WHY SALVATION CAN BE LOST

[LoveGodsWord]

Do you deny that Heb 10:10 teaches that they were once and for all sanctified by the Death of Christ?

Why would I do that? We are all sinners and it is only through the death of Jesus that we have God's forgiveness of sins and are sanctified through the body of Christ. That however is not the same as Christian growth and the process of sanctification which is an ongoing work of God's Spirit of all those who believe Gods' Word and receive Gods' grace through faith of the knowledge of our Jesus Christ through. Justification and God's forgiveness of sin through faith makes us sanctified (holy) through faith in the body of Christ; Christian growth and growing "in Christ" is an ongoing process called sanctification which is a work of a lifetime leading to holiness *see 1 Thessalonians 4:4; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Thessalonians 5:23; 1 Peter 3:15; Romans 15:16. Justification is through faith in the body and blood of Christ who purchased our sins by His death and resurrection. Through faith in Gods' promises we are "sanctified" which leads us to Christian growth and sanctification as we grow in God's grace through faith in God's Word *John 17:17. All of the above lead us to holiness and are not separate from each other. Being justified through faith in Gods' Word leads us to being sanctified by faith, sanctification is an ongoing process of believing and following what God's Word says *John 17:17.

Take Care.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The writer of Hebrews clearly states "sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and "perfected for all time those who are sanctified." (Hebrews 10:14)

So in Hebrews 10:10, we clearly read ..WE have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. In Hebrews 10:14, we read - For by one offering He has perfected for all time THOSE who are sanctified.

To go from sanctified positionally in Christ back to un-sanctified would be in contradiction to verses 10 and 14.

No one has ever stated anywhere that we become sanctified to become un-sanctified so lets put that one to rest. Justification, to be sanctified through the body of Christ and sanctification are not separate from each other and lead to Christian growth. If your trying to separate Christian growth in God's Word from sanctification all you have are those who have no knowledge of God's Word or Christian growth who are babes in Christ who only have a basic knowledge of God's Word (milk) *see John 17:17; compare John 8:31-36).

 

[Brightfame52]

The writer of Hebrews clearly states "sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and "perfected for all time those who are sanctified." (Hebrews 10:14)

So in Hebrews 10:10, we clearly read ..WE have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. In Hebrews 10:14, we read - For by one offering He has perfected for all time THOSE who are sanctified.

To go from sanctified positionally in Christ back to un-sanctified would be in contradiction to verses 10 and 14.

The elect are sanctified by the Father before the foundation, he set them apart and loved them ude 1:1

1 Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

This is a deep truth, and it means, even though te elect like other sinners are born sinners by nature Eph 2:3 nevertheless they have already been set apart by God the Father unto a holy purpose.

 

[Brightfame52]

Why would I do that? We are all sinners and it is only through the death of Jesus that we have God's forgiveness of sins and are sanctified through the body of Christ. That however is not the same as Christian growth and the process of sanctification which is an ongoing work of God's Spirit of all those who believe Gods' Word and receive Gods' grace through faith of the knowledge of our Jesus Christ through. Justification and God's forgiveness of sin through faith makes us sanctified (holy) through faith in the body of Christ; Christian growth and growing "in Christ" is an ongoing process called sanctification which is a work of a lifetime leading to holiness *see 1 Thessalonians 4:4; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Thessalonians 5:23; 1 Peter 3:15; Romans 15:16. Justification is through faith in the body and blood of Christ who purchased our sins by His death and resurrection. Through faith in Gods' promises we are "sanctified" which leads us to Christian growth and sanctification as we grow in God's grace through faith in God's Word *John 17:17. All of the above lead us to holiness and are not separate from each other. Being justified through faith in Gods' Word leads us to being sanctified by faith, sanctification is an ongoing process of believing and following what God's Word says *John 17:17.

Take Care.

