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Cerridwen

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Hey~

Yeah, I understand where you're coming from there. Sometimes it's hard to "un-learn" all the things we've been taught throughout our lives, especially those of us who were raised Christian. You know, that spirits don't exist, that animals can't talk, that trees can't feel pain....that your "imaginary friends" should be forgotten & ignored. You'll get there, though, we all do, eventually. I wish you the best of luck.

Love & Blessings, Cerridwen*
 
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Plan 9

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Cerridwen said:
Hey~

Yeah, I understand where you're coming from there. Sometimes it's hard to "un-learn" all the things we've been taught throughout our lives, especially those of us who were raised Christian. You know, that spirits don't exist, that animals can't talk, that trees can't feel pain....that your "imaginary friends" should be forgotten & ignored. You'll get there, though, we all do, eventually. I wish you the best of luck.

Love & Blessings, Cerridwen*

but...but...animals can talk. My dogs tell me things all the time; they always speak of dog things, but they have an expressive language. They tell me things like,
"INTRUDER ALERT! OPEN THE GUESTROOM DOOR! NOW!"
"Come look out the window! There's a cat in the yard I want you to see!"
My male says to human men he likes,
"You can tell I'm a big Alpha Male, too, can't you?"
and to male canines and male humans he doesn't:
"You leave my girls alone!"

All these messages, and many more, are conveyed by various barking patterns, and when I teach them to say "Hello!" and "I love you!" they incorporate these human phrases into their play, but never use them when they fight.

I think that trees and scrubs must feel something when I prune them, or when I feed or water them, but, if so, I'm not in touch with what. :sigh:
 
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Rae

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FYI, a Native American shaman I read about once says that at least according to his tradition, many people don't have totems. They also could be as likely to have a parakeet as a totem as one of the more "popular" animals. ::shrug::

Smilin, what do you think?
 
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Flavius

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Plan 9 said:
but...but...animals can talk. My dogs tell me things all the time; they always speak of dog things, but they have an expressive language. They tell me things like,
"INTRUDER ALERT! OPEN THE GUESTROOM DOOR! NOW!"
"Come look out the window! There's a cat in the yard I want you to see!"
My male says to human men he likes,
"You can tell I'm a big Alpha Male, too, can't you?"
and to male canines and male humans he doesn't:
"You leave my girls alone!"

All these messages, and many more, are conveyed by various barking patterns, and when I teach them to say "Hello!" and "I love you!" they incorporate these human phrases into their play, but never use them when they fight.

I think that trees and scrubs must feel something when I prune them, or when I feed or water them, but, if so, I'm not in touch with what. :sigh:
I so agree with plan9 on this.I was so astonished the other day when I actually saw a dog speak on one of those Riply shoes or something like that.The dog could actually talk.It freaked me out,I'm sure some of you saw it.The dog learned to say several sentences.Anyway,Animals know excactly what you are saying half the time,well they know key words.

If you spend time watching crows or mexican Ravens you can very easily learn their language,I talk to them all the time and they understand me and I understand them.The neighbors think I'm quite crazy cause they hear me saying Caw,caw,caw and growling at them.You can tell when they are looking for somebody or warning others,and they growl sometimes sounding like children.They tell others not to come into their territory and that makes me mad sometimes cause I let them know that this is my territory and I growl at them and they get the message,sounds silly but it's fun because they know excactly what I'm saying.

I love birds and I love learning their language.Most people never notice,they hear a bird singing and they think that he is so happy but most of the time its a cry for help or a territorial thing.

It's bad enough that the neighbors have seen me digging in the front yard with a spoon by moonlight and then I add dr.Dolittle to that.but insects and animals fascinate me.Sometimes I wonder that if G-d is Omni prescent and all seeing that maybe it's through the eyes of insects and animals that he sees us.Probably not but just a thought.

The cats and dogs that I have had have E.S.P. and seem smarter than humans cause if I'm in a bad mood I don't have to say a word and they allready know it.

What really makes me mad is those doves,Their love for their babies is so strong that they sit in the middle of the street trying to steer your car away from their nest that many of them die.I talk to doves all the time and they know what I'm saying but they think I'm female and they will actually come closer to you if you can make that dove sound but its hard to do,they feel a bond with you but they make me angry when I have to hit the brakes of my car.they work in pairs often and if you can make a dove call they will talk to you and come closer.

Grackels are so arrogant,they live in herds of thousands,they are the most selfish birds.They come every morning eating my cat food and they get really mad if enough food isn't there.they will come within 3 feet of you screaming that the food has run out and wanting an answer why this has happened.I fight with them every morning telling them that I'm not their slave but they never believe it,they spit and curse and try and take a dump on my head,those are the birds you see in the movie{the birds} by Hitchcock

My favorite birds are the woodpecker and the hummingbird cause you never hear a peep out of them,you hear the woodpecker working for what he eats digging holes into trees eating the bugs within,he's not selfish and lazy like a grackel or a Raven,he works all day and doesnt complain.

