WWJD Did Jesus Pray to Mary?

[disciple Clint]

DO you truly believe that Jesus only knew of the widow's pain ... because He was the son of a widow ?

Do you truly believe that Jesus (even in His humanity) ... was so disconnected from the sorrows we bear ?

Jesus also touched lepers. Did He have close relatives who were lepers (so as to understand their pain) ?

Jesus healed the blind, the lame, the devil-possessed, etc. Did He have to LEARN to feel compassion for ALL of these ?

No I believe that He raised to woman's son because He had compassion for her, he was moved by her circumstances, He can bless who He decides to bless, it has nothing to do with being a respecter of persons.

 

[A_Thinker]

No I believe that He raised to woman's son because He had compassion for her, he was moved by her circumstances, He can bless who He decides to bless, it has nothing to do with being a respecter of persons.

I agree ...

 

[adderbolt]

You do ask others to pray for you dont you?

Yes and others ask if they can pray for me at various times.

But all that will stop when I die and Mary died almost two thousand years ago.

 

[disciple Clint]

Yes and others ask if they can pray for me at various times.

But all that will stop when I die and Mary died almost two thousand years ago.

But you are going to have eternal life and so is she.

 

[adderbolt]

But you are going to have eternal life and so is she.

How in the world are you in possession of the knowledge concerning the makeup of God's remnant here on earth and his invisible church in Heaven?

 

[Hammster]

I take that as a no.

And you’d be wrong to do so. You made a weak argument. It would be like you posting John 3:16 and saying that it made your point, and when I ask how, you challenging me to prove how it doesn’t.

If you can show how those verses prove your point, then do so.

 

[Hammster]

Sigh...

Since Jesus is our king, not our buddy or our bestie, Mary as His Mother is the Queen Mother. In a monarchy, one way to gain the king's ear was to speak to his mother. We even see this in the wedding at Cana. So we ARE following an example from Scripture.

Who asked Mary to talk to Jesus?

 

[A_Thinker]

Since Jesus is our king, not our buddy or our bestie, ...

Jesus is our friend ... and brother ... and King ... and Lord ... and Saviour ...

John 15

13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command. 15 I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

She simply intercedes to Jesus. Tradition has it that this was the wedding of St. Simon the Zealot. She is not only present as a guest at the wedding; but as someone with a role in the first miracle of our Lord Jesus Christ.

"The Holy Bible does not record St. Mary present at the performance of any of her Son's miracles except at Cana and later on at the Cross. It is as if the Divine inspiration had destined for the Mother of Salvation to see her Son pour His love to humanity both on a small scale at the wedding and at a large scale on the Cross." (Coptic website)

 

[Hammster]

She simply intercedes to Jesus. Tradition has it that this was the wedding of St. Simon the Zealot. She is not only present as a guest at the wedding; but as someone with a role in the first miracle of our Lord Jesus Christ.

"The Holy Bible does not record St. Mary present at the performance of any of her Son's miracles except at Cana and later on at the Cross. It is as if the Divine inspiration had destined for the Mother of Salvation to see her Son pour His love to humanity both on a small scale at the wedding and at a large scale on the Cross." (Coptic website)

Who asked her to intercede?

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

Hi

Yes it does. Does it honor Mary when we ask her to intercede for us, yes it does. Are we praying to Mary when we ask her to intercede for us, yes and no. We are in the same respect as when we ask anyone else to pray for us in intercessory prayer, but no in the respect of are we treating her as being on an equal level as God, certainly we are not any more than we are doing so when we ask our pastor to pray for us. Do I think that Jesus listens to His mother a little more closely than He would someone else, yes I do.

God alone is omnipotent and omnipresent so for a created being to be able to hear and process thousands of prayers at the same time she would have to have the attributes of God. We see in the Bible angels and they are limited to being at a single place at a single time. Daniel prayed and an angel was sent but was withstood 21 days by the prince of Persia until Michael was sent to free him from that situation. Now Mary is created and is not omnipresent and we are told we have only one mediator between man and God; Christ Jesus. So Mary is honored and a great example but now one should pray directly to or through any of the saints. Jesus loves us all and we can all come before Him and He has given us the Holy Spirit to make these connections direct.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

Scripture doesnt say but most likely it is the same servants that she told to “Do whatever he tells you.” Scripture is NOT a transcript so we do have to make some conjectures.

 

[Hammster]

Scripture doesnt say but most likely it is the same servants that she told to “Do whatever he tells you.” Scripture is NOT a transcript so we do have to make some conjectures.

Scripture doesn’t say, so it’s okay to fill in the blanks to fit your theology?

 

[GreekOrthodox]

Well, considering this is the Mariology and Hagiography section, it is a part of our theology.

Each Friday of Lent there is a special service called the Akathist to the Theotokos, which ends in a final hymn to most holy, ever virgin, Mother of God

Τῇ ὑπερμάχῳ στρατηγῷ τὰ νικητήρια,
Ὡς λυτρωθεῖσα τῶν δεινῶν εὐχαριστήρια,
Ἀναγράφω σοι ἡ Πόλις σου Θεοτόκε.
Ἀλλ' ὡς ἔχουσα τὸ κράτος ἀπροσμάχητον,
Ἐκ παντοίων με κινδύνων ἐλευθέρωσον,
Ἵνα κράζω σοι· Χαῖρε νύμφη ἀνύμφευτε.