Christian growth isnt sanctification. You dont grow in sanctification, the christiam grows in grace and knowledge. The Christian will always have a struggle with sin in them until the day they die or Christ returns first and change them. Its a constant warfare Rom 7 and Gal 5. The believer doesnt grow in holiness, Christ is our holiness and we are complete in Him.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Christian growth isnt sanctification. You dont grow in sanctification, the christiam grows in grace and knowledge. The Christian will always have a struggle with sin in them until the day they die or Christ returns first and change them. Its a constant warfare Rom 7 and Gal 5. The believer doesnt grow in holiness, Christ is our holiness and we are complete in Him.

According to the scriptures, Christian growth is not separate from sanctification. Your mixing up justification by faith that we receive through faith in God's promise of forgiveness of sin with sanctification which is the process of being set apart by God to live a new life of holiness consecrated to God and not the world. The Greek word ἁγιασμός (hagiasmós | G38) translated in English as "sanctification" is a present tense, active verbal noun (ongoing) which means to be set apart by God for ongoing consecration; to live a holy life dedicated to God and not the world. This is an active verbal noun meaning that purification is an ongoing process because when we are babes "babes" in Christ *see Romans 2:20; 1 Peter 2:2; we do not know how to live a holy life because we do not know how to walk in God's Spirit *see 1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (see the Greek word "carnal" σαρκικός G4559).

We need to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word (see John 17:17; John 8:31-36) before we can walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; 1 John 3:4-9. Sanctification therefore is an ongoing process of Christian growth to live in newness of life and as babes we are to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word "As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby." - 1 Peter 2:2. As babes, in Christ *see Romans 2:20; 1 Peter 2:2; we do not know how to live a holy life because we do not know how to walk in God's Spirit *see 1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (see the Greek word "carnal" σαρκικός G4559). We need to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word which is an ongoing process (see John 17:17; John 8:31-36) of Christian growth which leads us to walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:4. This is why sanctification is an ongoing process and the work of a lifetime as we learn more of Gods Word and believe what Gods' Word says *see John 17:17; compare 2 Peter 1:3-4.

Sanctification because it is an ongoing active verbal noun therefore leads us to Christian growth through faith to live a holy life. Gods' Word through God's Spirit teaches us more and more about sin that needs to be given up in order to remain consecrated to God. As we grow in Gods' grace as babes in Christ sin is revealed to us more and more in our own lives and leads us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith. This includes both known and unknown sin (James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31) So of course we grow in sanctification through the knowledge of God's Word *see John 17:17 and John 8:31-36; James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31; Hebrews 10:26-31. because if you are still practicing sin you have not been set apart to walk in the Spirit of God or been born again to walk in newness of life *Galatians 5:16; Romans 6:1-23; 1 John 3:4-9.

Take Care.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The elect are sanctified by the Father before the foundation, he set them apart and loved them ude 1:1

1 Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

This is a deep truth, and it means, even though te elect like other sinners are born sinners by nature Eph 2:3 nevertheless they have already been set apart by God the Father unto a holy purpose.

The elect are simply all those who believe and follow Gods' Word that God already knew from the beginning because God knows all things.

Take Care.

 

[enoob57]

I don't understand what you mean, you have lost me.

You follow tulip...

 

[Ligurian]

WHY OUR SALVATION CAN BE LOST

Greetings with much love to all my fellow Christians in the Lord Jesus. I thought I would post this as I wanted to show the multitude of scripture that proves that our salvation is conditional on believing and following what Gods' Word says and that our salvation can be lost if we choose to depart the faith (the truth of Word of God) and no longer believe and follow what Gods' Word says and return to a life of known unrepentant sin. I posted some of the scriptures in another thread but they are lost somewhere in that thread which is grown quite large now. So I am posting those scriptures and more not previously posted if anyone may want to see what the bible says about losing salvation.

QUESTIONS (answers need to be supported by scripture)

Q1. CAN WE LOSE SALVATION IF WE DEPART THE FAITH BY REJECTING GOD'S WORD AND RETURNING TO A LIFE OF KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN (Hebrews 6:4-8 and Hebrews 10:26-39)?

