and fatness of the Olive Tree.
After the Cross His aim was for Israel to repent. He gave them every chance in the world. The nation rejected Him at the stoning of Stephen. Then came Paul and his missionary trips to the Jews (still being first) for God was concerned for the scattered as well as the nation. The scattered rejected Him at Rome. It was all or none as far as God was concerned.
At one point in time during the Acts period (Acts 21:21 onward). Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses. He set out to prove he was not doing any such thing by having a fellow circumcised and more. Paul was not a deceiver. He was obeying the law and I dare say the ENTIRE law as much as possible....including the Sabbath days.

At Acts 28 the Olive Tree was hewn to the roots but the roots remain. The promises...WILL...be fulfilled.
Luke 3:8-9
8 Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
9 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Here is Paul"s statement of mission prior to the last meeting with the leaders of the dispersed::
Acts 28:20...for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.
Still earth bound.

The book of Hebrews chapter 11 has the New Jerusalem descending FROM Heaven as a reward for special service including martyrdom. Another sphere of blessings. STILL...not the heaven far above all.

Now. AFTER the last announcement we have a new calling that wipes out...ALL..distinctions between Jew and Gentile.

Acts 28:28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles (Ethnos..Nations) and that they will hear it.

The book of Ephesians and Colossians were next. These two epistles coupled together give full details of this brand new calling and can be considered the charter of our church. This side of Acts 28 we see this:

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Can't fight that can we? This new calling was hid..IN...God and never revealed to the prophets in age time past until revealed exclusively to Paul in 63 AD.

Eph 3:2-9
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me (PAUL) to youward (Gentile ward)
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now (AD 63) revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid.. in ...God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
The Gentiles is elevated to the level of the Jew and are temporarily on the same plane. It was a top secret calling until revealed to Paul. Remember the parable of the patch?

Matt 9:16 No man putteth a piece of new cloth unto an old garment, for that which is put in to fill it up taketh from the garment, and the rent is made worse.
That rent was at Acts 28 and Israel is temporarily Lo-Ammi (Hosea 1:9).
And here is their condition now:
Hos 3:4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince, and without a sacrifice, and without an image, and without an ephod, and without teraphim:

There would be no way to mix any kind of differences in this calling. This calling is to the Heaven far above all where Christ sitteth at the right hand of God. God has a brand new piece of cloth.

Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

Col 3:1-4
1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

On the other side of Acts 28 they are exhorted to:

Heb 10:19-23
19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised

Our calling is already there!!
Eph 2:13-17
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are ...made.... nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

Would you mind putting all these words in a bottom line statement?

 

[from scratch]

Just had to deny the truth.

Really? It says the first day of the week and on the morrow. When is the first day of the week? And what is the morrow?

 

[Elder 111]

Elder 111:

Do you think worshiping on Sunday is the mark of the beast?

Do what I think really count with you? What I know is that Sabbath is God's blessed, sanctified day of rest and worship. The bible teaches that from Genesis to Revelation. No passage sanctifies Sunday or asked that Sunday be a day of worship. You decide.

 

[from scratch]

Do what I think really count with you? What I know is that Sabbath is God's blessed, sanctified day of rest and worship. The bible teaches that from Genesis to Revelation. No passage sanctifies Sunday or asked that Sunday be a day of worship. You decide.

Please answer the question and stop beating the poor bushes.