• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Is Hillary Clinton In Violation Of The Espionage Act Regarding Her Private Servers And Devices In Handling "Top Secret" Information?

Hillary Clinton was in lawful possession of "Top Secret" information, she through gross negligence permitted this to be removed from its proper place of custody, and put on her private unsecure servers, computers, and mobile phones "Fact"

Hillary Clinton had full knowledge that this "Top Secret" information was removed from its proper place of custody, and placed on the private insecure devices mentioned above

Hillary Clinton was/is in violation of The Federal Espionafe Act, Section18 U.S. Code 793 (f) punishable by fine or maximum sentence of 10 years in prison, or both

18 U.S. Code § 793 - Gathering, transmitting or losing defense information​


(f) Whoever, being entrusted with or having lawful possession or control of any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, instrument, appliance, note, or information, relating to the national defense, (1) through gross negligence permits the same to be removed from its proper place of custody or delivered to anyone in violation of his trust, or to be lost, stolen, abstracted, or destroyed, or (2) having knowledge that the same has been illegally removed from its proper place of custody or delivered to anyone in violation of its trust, or lost, or stolen, abstracted, or destroyed, and fails to make prompt report of such loss, theft, abstraction, or destruction to his superior officer—
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both.

FBI.GOV NEWS​

Statement by FBI Director James B. Comey on the Investigation of Secretary Hillary Clinton’s Use of a Personal E-Mail System​

From the group of 30,000 e-mails returned to the State Department, 110 e-mails in 52 e-mail chains have been determined by the owning agency to contain classified information at the time they were sent or received. Eight of those chains contained information that was Top Secret at the time they were sent; 36 chains contained Secret information at the time; and eight contained Confidential information, which is the lowest level of classification.

For example, seven e-mail chains concern matters that were classified at the Top Secret/Special Access Program level when they were sent and received. These chains involved Secretary Clinton both sending e-mails about those matters and receiving e-mails from others about the same matters. There is evidence to support a conclusion that any reasonable person in Secretary Clinton’s position, or in the position of those government employees with whom she was corresponding about these matters, should have known that an unclassified system was no place for that conversation. In addition to this highly sensitive information, we also found information that was properly classified as Secret by the U.S. Intelligence Community at the time it was discussed on e-mail (that is, excluding the later “up-classified” e-mails).

None of these e-mails should have been on any kind of unclassified system, but their presence is especially concerning because all of these e-mails were housed on unclassified personal servers not even supported by full-time security staff, like those found at Departments and Agencies of the U.S. Government—or even with a commercial service like Gmail.

We also assess that Secretary Clinton’s use of a personal e-mail domain was both known by a large number of people and readily apparent. She also used her personal e-mail extensively while outside the United States, including sending and receiving work-related e-mails in the territory of sophisticated adversaries. Given that combination of factors, we assess it is possible that hostile actors gained access to Secretary Clinton’s personal e-mail account.
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Idolatrous Worship of Institutions

1 John 4:1-6 ESV

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

Random Thoughts?

Sometimes what seems like random things just come into my mind seemingly out of nowhere. Yesterday was one of those days, and what was coming to mind was the alma maters (anthems) from the two Junior High Schools I attended, and the one from my high school, back in the 1960s. But the only one I was remembering the lyrics for was the one from 7th grade from 1962/63. And I am not going to quote the lyrics, but I am going to mention some of the words and phrases, for it fits with this passage.

I will begin by saying that sometimes what I think are just random thoughts are actually prompted by the Lord for a reason because he is going to use them as an illustration to go along with a bible lesson, and I believe this is the case with this particular song. For this passage of Scripture is about testing the spirits, and as I read back over the lyrics to this alma mater I could see that it was filled with messages of idolatry. For the song was literally a song of praise and worship to the school, I believe.

The song began with an “all hail” to the school, followed by “we sing your praises,” and a wish for the qualities and character traits of that institution to ever be shining on our face. And then there was a prayer to God that we would be loyal to the school and that we would share in its wisdom and pride, that this is how we should live. And then there was the message that God was giving some sort of respect and honor to the school, as well, from best as I can recall and understand what the lyrics are saying.

And that brings to mind our national pledge of allegiance here in America to our nation and its government, and with a similar idolatrous message:

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”

For a pledge is a vow or a promise or an oath, and allegiance is loyalty, devotion, fidelity, and obedience. Are we to obey our governing authorities? Yes, but with biblical exceptions and limitations and as a matter of law and not of undying loyalty and devotion. For words such as “faithfulness, devotion, allegiance, trustworthiness, fidelity, and steadfastness” are words which are to describe our relationship to God, not to man. No man and no human institution should get that kind of worship, for that is what that is.

