Atheism

[createdtoworship]

Let's discuss this. This is the quote:

I'm an atheist, and a militant atheist when religion starts impacting on legislation. (Source)

Daniel Radcliffe (the actor who plays Harry Potter in the Harry Potter movies) says in this quote that he's both an atheist and a militant atheist. And note that he's a militant atheist only under certain circumstances. Pay careful attention to what he says those circumstances are.

I'm an atheist, and a militant atheist when religion starts impacting on legislation.

By militant atheist, I take him to mean a politically-motivated atheist. He's political because Christians are political. I don't know his precise political views regarding religion, but he mentions a desire to see more sex education in the schools.

I'm a politically-motivated atheist as well in that I support a strict separation of church and state. I want a legal system that is neutral with respect to the beliefs of the citizenry in the sense that no citizen should have legal privileges based on their views on religion, regardless of whether they personally are theists or atheists.

Now do keep one thing in mind. I'm not an atheist because Christians are political. (Neither is Daniel Radcliffe if you read his quote carefully.) I'm a politically-motivated atheist because Christians are political. I'm an atheist because I see no convincing reason to conclude that a God (or gods or goddesses or anything divine) exists. If Christians had been good citizens and had not attempted to force non-Christians to live by their values, I would simply be an atheist, because I would have no reason to be political about religion.


eudaimonia,

Mark

a quote from an athiest site on the defintion of militant atheism

A militant atheist uses violence to promote atheism or destroy religion. (Often, the term “militant atheist” is misapplied to non-violent evangelical atheists like Richard Dawkins. But to preserve the parallel with the “militant Christian” who bombs abortion clinics or the “militant Muslim” suicide bomber, I prefer the definition of “militant atheist” that assumes acts of violence.)

 

[createdtoworship]

With extreme vigor.


eudaimonia,

Mark

good then you should petition the government "with vigor" to make sure atheists stay out of religious groups like chaplain duties:

a chaplain according to wikipedia is a:

representative of a religion attached to a secular institution such as a hospital, prison, military unit, police department, university, or private chapel.

and maybe email "with vigor" Jason Torpy president of the association of atheists and free thinkers who is trying to mobilize atheist campaigns regarding chaplains....

here is the contact info:

Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers

let me know if this is truly something you will carry out or if you were just pulling my chain.

 

[quatona]

how do you ask before hand

"What´s your position regarding...?", for example.

 

[createdtoworship]

"What´s your position regarding...?", for example.

My position is that Atheism is adhering to a universal negative.....

"there is no God"

That is the definition of athiest yes?

Why not change the name if they are not actually athiest, to agnostic?

 

[quatona]

My position is that Atheism is adhering to a universal negative.....

See, you do it again - although being told multiple times that this is not my position, and what my positions actually are.

"there is no God"

That is the definition of athiest yes?

No.

 

[createdtoworship]

See, you do it again - although being told multiple times that this is not my position, and what my positions actually are.

No.

athiesm according to wikipedia is belief in the absence of a diety


they also state in contrast:


Atheism is contrasted with theism,[6][7] which in its most general form is the belief that at least one deity exists.[7][8]

so yes athiesm means "God does not exist"



here are more dictionaries that say Athiest means "God does not exist"
Atheism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary


noun
a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings.
Origin:
1565–75; < Greek áthe(os) godless + -ist

from

Atheist | Define Atheist at Dictionary.com

atheist - definition of atheist by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

Definition for atheist - Oxford Dictionaries Online (US English)

atheist noun - definition in British English Dictionary & Thesaurus - Cambridge Dictionary Online

 

[Eudaimonist]

a quote from an athiest site on the defintion of militant atheism

A militant atheist uses violence to promote atheism or destroy religion. (Often, the term &#8220;militant atheist&#8221; is misapplied to non-violent evangelical atheists like Richard Dawkins. But to preserve the parallel with the &#8220;militant Christian&#8221; who bombs abortion clinics or the &#8220;militant Muslim&#8221; suicide bomber, I prefer the definition of &#8220;militant atheist&#8221; that assumes acts of violence.)

I agree that Daniel Radcliffe may be misusing the term "militant atheist". I don't use that term to describe myself.

good then you should petition the government "with vigor" to make sure atheists stay out of religious groups like chaplain duties

That doesn't follow. Having atheist chaplains isn't at all the same thing as establishing an atheist religion.

a chaplain according to wikipedia is a:

representative of a religion attached to a secular institution such as a hospital, prison, military unit, police department, university, or private chapel.

Dictionaries only offer common uses of words. It's clear that atheist chaplains would be a special case, and they wouldn't represent any religion. They certainly wouldn't intrude on any religious groups or freedoms, but would instead offer government neutrality to issues of belief.

What you apparently want is government favoritism on matters of belief. I strongly oppose that.

let me know if this is truly something you will carry out or if you were just pulling my chain.

I had never promised anything about chaplains. Your idea that atheist chaplains imply the legal recognition of an atheist religion is entirely your view.

My point was that I would oppose a State giving atheists special privileges because they aren't theists, and I would also oppose government censorship of religious speech or the shutting down of churches. For instance, I would not say that only atheists in the military are entitled to chaplains and that theists are out of luck. I am fighting for your freedoms as much as that of atheists.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Eudaimonist]

"there is no God"

That is the definition of athiest yes?

Nope.

Why not change the name if they are not actually athiest, to agnostic?

