Witchcraft in the Church

[Natsumi Lam]

Demons exist only in the minds of those who believe in them.

Not according to the Word of God. Jesus healed physically, spiritually and a combo.

Are you saying Jesus was a liar and delusional?

 

[Dave G.]

People may "practice" witchcraft but there no reality to it.

There is a reality to it though, it places you outside the will of God. If you aren't with God then there is another commander and that commander has power too, power to display signs and wonders etc etc. All the more so in the times we are in, where signs and wonders are stated biblically to increase and deceive. Witchcraft is dangers territory, no Christian should be anywhere near it never mind practicing it. No true born again believer anyway. Unfortunately many calling themselves Christian are already deceived and residing in deceived denominations even, where many strange things, anti biblical things have come to be acceptable..

 

[Lily of Valleys]

Orthodox Christian teaching is fundamentally at odds with belief in magick. In the middle ages the Church worked hard to get people to give up their folk superstitions about witches (belief in witches and that such witches have actual magickal power is a pagan belief, not a Christian one). Belief in witches was regarded as heresy, and witch-hunting was condemned by European rulers (most famously under Charlemagne). It isn't until near the end of the middle ages with the publication of the Malleus Maleficarum in the 15th century that opinions began to change. We associate witch-hunts with Medieval Europe, but the actual truth of the matter is that witch-hunts weren't really a thing in the middle ages, virtually all organized witch-hunts were in the early modern period, and weren't done in Catholic dominated territories, but Protestant ones. Which is why the Salem Witch Trials weren't some bizarre vestige of the medieval past, but was actually representative of attitudes of the 17th century.

The idea that Satan has god-like power and has human servants who can use such power (i.e. magick) is both heretical and blasphemous. It is ascribing to the enemy a power that, though less, no creature ever has had. The devil isn't a god, but a creature, he does not have power over the heavens and the earth, instead he is a liar, he was a liar from the beginning, and he's a liar now.

-CryptoLutheran

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

 

[Natsumi Lam]

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

I will check this out.

 

[Natsumi Lam]

I have been thinking about the OP.

If i was a pastor of a congregation i would:
1. Confirm the accusations with the Holy Spirit
2. Form a prayer team and confirm with the mouths of two or three witnesses
3. Pray and fast
4. With fellow ministers of God i would meet with the members...pray together for God's wisdom and guidance
5. Address the issue with the members
6. If it is true i would pray for them and kindly send them on their way
7. Dedicate intercession time asking the Holy Spirit to bless them and protect the congregation...among other prayers

What should be done next?

 

[Natsumi Lam]

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

First i would say that the Post is saying that witches are fringe citizens. I believe, much like Satanists, there are witches in every walk of life....even in churches.

Also, i find it weird that half of the money raised will go to planned parenthood and LGBTQ organizations. Why are these the choice of donation?

 

[Lily of Valleys]

First i would say that the Post is saying that witches are fringe citizens. I believe, much like Satanists, there are witches in every walk of life....even in churches

It seems to be promoting occult practice and hatred in the name of justice, another form of masquerading as an angel of light.

Also, i find it weird that half of the money raised will go to planned parenthood and LGBTQ organizations. Why are these the choice of donation?

The "Planned Parenthood" organisation appears to be promoting abortion. Brett Kavanaugh is a Catholic and a conservative. He is probably seen as a threat to abortion and LGBTQ rights.

 

[PloverWing]

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

If I understand ViaCrucis correctly, he's not saying that the witches are heretics; he's saying that Christians who believe that witches have genuine magical power are heretics. Witches are simply people of another religion.

Speaking for myself, I'd say that I do not believe that the hex will have any genuine magical effect. I'm willing to be proven wrong: If the hex calls for some specific, verifiable injury (say, it calls for his skin to turn green), and that injury happens the next day, that would be worth paying attention to. But I do not expect anything like that.

I think the hex might have an emotionally cathartic effect on participants who have been sexually assaulted, a way for them to express their pain and anger. But that is different, a human emotional experience.

Were I to advise the witches, I'd recommend that they find a different way to direct their spiritual and emotional energies. Jesus is wise when he tells us not to render evil for evil. Hate and unresolved anger can eat away at a person in unhealthy ways. A better response would be to take that driving need for justice, which the witches legitimately feel, and turn it towards something more constructive: self-defense classes for women, shelters for victims of domestic violence, education for young men and women about consent and sexuality, something like that. Some kind of work towards preventing future injustice, rather than a ritual expression of hate.

 

[ViaCrucis]

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Neo-Pagans are Neo-Pagans, not heretics.