And then, in both the alma mater from my Junior High School and the pledge of allegiance to my nation, there is the message that somehow God puts his stamp of approval on this kind of idolatry, and not just approval, but as though God honors these human institutions which are promoting idolatrous worship of themselves. And in the pledge it suggests that we are one nation under the one true God, as though our nation is a godly nation serving the one true God, and we can see that is not true.

In Context

But before I move forward with this, I want to say that we must also be careful in how we interpret the Scriptures, that we read them in their immediate context, such as the whole of the book in which they are written, and then in the context of the teachings of the New Covenant, as a whole. For Scripture passages pulled out of context can be made to say what they don’t say. And I think we talked about this a little bit within the last week, too.

For it is not verbal confessions of Jesus as having come from God alone which determine whether or not the speaker is of God or not. And this is evident when we read the Scriptures warning us about false teachers and prophets who come to us in sheep’s clothing but who inwardly are ravenous wolves. So, not only will nations claim to be of God when they are not of God, but people will profess with their lips their beliefs in Jesus but not be of true faith in Christ at all.

For remember that Satan’s servants will disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. And so many of them are going to confess with their lips their belief in Jesus so that Christians will listen to them and so that they have the opportunity to insert lies into the truth in order to deceive people. And the antichrists are those who deny Jesus by how they live while many of them profess him with their lips in order to gain the trust of the people so that they can lie to them and so the people will believe their lies.

So, we can’t just go by what someone professes with their lips in the way of confessions of faith in Jesus, but what we go by is if their lifestyles match their profession. For like this says, they are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. So, we watch how they live, in practice, and we listen to what they teach, in doctrine, and we examine their practices and their teachings against the Scriptures to see if they agree with the Scriptures.

Testing the Spirits

So, going back to the alma mater and the pledge of allegiance, we need to be discerning people there, too, and we must be careful that we don’t just go along with someone or some institution because that is what we were taught as children, or because that person or that institution is in a position of rule and authority over us. We must be people who test what we hear against the Scriptures, particularly those under the New Covenant, and in context, to see if what we are being taught agrees with God’s Word.

So, above all else our loyalty and devotion and fidelity must be to God and to God alone. So, if anyone is trying to lead us to give our worship and undying and unquestioning devotion to anyone else, we must stand back and look at what the Scriptures teach, particularly on this subject of idolatry and of putting our trust in human beings. For no human being and no human institution should get our praise and worship and loyalty and devotion like we are to give to God alone.

And where we are taught to obey human authorities we obey unless what they are asking us to do contradicts God’s will for our lives, or when it becomes idolatrous, or when they command that we disobey God. For we are living in a world now where the beast is rising, I believe, and where we are going to be pressured more and more to compromise faith and convictions in order to comply with what is not of God. And so we need to be people who test everything and everyone, but against the truth of the Scriptures in their context, so that we are not led astray.

Testing the Spirits: [Matthew 7:15-23; Matthew 24:11-14; John 10:1-15; 2 Corinthians 11:13-15; Philippians 3:2; 2 Peter 2:1-22; 1 Timothy 1:3-7; 1 Timothy 6:3-10; 2 Timothy 3:1-9; 1 John 4:1-6; Jude 1:1-25]

No Less

An Original Work / March 19, 2012

I can do no less than praise You,
Lord, for all You’ve done for me.
You died for my sins to save me,
So I would be set free.
I adore You! Lord, I praise You!
Jesus, Savior, King of kings!
You provided my redemption.
Your grace has pardoned me.

I can do no less than serve You.
Lord, Your witness I would be,
Telling others of Your love,
And why You died on that tree.
Tell of how You gave of Your life,
So from sin we’d be set free,
So we could worship You forever,
And live eternally.

I can do no less than love You,
Lord, for You have first loved me.
You gave of Your life so willing,
Because You cared for me.
Turn from my sin! Obey freely!
Live for You each passing day.
Read Your word, and follow Your lead,
Lord, as I humbly pray.

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A trans contestant wins Miss Netherlands - and one look at the faces of the runners-up reveals what women REALLY think... but don't dare say…

Add beauty pageants to the list of women's spaces that are no longer, well, women's spaces.