Because they are atheists, and there is no reason why they should use your definition.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Eudaimonist]

dp

 

[Eudaimonist]

athiesm according to wikipedia is belief in the absence of a diety

This is how the Wikipedia article on atheism begins. Please read this over very carefully.

Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[2][3] Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist.[3][4][5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[TScott]

a quote from an athiest site on the defintion of militant atheism

A militant atheist uses violence to promote atheism or destroy religion. (Often, the term &#8220;militant atheist&#8221; is misapplied to non-violent evangelical atheists like Richard Dawkins. But to preserve the parallel with the &#8220;militant Christian&#8221; who bombs abortion clinics or the &#8220;militant Muslim&#8221; suicide bomber, I prefer the definition of &#8220;militant atheist&#8221; that assumes acts of violence.)

If I could interject, I don't understand why what you prefer has to do with Mark's views. He just told you how he defines his "militant atheism". What does going to some website have to do with this discussion? I see this in a lot of your posts, Grady, you don't seem to be able to discuss your own views on their own merit and instead always have to get some backup from the web. The web has no authority here or anywhere. It can be a resource, yes but not on subjective matters like this.

 

[createdtoworship]

I agree that Daniel Radcliffe may be misusing the term "militant atheist". I don't use that term to describe myself.

I believe you said you DID use militant athiest to describe yourself.

see post:

573

unless you are changing your mind now?

Dictionaries only offer common uses of words. It's clear that atheist chaplains would be a special case, and they wouldn't represent any religion. They certainly wouldn't intrude on any religious groups or freedoms, but would instead offer government neutrality to issues of belief.

I believe the common definition of chaplain IS religious. In fact they are defined as ministers according to a lot of dictionaries. If an athiest want's to be a chaplain, they have to options. Declare themselves religious, or #2 change the definition of chaplain.

What you apparently want is government favoritism on matters of belief. I strongly oppose that.

I never said that

I had never promised anything about chaplains. Your idea that atheist chaplains imply the legal recognition of an atheist religion is entirely your view.

I never said chaplains were a athiest religion. I said IF they were approved, and they have not been yet.....they would be religious ministers per the definition of chaplain-ship.

My point was that I would oppose a State giving atheists special privileges because they aren't theists, and I would also oppose government censorship of religious speech or the shutting down of churches. For instance, I would not say that only atheists in the military are entitled to chaplains and that theists are out of luck. I am fighting for your freedoms as much as that of atheists.

that was never in question.

 

[createdtoworship]

If I could interject, I don't understand why what you prefer has to do with Mark's views. He just told you how he defines his "militant atheism". What does going to some website have to do with this discussion? I see this in a lot of your posts, Grady, you don't seem to be able to discuss your own views on their own merit and instead always have to get some backup from the web. The web has no authority here or anywhere. It can be a resource, yes but not on subjective matters like this.

comming from someone with a signature like yours, I can imagine why you would say this. However I disagree, One of the largest Christian colleges has 65000 students, only 17,000 are actually at the college, the rest.....internet baby!

 

[createdtoworship]

This is how the Wikipedia article on atheism begins. Please read this over very carefully.

Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[2][3] Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist.[3][4][5]

Atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


eudaimonia,

Mark

sounds like atheism is changing the bars faster than most dictionaries can keep up. What about the oxford dictionary. That is the number one dictionary in many colleges. They say the same thing- atheism is a belief that God does not exist.

 

[createdtoworship]

Nope.



Because they are atheists, and there is no reason why they should use your definition.


eudaimonia,

Mark

dictionary references please?

Don't tell me Wikipedia is the number one resource for you?

Do you know Wikipedia uses normal uneducated individuals to write for them?

 

[Eudaimonist]

I believe you said you DID use militant athiest to describe yourself.

Please re-read post #573.

At no point did I label myself a "militant atheist". In fact, I went out of my way to call myself a politically-motivated atheist, even bolding the term and explaining what I meant.

I believe the common definition of chaplain IS religious.

I don't care about the definition of the word.

#2 change the definition of chaplain.

The definition will likely change with time. English is a living language.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[createdtoworship]

There are also lots of folks who believe everything is false until it is proven positive. Both groups must find it very difficult to learn anything new.

I agree

 

[Eudaimonist]

dictionary references please?

Dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive. I don't care about dictionaries. They don't have any kind of philosophical authority.

The only reason I mentioned Wikipedia is because you had brought up Wikipedia and misrepresented what Wikipedia had said.

Do you know Wikipedia uses normal uneducated individuals to write for them?

Yes, and did you notice the footnotes to other sources?

If you don't like Wikipedia, why did you make a point of mentioning what Wikipedia had said?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[createdtoworship]

Dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive. I don't care about dictionaries.



Yes, and did you notice the footnotes to other sources?


eudaimonia,

Mark

so what does it say in your own words then? Do you even understand it as being three separate comments in the definition you gave? Secondly, why are you quoting a dictionary if you "don't care about dictionaries?"

 

[Eudaimonist]

Secondly, why are you quoting a dictionary if you "don't care about dictionaries?"

YOU brought up Wikipedia and other dictionaries. I was pointing out your misunderstanding.

so what does it say in your own words then?

Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[2][3] Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist.[3][4][5]

See the bolded part, especially what is in red. It is so clearly worded there just isn't any point to putting that in my own words.

Do you even understand it as being three separate comments in the definition you gave?

Yes, I do. Do you? Did you notice the words "in a broad sense", "in a narrow sense", and "most inclusively"? What do those words mean to you?


eudaimonia,

Mark