I don't believe in magick, curses, or hexes--so I consider this fundamentally meaningless. If I believed that "witches" were capable of magick or doing hexes then that would make me subscribing to heresy. It is both blasphemous and heretical to ascribe divine power to anything other than God.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Dave-W]

Do you think people in covens target churches and then actually go to various churches and fill pew space?

I mean, maybe they do. It's an interesting thing to consider.

That happened to a congregation I was in back around 1980.

 

[Dave-W]

It is both blasphemous and heretical to ascribe divine power to anything other than God.

But demonic supernatural power is NOT “Divine” power.

 

[Dave-W]

The interesting thing I'm noticing here in this thread is that those who come from more charismatic type churches say they notice this kind of thing in their churches, but those who associate with more traditional, mainline churches are saying, "We don't see it."

That could be for one of two reasons:

1. Non charismatic types do not know what to look for as far as signs of this activity.

2. Non charismatic groups are less of a threat to those in the dark arts, meaning they do not get targeted.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Neo-Pagans are Neo-Pagans, not heretics.

I don't believe in magick, curses, or hexes--so I consider this fundamentally meaningless. If I believed that "witches" were capable of magick or doing hexes then that would make me subscribing to heresy. It is both blasphemous and heretical to ascribe divine power to anything other than God.

-CryptoLutheran

It's not heretical or blasphemous to ascribe power to Satan, limited power that Jesus Himself said is allowed to the Enemy.

 

[Dave-W]

My objection has more to do with the horrible abuses that occurred when Christians believed that witches lived under every rock and tree, and the thousands of people that were persecuted as witches. As a result, I have no desire to dabble in witchhunting or anything like that.

That. Is what. Happens when someone tries to deal with a spiritual problem without actual spiritual discernment.

The solution is to get the proper gifting and training in discernment; not to just ignore the situation.

 

[Dave-W]

People may "practice" witchcraft but there no reality to it.

Do a web search on Orlando deOlivera (hope I spelled it correctly) or Lester Sumrall and Witchdoctor. He was a witch doctor in Brazilia in the 1950s. Then he came to faith in Jesus. His testimony will tell you how real his practice was.

 

[Dave-W]

Demons exist only in the minds of those who believe in them.

So you are saying our Lord was deluded when He talked to them in the gospel accounts?

 

[ViaCrucis]

But demonic supernatural power is NOT “Divine” power.

My issue is this: The way demonic power is often described it amounts to powers one would ascribe to a god--the ability to manipulate the order of the cosmos. I know people often look at places, such as the young slave girl whose masters claimed she could know the future and so made money off of her; but missing in the text is any actual claim that the demon gave the girl any power to actually know the future. Charlatanism isn't new, it's been around for ages. That the girl was possessed and oppressed by a demon isn't under dispute, what I would dispute is that the demon actually gave her the power to know the future. That ascribes to the demonic a power, a knowledge, that in Scripture God alone has--and that's the omniscience to know all things, such as our future. Do I have any reason to believe the devils can know the future? As they are creatures, limited and constrained by the same universe we are, why should we ascribe them power which Scripture itself never does.

When Scripture does make it abundantly clear that the devils are liars. Satan is a liar, that's what he does--he lies. He lies to look powerful, he lies to look strong, he lies to make himself seem more than he is. He says he can offer the kingdoms of the world, he claims he can do this or do that. I've no doubt that the devil can delude, deceive, and give the appearances of great things.

One of my favorite scenes from the animated movie The Prince of Egypt is when the court magicians copy Moses' turning his rod into a snake--it is all smoke and mirrors.

And that seems like the best possible way to describe the power of the devil as far as feats of wonder--smoke and mirrors. The devil is the world's oldest conman, the biggest charlatan, the prince of lies. Every word he utters is a lie.

Martin Luther writes that one little word is enough to stop the devil in his tracks, call him what he is--Liar.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Dave-W]

such as the young slave girl whose masters claimed she could know the future and so made money off of her; but missing in the text is any actual claim that the demon gave the girl any power to actually know the future.

Actually it is in there. It became clear to them that her power was gone. You cannot lose a power that you never had.

 

[Natsumi Lam]

What is your opinion on this event organized by witches then? Do you consider it as heresy?

Modern-Day Witches Plan Ritual To Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Ritual to Hex Brett Kavanaugh

Is it all a joke or real?

 

[Natsumi Lam]

People may "practice" witchcraft but there no reality to it.

Why does God call some things abominations?

Why then did Saul die for going to a medium?

The bible also says you will be defiled by them.

The Lord will set His face against them.

A medium is to be put to death.

And the list goes on.

For something u believe is a fairytale...God is very passionate about it ....shouldnt we be also?