The new Miss Netherlands, crowned on Saturday, is a transgender model named Rikkie Valerie Kollé.

Kollé's next stop: the Miss Universe pageant, now owned by transgender Thai business mogul Anne Jakrajutatip.

And we biological women are expected to cheer, to be exhilarated by this latest theft.

Take a look at the faces of the runners-up.

More than a few look as if they're in shock. Rightly so. Women in beauty pageants have every expectation of losing — to another woman. But to a biological male? Who has invaded yet another event that, in its very founding and mission statement, is specific to women?

This is not to disparage Kollé herself. She changed her name at age 11, from Rik to Rikkie, and said she suffered constant bullying, often coming home from school in tears.

Shortly before she was crowned Miss Netherlands, Kollé said no matter the outcome, she had already won.

'As a little boy I conquered all things that came through my path and look at me now,' she said. 'Standing here, as a strong, empowering and confident trans woman. Love is love. Be who you want to be and never forget – always celebrate your pride.'

Continued below.

Deut. chapter 6 greatest thing for youth to learn.

In these changing times where there is so many changes made in bible believes, one scriptural passage remains the same. Deut. 6: though it is not Mosaic law and commandments, it is love the Lord God and obey him. it was required by all persons in O.T. and N.T. to know the Lord God is one Lord and God. 6:5 Deut. meant with everything you are and have. One example-- is 90% of your day on the cell phone . 5% on computer or TV. 5% eating bath etc. I am only guessing %s If in church listening to preacher telling politics or things happening in the world. maybe 2 scriptures. When parents are so busy and they are good parents no less, don't have time to read to you. If you give God your time, he will give it back to you in a amazing way.

Do we choose to turn to God when we first become Christians?

Do we choose to repent when we first become Christians?

I am talking about the initial repentance when you first become a Christian. In this post, by repent I mean simply turn to God.

Jesus commanded everyone to repent, Mark 1:
15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”​

Acts 17:
30b [God] commands all people everywhere to repent.​

God wants everyone to repent, 2 Peter 3:
9b he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.​

1 Timothy 2:
4 [God] desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.​

However, people choose not to repent, Revelation 2:
21 Even though I have given her time to repent of her immorality, she is unwilling.​

Do we choose to repent?

Yes, we choose to repent and we choose not to repent. If we can only choose not to repent, then it is not a choice.

Now, there is a spiritual warfare going on, 2 Timothy 2:
25b God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, 26 and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.​

There is a bit of controversy about this but I see the original Greek as potential subjunctive: God may or may not grant them repentance.

Acts 11:
18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, “Well then, God has also granted to the Gentiles the repentance that leads to life.”​

Does God choose to grant repentance?

Yes, God grants repentance to some and not to others.

Yes, people choose to repent or not to repent.

Both are true. This is the concept of Co-Reality.

See also Repentance: Initial and subsequent.

Help please.

Theres this girl I really super like. And I know she likes me back. However heres the scary part, about a year ago my ocd made me pray to satan to make her love me, and that she would confess to me within five days. And that exact thing happened.
Now she and I are thinking about dating, and I really want to, but this is just hanging over my head. I dont know what to do.

Jordan sends budget recommendations to Appropriations, would move FBI to Alabama

House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jim Jordan sent several fiscal 2024 recommendations to the House Appropriations Committee, including one that would relocate the FBI to Huntsville, Alabama.

The Ohio Republican gave Rep. Kay Granger, Texas Republican and the Appropriations chairwoman, the list of requests that had been generated from the work of GOP lawmakers on Judiciary and its Select Subcommittee on the Weaponization of the Federal Government.

Mr. Jordan suggested that the best way to rein in abusive federal law enforcement agencies is to eliminate any funding for the FBI that is “not absolutely essential for the agency to execute its mission.”

“We ask that the Appropriations Committee include language in the Justice Department appropriations bill prohibiting retaliation against FBI whistleblowers, including by prohibiting taxpayer dollars from being used to pay the salary of any Justice Department or FBI employee who is found to have retaliated against a whistleblower,” Mr. Jordan wrote.

What Year was America Great?