The hummingbird is the best of all.If you set some hummingbird food out and make it a practice of getting close to him,he will get used to you and before you know it he will fly stationary right in front of ur face seeming to kiss and love you for feeding him,very,very cool.

Dang this is a long post,sorry but I love birds so much and animals.Don't be fooled to think that they don't talk and relate because some of them are better than most of the people I know.:eek:

There is a sandpiper that lives right outside my window that screams night and day for another sandpiper but he happens to be the only sandpiper in my town,I don't know how he got here but he keeps me awake several times a week screaming for other sandpipers.They all live at the beach and some how he landed here,I figure maybe somebody found him wounded and brought him here but he is the lonelyest bird around,he never sleeps and he screams all the time.Quite often I think maybe I'll go to Wallymart and get me a pellet gun and kill him but then I feel so sorry for him and his crying for others,so I put up with him and his screaming.I kinda feel a bond with him cause its so rare and he is so alone but he really makes me mad with his screaming,he's always searching,always looking for somebody like him.

Plants and trees, Most people don't see them as something that can communicate with people but that's not true,plants can teach you more about yourself than any person could.If I died tomorrow the one thing people would say about me is that I have a green thumb and I adore plants.

Plants and trees speak to you,Go get you a little tree,go get you a pecan tree and love it.feed it and plant it in good soil in a movable bucket.When it's leaves turn brown give it more water and when it's leaves turn yellow stop giving it so much water,learn what makes it happy.Talk to it everyday as if it were a friend and it will feed you when it gets old.People think that plants and trees have no emotions but they really do,If you don't love them they might die on you but when you really love them they flourish.One time I carried a Pecan tree where ever I went and it got big and strong and I met this chick and settled down and married her and I planted that Pecan tree in our front yard.But a few years later me and my wife broke up and I was so disgusted at myself because I had planted that Pecan tree in the front yard and I was now banished from that property.

When I left I was so upset not because I had to leave that woman but because I had planted that Pecan tree in the front yard and it was now to big to dig up,so like an idiot I went out and cut that tree down to the ground cause I coudnt standd the thought of it living without me,I know what your thinking,I'm a phycho but hey,I agree

That was 20 years ago and I thought I had killed that Pecan tree but I didn't in fact I made that tree stronger than any tree in the subdivision because I gave it a chance for the roots to catch up and through the strife and the trouble of that relationship that tree is flourishing and is the most magnifiscant tree in the neighborhood.I learned alot through loving that tree about myself.
Every little thing in this life is about teaching us who G-d is.Hee is in everything,in every plant,in every animal,its all a lesson.

I dint mean this post to be against what Cerrindwen said because I think she said about the same thing I'm saying now in an earlier post.reality is something we all have to deal with.
 
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LADY DI

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Cerridwen said:
Hey~

Generally, one's totem animal is simply an animal one feels a close connection with. I don't mean just an animal that you like, like a cute little dog or cat(although it can be one of those), but an animal that seems to "speak" to you, that you seem to connect with on a spiritual level. An animal that maybe you notice a lot, that comes around you often. Pay attention to what happens in your life around the times that a particular animal crosses your path. They can be messengers, guides, protectors, or they can remind you about things in your life. Also, like Ravenwolf said, you can figure out who your totem is when you walk the astral, or try lucid dreaming. Maybe you have a particular animal companion in your dreams? Or maybe you "become" a particular animal? I don't know so much about mythological creatures being totems, since generally a totem is an animal that actually exists on this physical plane. Although you may have a spirit guide or something that you picture as a dragon or a unicorn. I'll try to do a bit more research on it for you.

Love & Blessings, Cerridwen*

Cats adore me, then again I love cats. I dont have any now, three kids take up most of my time!!! But it amazes me that stray cats will come up to me, its like they know I wont hurt them. So I dont know if that could be a totem.
Also coming home at night from work ( I get off from work at midnight ) I have seen this coyote about three times now, and its always by itself, which is odd because they usually travel in packs. But whats really weird about it is that I only see him when I drive by myself ( my husband and I work together, but if he stays for overtime, then I go home by myself ), and thats the only time I see him.
What do you think???
Di
 
