Would you quit your job if?

[JohnR7]

Difference is John TEs have no problem with the science of Evolution.

They just need to be careful they are not a member of the harlot church that is in bed with the world.
Even we are told the lukewarm church does not represent or speak for God.

Rev. 3:14-22
"And to the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write,
'These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: [15] I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. [16] So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. [17] Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing'--and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked-- [18] I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. [19] As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. [20] Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. [21] To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne. [22] He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." ' "

 

[Battie]

So you do not think that Creationism is the "truth". Do you know what creationism is? Just what do you believe is NOT true?

TE, OEC, YEC, GAP are all Creationism. So do you think that TE is not true?

This is the first time in this forum I've seen TE, and maybe even GAP placed under the heading of creationism. If you stated that earlier in the thread I'm sorry I missed it, otherwise I'm not sure why you're addressing me like I just backed myself into a wall.

But to answer your question, yes, I am a TE, and I would teach evolution in a science class. I would be open about my beliefs about God, if the students wanted to know about it, but in a science class I would not teach or test on the spiritual because that's not what science is about. The only way I could possibly get away with that is if I were in a religious school, and I don't know if that's part of the topic.

 

[Battie]

They just need to be careful they are not a member of the harlot church that is in bed with the world.
Even we are told the lukewarm church does not represent or speak for God.

Rev. 3:14-22
"And to the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write,
'These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: [15] I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. [16] So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. [17] Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing'--and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked-- [18] I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. [19] As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. [20] Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. [21] To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne. [22] He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." ' "

Well this is a *facepalm* moment if I ever saw one.

Seriously John, after all this time do you have no respect for TE Christians at all? My stance on the specifics of creation has no bearing on the strength of my faith, and to throw out that verse like it applies only to the TEs on this board is just plain disrespectful.

We're all in different places in our relationships with God. I've got my strengths, I've got my weaknesses, and that's between me, God, and whoever I choose to confide in.

I hope you can tell me you are prepared to address that warning and verse to any Christian with any origins belief. If not, tell me how it is that you are a long-standing member of this forum and still don't respect the faith of your TE brothers and sisters.

 

[Rusticus]

A question for JohnR7:

Is, in your opinion, a belief in creationism, required for salvation?

(Creationism, in this instance being as described by dictionary definition:

"Belief in the literal interpretation of the account of the creation of the universe and of all living things related in the Bible."
and
"the literal belief in the account of creation given in the Book of Genesis; "creationism denies the theory of evolution of species""

 

[JohnR7]

A question for JohnR7:

Is, in your opinion, a belief in creationism, required for salvation?

Of course creationism is required. I just don't know of anyone that believes in God that does not believe that He created us one way or the other.

(Creationism, in this instance being as described by dictionary definition:

Creationism means that God created us. It does not try to map out how God did that. Although there are individual schools that address that issue.

 

[Rusticus]

Of course creationism is required. I just don't know of anyone that believes in God that does not believe that He created us one way or the other.



Creationism means that God created us. It does not try to map out how God did that. Although there are individual schools that address that issue.

My question was:

Is, in your opinion, a belief in creationism, required for salvation?

(Creationism, in this instance being as described by dictionary definition:

"Belief in the literal interpretation of the account of the creation of the universe and of all living things related in the Bible."
and
"the literal belief in the account of creation given in the Book of Genesis; "creationism denies the theory of evolution of species""


Consequently, your words are not an answer to my question.

(Of course, there is no oblication to answer the question. But it would have been nice.......

 

[JohnR7]

(Creationism, in this instance being as described by dictionary definition:

God has His own dictionary and He does not use the same dictionary that man or science uses.

 

[Rusticus]

God has His own dictionary and He does not use the same dictionary that man or science uses.

As I said: You don't have to answer the question if you don't want to.

 

[JohnR7]

Seriously John, after all this time do you have no respect for TE Christians at all?

Yeah, I do have respect for them. I am not saying that there is a connection. I am just saying we need to be careful. The Bible says that there is a dead, harlot, apostate church and we need to be careful that we are not a part of it. It is not my place to judge people and it is also against the rules to judge individual.

 

[invisible trousers]

Pesonally, I think Theistic Evolutionists have most reasonable position of any of the theory holders.

We aim to please! Believing in theistic evolution is pretty fun, except having to deal with creationsts like

They just need to be careful they are not a member of the harlot church that is in bed with the world.
Even we are told the lukewarm church does not represent or speak for God.

who are more than willing to pounce on an opportunity to accuse us of being non-christian and possibly tools of satan because we disagree with them.

Strange how I've never seen this kind of behavior from other people who believe in TE

 

[DailyBlessings]

Strange how I've never seen this kind of behavior from other people who believe in TE

To be fair, I've heard IDists described as "borderline pagans", "heretics", and "enemies of plain reason". And that's just around CF.

 

[Nathan Poe]

God has His own dictionary and He does not use the same dictionary that man or science uses.

And which dictionary are you using? How about putting down your own --the one you think is God's -- and using the same one the rest of us are, at least to facilitate communication?

 

[JGL53]

So, the final count is:

44 people would turn down the money and quit rather than teach creationism

5 people would teach creationism, but 3 of the 5 would teach it was unscientific mythos.

Sweet.

 

[Kahalachan]

Probably. I could teach Creationism but sneak in my own non-verbal hints that it's BS to deter students from actually believing it. And on the tests I would put a question such as "Compare and contrast Evolution and Creation in terms of utilizing the scientific method." You could easily teach and sneak in your own personal views. I see it all the time.

I believe in maximizing mutual benefit.

I would get a good job, students would be more inclined to believe in the truth, and whoever made the dumb rule that Creationism needs to be taught would get their way.

 

[BVZ]

I don't see how God using his own dictionary changes anything about Rusticus's question. You see, Rusticus is not God (as you propably know), which is why he does not use God's dictionary. He does in fact use his own dictionary, he even provided you with the definition from it. Since he was able to provide a definition from this dictionary, it should be safe to assume that he has access to it.

As Rusticus said, if you dont want to answer the question don't. But don't dodge with irrelevant possiblities like God having his own dictionary, since it adds nothing to the discussion.

 

[xMinionX]

Argh. -1 from no, +1 to yes. I'm still half asleep and clicked the wrong button.

 

[Incubusion]

Unless I'm in a theological class, no. Religionhas no place anywhere but as a backdrop for historical events(wars, seperatist movements, etc. etc.), English class, or a theology class. It especially has no place in a science class.

 

[JohnR7]

You see, Rusticus is not God (as you propably know), which is why he does not use God's dictionary.

There are only two dictioniarys, the devils dictionary and God's dictionary. That is the only two dictionarys we get to choose from.

 

[DailyBlessings]

There are only two dictioniarys, the devils dictionary and God's dictionary. That is the only two dictionarys we get to choose from.

What about the good ol' OED?

And does God's dictionary have a French language edition, or do you have to use God's and then translate?

 

[Battie]

There are only two dictioniarys, the devils dictionary and God's dictionary. That is the only two dictionarys we get to choose from.

What does the devil's dictionary do? Does it change the definition of words so that we all get confused? What language is it in? How do you know we're not all reading from God's dictionary but translating the words differently?