Make America Great Again is an political slogan used by many conservatives over the last 7 years. I have yet to hear someone say what year or years they're talking about.
The history of this country is at it's birth Europeans created Laws making them white with privileges and people from the larger continent of Africa black with disadvantages. Laws giving whites the right to own another human as property. They enforced these Laws with extreme violence and white society's acceptance.
Many of these discrimination Laws lasted till the late 1960s. The bible teaches kidnapping a person to sell them is a sin worthy of death to the seller and buyer. We as Christians know most of our forefathers weren't true men of God by owning theses kidnapped humans. The secular world standards holds Abraham Lincoln as the greatest American, but biblical standards would view Lincoln different. From his writings we clearly see Abraham Lincoln didn't want to free the slaves for some godly moral reason, he was a white racist. Racism/hate is the opposite of love and God is love. Our forefathers and society practiced the opposite of loving your neighbors and doing unto others as you would have them do unto you. We did have a few true God believing and decent people back then that spoke up, but as a whole we failed miserably.

In our country conservatives have been on the wrong side of our moral history, slavery, Civil War, reconstruction, Jim Crow, segregation, lynching laws, Civil Rights, women suffrage, child labor laws, Voters Rights, Hitler and his white supremacy policies, the list goes on. So conservatives have been on the wrong side of our moral history almost 100% of the time.

I love this country, I see it's gotten better and believe it can be great.

But can anyone who believes America was great tell us what year that was?

The Sound of Freedom

This movie came out July 4. It's based on a true story of one piece of Tim Ballard's work hunting down sex traffickers and the like and capturing/arresting them, after he'd been working for at least a decade with the Department of Homeland Security.

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I haven't seen it because I can't handle the subject matter. It's too upsetting for me, but I think it's important to have this out. As they say, shine a light on the darkness. Somehow find a way to help these children.

What is also disturbing and horrible is the main stream magazines and news slamming on this story, saying it was made up, says Jim Caviezel and Tim Ballard are QAnon, conspiracy theorists. No matter that it's a true story. I don't know if you all have ever listened to Jim Caviezel speak, whether as a guest speaker on important matters of God and Christianity (albeit from a Catholic perspective, but still), and his deep faith. There's no doubt he's a devout Christian.

In any case, I was wondering what you all thought and has anybody seen this movie yet? Thanks in advance.
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Scientology sued by worker who says she was forced (at 16) to marry her abuser

After Church of Scientology officials learned in 1991 that a 16-year-old religious worker claimed to have been sexually assaulted, they failed to report the allegations to police and instead arranged for the girl to marry her abuser, according to a lawsuit unsealed last week in Los Angeles County Superior Court.

The complaint against Scientology leader David Miscavige, recruiter Gavin Potter and three church entities alleges that the organization created a culture where sexual abuse was enabled by policies written by founder L. Ron Hubbard.

The lawsuit was filed on behalf of a woman identified as Jane Doe, who said Scientology officials facilitated Potter’s sexual abuse after he convinced her as a teenager to remain in Scientology’s full-time workforce called the Sea Org. She is now in her late 40s.

Due to policies regarding sexual contact between Sea Org members, the lawsuit alleges that Doe and Potter were given the choice to go to a prisonlike work camp for five years or be married. Because a judge in California would have had to sign off on the marriage of a minor, the lawsuit alleges that Doe’s “port captain” arranged for Doe and Potter to travel to Las Vegas to be married.

The plaintiff in the unsealed lawsuit is one of the women who sued Scientology and Miscavige in 2019 on claims that church officials stalked and harassed them after reporting to Los Angeles police that they had been raped by actor and Scientology parishioner Danny Masterson. That lawsuit is ongoing. Last month, Masterson was convicted of two counts of rape in the related criminal case and is scheduled to be sentenced Aug. 4.

Are there still apostles today?

What was an apostle in the Bible?

There were three categories of apostles in the Bible. The first referred exclusively to the Twelve, Revelation 21:
14 The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles [G652] of the Lamb.​

Strong's 652: From apostello; a delegate; specially, an ambassador of the Gospel; officially a commissioner of Christ.

G652 appears 80 times. It is a rather common word.

The second category included some prominent disciples commissioned by the Holy Spirit, Acts 13:
2 While they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”​

And they were recognized as such, Acts 14:
14 when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of this, they tore their clothes and rushed out into the crowd, shouting:​

The third category included some lesser-known and generic apostles who were sent forth with orders by churches, Berean Literal Bible, 2 Corinthians 8:
23 Whether as regards Titus, he is my partner and fellow worker for you; or our brothers, they are apostles [G652] of the churches, the glory of Christ.​

Are there still apostles today?