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ravenwolf

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Dang this is a long post,sorry but I love birds so much and animals.Don't be fooled to think that they don't talk and relate because some of them are better than most of the people I know.:eek:
LOL...I can totally relate, a lot of them are better than most humans. like you said about the plants, it is amazing what they can teach us...I have learned most of my lessons from them. Reading about your experience with birds reminds me of when i was out in nature all the time and would listen to all the birds and knew what they were saying...the most beautiful thing I remember was hearing a baby bird(im not familar with the names of species) it was crying out for its mother, it sounded scared , then i heard the mother singing to it as it flew closer to it and it was as if it was singing it a song saying "its all right im here" and the baby bird sang prettily right back at her...it was the most beautiful thing i have ever heard. I regret not putting aside time lately to be out where i can learn again....this has definatly motivated to connect myself more agian..thanx for the inspiration:)
What do you think???
Di
Sometimes animals show themselves to us to teach us things. My best advice to you would be to learn all you can about the coyotes, read about them, read about there behaviors, what they eat , how they live, etc., and also read about any views different cultures may have held about the coyote, if there are any mythologies or stories about them. And just watching for yourself and observing the coyote that visits you can teach you a lot. It's really amazing the many ways Spirit(or God if you prefer) can teach us and show us things.
Blessings always,
~ravenwolf
 
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LADY DI

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ravenwolf said:
Sometimes animals show themselves to us to teach us things. My best advice to you would be to learn all you can about the coyotes, read about them, read about there behaviors, what they eat , how they live, etc., and also read about any views different cultures may have held about the coyote, if there are any mythologies or stories about them. And just watching for yourself and observing the coyote that visits you can teach you a lot. It's really amazing the many ways Spirit(or God if you prefer) can teach us and show us things.
Blessings always,
~ravenwolf
:wave: Hi Ravenwolf!!!!

Thanks, I'll have to look into that. Yes I too think it's amazing the many ways Spirit can teach us and show us things!!! We have to keep an open mind to those things.
Blessings always,
Di
 
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Smilin

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ravenwolf said:
Sometimes animals show themselves to us to teach us things. My best advice to you would be to learn all you can about the coyotes, read about them, read about there behaviors, what they eat , how they live, etc., and also read about any views different cultures may have held about the coyote, if there are any mythologies or stories about them. And just watching for yourself and observing the coyote that visits you can teach you a lot. It's really amazing the many ways Spirit(or God if you prefer) can teach us and show us things.
Blessings always,
~ravenwolf
I'd also recommend the wolf and the eagle. :)
 
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Smilin

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Rae said:
FYI, a Native American shaman I read about once says that at least according to his tradition, many people don't have totems. They also could be as likely to have a parakeet as a totem as one of the more "popular" animals. ::shrug::

Smilin, what do you think?
Interesting point. According to the Spirituality of the Cherokee,
the animal chooses you, you do not get to choose the animal.
And you must also seek your animal spirit diligently. Perhaps
that is why many have never connected with their totem animals.
Traditional Christianity teaches such as heresy, blasphemy, and 'witchcraft'.
If one doesn not embrace and believe the ancient beliefs, teachings, customs,
and rituals, one will never find their sacred animal spirit guide....(IMO)

For my case (and my daughters), it was the wolf. Although she hasn't
truly realized it. But her spiritual path is her own. As mine is my personal
one. In our family, we respect each other that way. Yet, the same
enthusiasm and interest in wolves began for me at about her age.
She carries the 'Spirit of the Wolf', but is yet to realize what that truly
means. Upcoming teenagers are preoccupied with so many other
interests you know.:D
 
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Smilin

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Plan 9 said:
What about the humble domestic canine, Smilin'? Can we learn from him, or are "wild" animals the only proper guides?
The wolf is the common ancestor to the canine. And don't fool yourself
into thinking dogs are 'domesticated'. They possess evolutionary traits
which have adapted them perfectly to co-existing with the human species.

For example, there are several countries where canines live totally self-sufficient
among humans without owners.

Canines also developed a very smart tactic to co-existing with humans.
'Puppies' :)

Yes, we can learn from canines. (well some) They are still scavengers intstinctively. The best teachers are the mixed bloods. The full-breds
selectively reproduced for specific traits (IMO) offer little to learn from

It is the true mutts and cross-breeds, which do coexist independtly
throughout the world that we can learn from

To claim that canines were truly 'domesticated' is not a correct statement.
They are evolutions greatest trickery on the human population.
 
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Smilin

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LADY DI said:
:wave: Greetings!!!

I'd like to know how one finds their totem? And does it have to be a real animal or can it be a mythological animal like a unicorn, dragon or even a phoenix?
Real animals considered sacred.
PM me, and we'll go into further details.
 
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Plan 9

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Smilin said:
The wolf is the common ancestor to the canine. And don't fool yourself
into thinking dogs are 'domesticated'. They possess evolutionary traits
which have adapted them perfectly to co-existing with the human species.

Yes, indeed! While we have been so cleverly artificially selecting them, they have been busy altering our cultural evolution to suit themselves. ;)

For example, there are several countries where canines live totally self-sufficient
among humans without owners.