O Champion General, I your City now inscribe to you
Triumphant anthems as the tokens of my gratitude,
Being rescued from the terrors, O Theotokos.
In as much as you have power unassailable,
From all kinds of perils free me so that unto you I may cry aloud:
Rejoice! O unwedded Bride.

 

[Hammster]

Well, considering this is the Mariology and Hagiography section, it is a part of our theology.

Each Friday of Lent there is a special service called the Akathist to the Theotokos, which ends in a final hymn to most holy, ever virgin, Mother of God

Τῇ ὑπερμάχῳ στρατηγῷ τὰ νικητήρια,
Ὡς λυτρωθεῖσα τῶν δεινῶν εὐχαριστήρια,
Ἀναγράφω σοι ἡ Πόλις σου Θεοτόκε.
Ἀλλ' ὡς ἔχουσα τὸ κράτος ἀπροσμάχητον,
Ἐκ παντοίων με κινδύνων ἐλευθέρωσον,
Ἵνα κράζω σοι· Χαῖρε νύμφη ἀνύμφευτε.

O Champion General, I your City now inscribe to you
Triumphant anthems as the tokens of my gratitude,
Being rescued from the terrors, O Theotokos.
In as much as you have power unassailable,
From all kinds of perils free me so that unto you I may cry aloud:
Rejoice! O unwedded Bride.

And that’s the part I really have issues with. Worship is reserved for God alone.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

We venerate and we honor Mary and all of the saints. Worship is for God alone as St. John of Damascus wrote:

You must understand that there are different degrees of worship. First of all the full worship which we show to God, who alone is by nature worthy of worship. But, for the sake of God who is worshipful by nature, we honor and venerate his saints and servants. It is in this sense that Joshua and Daniel worshipped an angel, [Jos. 5.14, Dan. 8:16-17] and David worshipped the Lord’s holy places, when be said, “Let us go to the place where his feet have stood.” [Ps. 132.7] Similarly, his dwelling place is worshipped, as when all the people of Israel adored in the tabernacle, and they stood round the temple in Jerusalem gazing at it from all sides worshipping, as they still do. Similarly, we honor the rulers established by God, as when Jacob gave homage to Esau, his elder brother, [Gen. 33.3] and to Pharaoh, the divinely established ruler. [Gen. 47.7] And Joseph was worshipped by his brothers. [Gen. 50.18] That kind of veneration is based on honour, as in the case of Abraham and the sons of Emmor. [Gen. 23.7] So then, either do away with all worship, or accept it in all its different kinds.​

 

[Hammster]

We venerate and we honor Mary and all of the saints. Worship is for God alone as St. John of Damascus wrote:

You must understand that there are different degrees of worship. First of all the full worship which we show to God, who alone is by nature worthy of worship. But, for the sake of God who is worshipful by nature, we honor and venerate his saints and servants. It is in this sense that Joshua and Daniel worshipped an angel, [Jos. 5.14, Dan. 8:16-17] and David worshipped the Lord’s holy places, when be said, “Let us go to the place where his feet have stood.” [Ps. 132.7] Similarly, his dwelling place is worshipped, as when all the people of Israel adored in the tabernacle, and they stood round the temple in Jerusalem gazing at it from all sides worshipping, as they still do. Similarly, we honor the rulers established by God, as when Jacob gave homage to Esau, his elder brother, [Gen. 33.3] and to Pharaoh, the divinely established ruler. [Gen. 47.7] And Joseph was worshipped by his brothers. [Gen. 50.18] That kind of veneration is based on honour, as in the case of Abraham and the sons of Emmor. [Gen. 23.7] So then, either do away with all worship, or accept it in all its different kinds.​

If it walks like a duck....

 

[GreekOrthodox]

As John said

So then, either do away with all worship, or accept it in all its different kinds.

As we proclaim in the annual Sunday of Orthodoxy on the restoration of icons

“As the Prophets beheld, As the Apostles taught, As the Church received, As the Teachers dogmatized, As the Universe agreed, As Grace illumined, As the Truth revealed, As falsehood passed away, As Wisdom presented, As Christ awarded, Thus we declare, Thus we assert, Thus we proclaim Christ our true God and honor His saints, In words, In writings, In thoughts, In sacrifices, In churches, In holy icons. On the one hand, worshiping and reverencing Christ as God and Lord. And on the other hand, honoring and venerating His Saints as true servants of the same Lord.


This is the Faith of the Apostles. This is the Faith of the Fathers. This is the Faith of the Orthodox. This is the Faith which has established the Universe.” Amen!

 

[Kenny'sID]

If we are to model ourselves after Jesus Christ and imitate His life by doing what He did while He was alive, would praying to Mary be something we would do?

From what you give us to go on there, no.

Do you have some biblical reason why we should pray to Mary.

Open question.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

From what you give us to go on there, no.

Do you have some biblical reason why we should pray to Mary.

Open question.

We have Holy Tradition, which includes not only the pinnacle of the revealed Scriptures, but the Creed, councils, church fathers, liturgy, hymns, canons and iconography. 2000 years of lex orendi lex credendi the living ekklesia of the Orthodox faith.