Sure, 1 Corinthians 12:
1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be uninformed.​

27 Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it. 28 And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues. … 31 But earnestly desire the higher gifts.​

Apostles are one of the higher gifts of the Holy Spirit, But be warned. Paul wrote in the follow-up letter, 2 Corinthians 11:
12 what I am doing I will continue to do, in order to undermine the claim of those who would like to claim that in their boasted mission they work on the same terms as we do. 13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.​

You need to test their claim. Who sends them? What are the signs to prove that they are apostles?

Personally in Toronto, I encountered a man who claimed to be an apostle. He was sent by a church/denomination. I am not under that particular denomination's authority. I have no obligation to accept his authority. Neither did I accuse him of being a false apostle.

When does soul life begin in the womb?

For a technical definition of soul, see What happens to your soul when you die?.

When does human soul life begin?

American Standard Version, Genesis 2:
7 And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.​

It seems that when a fetus receives a (detached) breath from God, it becomes a living soul.

English Standard Version, Ecclesiastes 11:
5 As you do not know the way the spirit comes to the bones in the womb of a woman with child, so you do not know the work of God who makes everything.​

Psalm 139:
13 For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother’s womb. 14I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul [H5315 nephesh] knows it very well.​

Ensoulment:
In the time of Aristotle, it was widely believed that the human soul entered the forming body at 40 days (male embryos) or 90 days (female embryos), and quickening was an indication of the presence of a soul. Other religious views are that ensoulment happens at the moment of conception; or when the child takes the first breath after being born;[1][2] at the formation of the nervous system and brain; at the first detectable sign of brain activity; or when the fetus is able to survive independently of the uterus (viability).[3]​

When does consciousness begin?

According to this Scientific American article:
Consciousness requires a sophisticated network of highly interconnected components, nerve cells. Its physical substrate, the thalamo-cortical complex that provides consciousness with its highly elaborate content, begins to be in place between the 24th and 28th week of gestation.​

Elizabeth was pregnant for about half a year, Luke 1:
41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.​

Wiki:
Some early Christians believed that the embryo did not have a soul from conception,[11][18][19][20] and consequently, opinion was divided as to whether or not early abortion was murder or ethically equivalent to murder.[13][17]​

When does the human soul begin?

It seems to be somewhere between the time of conception to the time of full-term birth. If we don't know whether a fetus has soul life, is it okay to terminate it?

Are sinful thoughts my own?

Listened to a conversation on YouTube today between two men, one said something that was quite illuminating to me, that many of his thoughts and emotions could be said to be that of demons, and not him exactly, something his priest had told him if I remember correctly. That it made it easy for him to just laugh it all off in a way and return to a good conscience. I would love being able to do this.

Perhaps you guys could share some of your wisdom on this, as I do sometimes find myself quite overwhelmed with the things in my head. Would good theology be, that we're completely free, that these thoughts aren't our own in some sense? Or are they indeed ours, but we're still washed clean by the blood of Jesus? How do you guys 'protect' your conscience and stay joyful? How do you get going, and not let the mood hang downtrodden for too long, after such puzzling thoughts, if they do ever occur to you?

Biden accused of breaching protocol


World leaders and celebrities have long been stumped by rules to observe in front of members of the Royal Family.​
Though the royal website does not share much about these traditions, there was much speculation the leader broke them when placing his hand on the back of His Majesty.​
He was also spotted walking at least two steps in front of Charles – a big faux-pas​

Is aborting a baby murder?

Exodus 20:13 New International Version:
You shall not murder.​

LXX:
Οὐ φονεύσεις [G5407].​

Is aborting a baby murder?

The author of the Didache (1st century AD) thought so, Didache 2:
2 ου φονευσεις [G5407], ου μοιχευσεις, ου παιδοφθορησεις, ου πορνευσεις, ου κλεψεις, ου μαγευσεις, ου φαρμακευσεις, ου **φονευσεις τεκνον** εν φθορα ουδε γεννηθεν αποκτενεις.​

not you will murder , not you will do adultry , not you will do child sex, not you will do illicit sex, not you will steal , not you will do magic, not you will do sorcery , not you will murder child to destruction neither newly begotten in the womb you will kill.​

Lightfoot translated the Greek into the English "abortion":

{Thou shalt do no murder, thou shalt not commit adultery,} thou shalt not corrupt boys, thou shalt not commit fornication, {thou shalt not steal,} thou shalt not deal in magic, thou shalt do no sorcery, thou shalt not murder a child by abortion nor kill them when born,​

Elsewhere in Numbers 5:
27 If she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse. 28 If, however, the woman has not made herself impure, but is clean, she will be cleared of guilt and will be able to have children.​

Did God cause abortion in this case?