Dingoes are a fine example. :)

Yes, we can learn from canines. (well some) They are still scavengers intstinctively. The best teachers are the mixed bloods. The full-breds
selectively reproduced for specific traits (IMO) offer little to learn from

It is the true mutts and cross-breeds, which do coexist independtly
throughout the world that we can learn from

Perhaps you should make some provision for those breeds which are still used as working dogs, such as my whippets. I have a pack of two purebred whippets and one whippet-Dalmatian, to which I belong, and none of them are of that pathetic ultra-beta temprament foisted off on us by the AKC. I learn new things from them every day, because they are not my "pets" and I am not their "owner".
There is a clear pack order, except that I have a great deal of dificulty maintaining pack leader, when peer pressure is constantly applied to reduce me to puppy status. I believe my problem is two-fold:

>They consider me mentally retarded, and from their point of view, I am. Because they're sighthounds, I don't even have the visual acuity they do. Years ago, I proved my ultimate imbecility by walking out of my apartment and pactically into the jawa of a vicious chow. My Alpha female had so much trouble getting both doors open (she'd never tried to turn a doorknob before) that they arrived to late to save the entire pack from harm, and this chow slashed her rather badly. The others (I had three more at the time) raced around him, causing him to turn in tight circles, intil he got dizzy and fell over. Then they let him stagger back home.
>I'm physically disabled. Our youngest member hasn't quite caught on to this, but the others share a long history with me, and their parents passed them knowledge on this subject as well.
So, my youngest sometimes pulls too hard on the leash, but still considers me dumber that dirt and is a horrible bully, always telling me to fill empty food and water dishes, when she isn't hungry or thirsty, and they aren't the only food and water dishes, either. In addition, every trick I teach her, she turns into a demand. LOL

Also, why fault them for taking over my home, and making me their personal servant? C'mon, Smilin'!

To claim that canines were truly 'domesticated' is not a correct statement.
They are evolutions greatest trickery on the human population.

Some days my dogs would agree with you, but on others? I dunno. I'm just so mentally slow that they might wish to make a few very selective changes in me. :)
Personally, I think the two species tricked each other, because we needed each other, and it's worked out well for both of us.

There are a few cultures in which the old relationship of peaceful co-existance for mutual benefit betwen humankind and canines still exists. For instance, the Montagnards of the mountains of Vietnam.
 
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ravenwolf

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Interesting point. According to the Spirituality of the Cherokee,
the animal chooses you, you do not get to choose the animal.
And you must also seek your animal spirit diligently. Perhaps
that is why many have never connected with their totem animals.
Traditional Christianity teaches such as heresy, blasphemy, and 'witchcraft'.
If one doesn not embrace and believe the ancient beliefs, teachings, customs,
and rituals, one will never find their sacred animal spirit guide....(IMO)
Thanks for the info....I'v always been interested in Native American spirituality.Thats pretty much how i feel about it....I feel a spiritual connection with the wolf and always have but I feel it will be know to me clearly when the time comes for me to know. How exactly do the Cherokee go about searching and connecting with their totem..if you dont mind me asking???
Blessings
~ravenwolf
 
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Plan 9

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http://www.christianforums.com/t715362
In addition, I have four nasty PMs in my inbox from the same man over this, and I have had it.
I'm leaving CF. I don't know for how long, but probably a pretty long time. You've been wonderful to me, and I won't forget it.
I'll leave my e-mail option open, so that if you want to know where I still post, you can ask me. These are "non-Christian" sites, although many Christians belong, and people there have better things to do than constantly denigrate each other.
 
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Volos

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Plan 9 said:
http://www.christianforums.com/t715362
In addition, I have four nasty PMs in my inbox from the same man over this, and I have had it.




Yes he is a moron and represents all that is twisted and bad about Christianity but then again he isn’t the only such person on these forums
 
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leewood1987

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Can I just say (Hi I'm new...Lol) I'm only a year into the craft of Wicca but has anyone noticed the hundreds of links between all the religions in this world. God himself could be The All in Wicca, and Allah in Islam. Adam & Jesus could be the Wiccan horned God and Mary and Eve can be the wiccan Goddess. All the angels of God could be the many Gods & Goddesses from Buddhist, Greek and Celtic belief systems. It's all stunning to find these links a year into the craft when it would take others - 20 or 30 years to realise these links. Also it is not God who is afraid of magick (witchcraft) for if he created the universe and us; then it was he who created magick, he wanted us and still wants us to use it for the greater good. It is only his people who are afraid of it because they can't do it; because they are afraid they'll turn evil if they study so much as a 'line' of witchcraft. It wasn't God who taught us witchcraft & magick were evil; it was man himself!
 
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