I think the issue is more complex than simply the two extreme positions of pro-life and pro-choice. See When does soul life begin in the womb?.
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Can/should a Christian have meaningful friendships with non-Christians? What limits should there be with non-Christian friendships?

I've been battling with this question for a long time now and I can't seem to find a definite answer to it. I can pull out any number of verses that speaks of the mind and the character of a person that denies the sovereignty of God and rejects the Messiah. I can find an equal amount of verses that speak to the fellowship that we have with fellow believers and our family that is brought together through Christ. What we can find throughout the bible, and in the Epistles in particular, is that there is without a doubt a very certain and specific divide between those that accept the almighty God and his will and those who have no part in it. I have been trying to research this matter for a while. What I am usually met with the quote from Jesus in the book of Matthew (Matthew 12:30), “It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick; I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” With this, I often find discussions of the commission.
This particular dilemma does not involve the above, though. I have friends (two, in particular, I've known for well over a decade) that simply want nothing to do with God. My religious talks fall on deaf ears, mockery, and so on for so many people in my life and I am just not certain what I should do about it. On one hand, I could remain friends with them, and continue in my duties on earth to preach the gospel to them in hopes that one day they will turn to Him. This seems like the answer. However at least half of them resent me for it, and a quarter mock me for my faith. It seems like when a conversation involves religious matters it goes south. Some part of me wants to say, "I've done my part, I should move on and give my time to others" and another part of me wants to hold on to these people many that I have known for so long.

I'm at the point now with this that I just want to know what the biblical thing to do is. I feel like there is a case to be made with either decision but I also can recognize that there are emotions involved with this that may cloud my judgment. If anyone can give me any advice I would appreciate it.

We Should Love One Another

1 John 3:11-16 ESV

“For this is the message that you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another. We should not be like Cain, who was of the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his own deeds were evil and his brother's righteous. Do not be surprised, brothers, that the world hates you. We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brothers. Whoever does not love abides in death. Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. By this we know love, that he laid down his life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brothers.”

The love that we are to have for one another comes from God who is love. It is a love that is centered in moral preference and which prefers what God prefers, which is everything that is holy, righteous, godly, honest, morally pure, upright, and faithful. And when we love God in this way or when we are loving other people in this way, we are preferring to live through Christ and to embrace God’s will and to choose his choices, obeying them through his power (source: biblehub.com interlinear).

Therefore, when we are loving others with this kind of love, we are going to choose to say to them and do to them and for them what we believe is ultimately for their good, as God defines good. And we will not deliberately, habitually, nor premeditatedly do what is evil or sinful against them. This, however, is not a claim to sinless perfection. But it does have to do with the choice of our wills to do what we believe and know is right and to not do evil to other people. So, we may not love perfectly, but we should love sincerely.

And we have a good example given to us here of what this kind of love should not look like. We have the example of Cain. And Cain was the firstborn son of Adam and Eve who were the first humans God created. Their second born son was Abel. Abel was a keeper of the sheep and Cain was a worker of the ground. In the course of time they each brought an offering to the Lord. The Lord accepted Abel’s offering, but he rejected Cain’s, so Cain was very angry with God.

“The Lord said to Cain, ‘Why are you angry, and why has your face fallen? If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is contrary to you, but you must rule over it.’ Cain spoke to Abel his brother. And when they were in the field, Cain rose up against his brother Abel and killed him” (Genesis 4:6-8 ESV).

And why did he murder him? Because his own deeds were evil and his brother’s righteous. So, how do the Scriptures differentiate between those who are evil and those who are righteous? It all comes down to what we practice, i.e. our lifestyles. For if sin is what we practice (deliberately and habitually), and if righteousness, godliness, and obedience to our Lord are not what we practice, we are not of God. And it is those who practice righteousness (of God) who are righteous in the sight of God.

So, when this says here that we are not to be surprised if the world hates us, and this comes right on the heels of the example of Cain, what I believe this is saying is not only should we not be like Cain, but we should not be surprised if other people treat us like Cain treated his brother. And we should not be surprised even if other professing Christians treat us like Cain treated his brother, and that they may turn against us because their deeds are evil and because we are walking in holiness and in righteousness, in practice.

For Jesus told us that if we follow him with our lives that we will be hated and persecuted as he was hated and persecuted. And who were those who hated and persecuted him? They were rulers and people of influence in the temple of God, many of whom were also teachers of the law and of the prophets, and who professed faith in the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. And that God, the only true God, is Father, Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit – one God with three distinct personalities and functions.

So, our persecutors, as well, could be those professing faith in Jesus Christ but who are walking in sin and not in righteousness and holiness. And so they won’t like it if what we are sharing is the truth of the gospel of our salvation, for many of them are buying into a diluted and altered gospel message which is placating them in their sins and which appeals to human flesh, and so they don’t accept that they must die with Christ to sin and walk in his holiness and righteousness, in his power and strength.

Now, going back to the subject of agape love, we who are genuine followers of Jesus Christ are to be those who abide in love and who love each other with this love which comes from God. And if we do not love with this kind of love, then we abide in death, not in eternal life with God. And again, this kind of love being spoken of here gives preference to God and to what he prefers, i.e. to what is holy, righteous, and godly. And we are not to be like Cain who murdered his brother because his brother’s deeds were righteous and his own deeds were evil.

But we who are following Jesus Christ with our lives, in practice, must be willing to lay down our lives for others to see them be free from their slavery to sin and to walk with God in holiness and in righteousness, in his power and strength and wisdom. But when we are sharing the truth of the gospel, as Jesus and his NT apostles taught it, we are going to have enemies, and not just those making no profession of faith in Christ, but also some who profess to believe in Jesus but who are not living the faith they profess.

[Matt 5:10-12; Matt 10:16-25; Matt 24:9-14; Lu 6:22-23; Lu 21:12-19; Jn 15:1-21; Jn 16:33; Jn 17:14; Ac 14:22; Rom 5:3-5; Phil 3:7-11; 1 Pet 1:6-7; 1 Pet 4:12-17; 2 Tim 3:12; 1 Thess 3:1-5; Jas 1:2-4; 2 Co 1:3-11; Heb 12:3-12; 1 Jn 3:13; Rev 6:9-11; Rev 7:9-17; Rev 11:1-3; Rev 12:17; Rev 13:1-18; Rev 14:1-13]

Give Them All to Jesus

Phil Johnson / Bob Benson Sr. 1975

He never said you'd only see sunshine.
He never said there'd be no rain.
He only promised a heart full of singing
About the very things that once brought pain..

Shattered dreams, wounded hearts, and broken toys.
Give them all, give them all,
Give them all to Jesus,
And He will turn your sorrows into joy.

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Great quotes that will drive you to tell others the Gospel.

I have been collecting a few quotes over the last couple of years that are really good quotes for either sharing the Gospel, about the Gospel or they have something to do with repentance.
Please feel free to add to the list by making a post.

The great commission is not an option to be considered. It is a command to be obeyed. Hudson Taylor

We shall have all eternity to celebrate our victories, but we have only one swift hour before the sun sets in which to win them. Robert Moffatt

If their houses were on fire, you would run and help them. And will you not help them when their souls are almost at the fire of hell Richard Baxter

It has always been difficult to understand those evangelical Christians who…say they serve the Lord, but they divide their days as to leave plenty of time to play and relax and enjoy the pleasures of this world. They are at ease while the world burns. A. W. Tozer

The world is not so much hardened to the gospel as it is ignorant of the Gospel. Because the gospel is not being preached. Paul Washer

Being an extrovert isn’t essential to evangelism. Obedience and Love are.

Evangelism should not be measured by the counting of conversions, but by the proclamation of the Gospel.

Jesus died for sinners. Cannot we live for them? Charles Spurgeon

The early disciples were fishers of men. While Modern disciples are often little more than aquarium keepers.

We talk of the second coming; half the world has never heard of the first. Oswald J Smith

It is a sad testimony to our lack of love that we had to be commanded to preach the Gospel to every creature. Ray Comfort

If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for. Charles Spurgeon

The greatest sound of praise is the sound of feet taking the Gospel to the lost.

If your Gospel isn’t touching others, it hasn’t touched you.

Churches that have lost their heart for evangelism are living out their last chapter. Anthony G Pappas

The only alternative to soulwinning is disobedience to God. Curtis Hutson

“We are saved by faith and grace alone, but we will be judged by works” John Mcarthur

To evangelise, does not mean to win converts. But simply to announce the Good News irrespective of the results. John Stott

If you downplay the radical depravity of man, then you downplay the Glory of the Gospel. Paul Washer

If you are fearful to share your faith, don’t pray for less fear, pray for more love. Ray Comfort

Preaching that downplays Gods wrath does not enhance true evangelism, it undermines it. John Mcarthur

Repentance is not a work. It is a change of the heart. A change of the mind. Just like faith has works or it is dead, so too repentance has works. Bringing forth fruit worthy of repentance. So, if you have truly repented, then your emotions, your actions, your will, everything will change. Paul Washer

"Doctor. You are too delicate to tell the man that he is ill. You hope to heal the sick without their knowing it. You therefore flatter them. Your delicacy is cruelty, your flatteries are poisons you are a murderer. Shall we keep men in a fool's paradise? Shall we lull them into soft slumber from which they will awake in hell? Are we to become helpers of their damnation by our smooth speeches? In the name of God we will not." Charles Spurgeon

The Gospel is not something to be hoarded. But rather something to be shared Ray Comfort

Have you no wish for others to be saved? Then you’re not saved yourself. Be sure of that! Charles Spurgeon

Lower the Law and you dim the light by which man perceives his guilt; this lessens the likelihood of his conviction and conversion. If you set the law aside, you deprive the gospel of its most powerful weapon; that is the rebuke that brings men to Christ. Therefore, the Law serves a most necessary purpose, and it must not be removed from its place. Charles Spurgeon

The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who proclaim it. George Orwell

Judge not unless you be judged. Twist not the scripture lest ye be like satin.

You are willing to save yourself, but you do not love your neighbour enough to warn him of Gods wrath to come. Instead, you bless him with acts of kindness. If he joins the fellowship, what was his reasoning? Friendship or has he come under the grace of God?

“Your testimony is not the Gospel.” R. C. Sproul

The highest service that men may attain to on earth is to preach the word of God. John Wycliffe

“Evermore the Law must prepare the way for the gospel. To overlook this in instructing souls is almost certain to result in false hope, the introduction of a false standard of Christian experience, and to fill the church with false converts.” Charles Finny

If there is no sorrow in a person after you have told them the Gospel, it is because of the lack of knowledge as to God’s law.

As pastors, we encouraged our people, we didn’t equip them. The Five Fold Ministries job is to equip the saints. Not to pamper them. We were so happy that we had a crowd that we forgot that we have an assignment to raise an army.

"I’ve always said that I don’t respect people who don’t proselytize. I don’t respect that at all. If you believe that there’s a heaven and a hell, and people could be going to hell or not getting eternal life, and you think that it’s not really worth telling them this because it would make it socially awkward—and atheists who think people shouldn’t proselytize and who say just leave me along and keep your religion to yourself—how much do you have to hate somebody to not proselytize? How much do you have to hate somebody to believe everlasting life is possible and not tell them that? I mean, if I believed, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that a truck was coming at you, and you didn’t believe that truck was bearing down on you, there is a certain point where I tackle you. And this is more important than that.” Penn Jillette

If you know of everlasting life, and you know of everlasting death, how much do you have to hate somebody to not tell them of it? Penn Jillette (Altered)

Could a mariner sit idle if he heard the drowning cry? Could a doctor sit in comfort and just let his patients die? Could a fireman sit idle, let men burn and give no hand? Can you sit at ease in Zion with the world around you damned?” Leonard Ravenhill

It is easier to denature plutonium than it is to denature the evil spirit of man. Only God can change the evil spirit in man. He can take a hateful heart and replace it with love. That is the fruit of genuine conversion. Ray Comfort.

The Law produces terror but the Cross produces contrition. Ray Comfort

Churches need to be warned. Your activity not only reflects upon you. It reflects upon God. So, if you are in the world, stop it. If you are living for yourself; cease and turn back to Him in repentance and faith. Paul Washer

Logging truck analogy

If I was to say that on my way here, I stood on the road was hit by a logging truck doing 100 miles an hour, you would say, “That’s absolutely absurd. It is impossible to have an encounter with something as large as a logging truck and not be changed."
And then my question would be to you what is larger, a logging truck or God.
How is it that so many people today profess to have had an encounter with Jesus Christ and yet they are not permanently changed. Paul Washer

Short Trinity 5 sermon (Luke 5:1-11)

Hey, here's my sermon from last Sunday!

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5th Sunday After Trinity
A brief sermon from our English services at Kitaosaka Evangelical Lutheran Church
(Pre-recorded for web)

The Rejected Stone
Lutheran Church
Osaka, Japan


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