Q2. IS OUR SALVATION CONDITIONAL ON BELIEVING AND FOLLOWING WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS?

Q3. CAN WE DEPART THE FAITH FROM BEING A BELIEVER TO BECOMING AN UNBELIEVER?

Q4. WHERE ARE THE SCRIPTURES THE TEACH WE CAN CHOOSE TO REJECT GOD'S WORD WHEN HE GIVES US A KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH AND DEPART THE FAITH AND RETURN TO A LIFE ON UNBELIEF AND SIN AND STILL RECEIVE ETERNAL LIFE?

Q5. IS THE DOCTRINE OF ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED BIBLICAL?

I hope this can be a friendly discussion please based on the scriptures in regards to the questions posted above and I pray that the scriptures provided here might be helpful for our edification to anyone wanting to understand what the bible teaches in regards to the questions above in regards to our salvation.

May God bless us all as we seek Him through His Word.

1. Yes. 2. Yes. 3. Yes. 5. No.
4. Matthew 13:20-22, Matthew 24:10, Revelation 2:4, Revelation 2:20, Revelation 3:2-3, Revelation 3:11, Revelation 3:17.

 

[Brightfame52]

According to the scriptures, Christian growth is not separate from sanctification. Your mixing up justification by faith that we receive through faith in God's promise of forgiveness of sin with sanctification which is the process of being set apart by God to live a new life of holiness consecrated to God and not the world. The Greek word ἁγιασμός (hagiasmós | G38) translated in English as "sanctification" is a present tense, active verbal noun (ongoing) which means to be set apart by God for ongoing consecration; to live a holy life dedicated to God and not the world. This is an active verbal noun meaning that purification is an ongoing process because when we are babes "babes" in Christ *see Romans 2:20; 1 Peter 2:2; we do not know how to live a holy life because we do not know how to walk in God's Spirit *see 1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (see the Greek word "carnal" σαρκικός G4559).

We need to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word (see John 17:17; John 8:31-36) before we can walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; 1 John 3:4-9. Sanctification therefore is an ongoing process of Christian growth to live in newness of life and as babes we are to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word "As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby." - 1 Peter 2:2. As babes, in Christ *see Romans 2:20; 1 Peter 2:2; we do not know how to live a holy life because we do not know how to walk in God's Spirit *see 1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (see the Greek word "carnal" σαρκικός G4559). We need to grow in the knowledge of Gods' Word which is an ongoing process (see John 17:17; John 8:31-36) of Christian growth which leads us to walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:4. This is why sanctification is an ongoing process and the work of a lifetime as we learn more of Gods Word and believe what Gods' Word says *see John 17:17; compare 2 Peter 1:3-4.

Sanctification because it is an ongoing active verbal noun therefore leads us to Christian growth through faith to live a holy life. Gods' Word through God's Spirit teaches us more and more about sin that needs to be given up in order to remain consecrated to God. As we grow in Gods' grace as babes in Christ sin is revealed to us more and more in our own lives and leads us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith. This includes both known and unknown sin (James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31) So of course we grow in sanctification through the knowledge of God's Word *see John 17:17 and John 8:31-36; James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31; Hebrews 10:26-31. because if you are still practicing sin you have not been set apart to walk in the Spirit of God or been born again to walk in newness of life *Galatians 5:16; Romans 6:1-23; 1 John 3:4-9.

Take Care.

Christ is the sanctification of the believer for whom Christ died. A Believer has been 100% sanctified by Christ, cant get anymore sanctified. Tghe believer may grow in the understanding of it, thats christian growth, to grow in the knowledge of grace 2 Pet 3:18


But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

I fear you are adding works to salvation !

 

[Brightfame52]

The elect are simply all those who believe and follow Gods' Word that God already knew from the beginning because God knows all things.

Take Care.

The elect are elect and sanctified before they become believers.

 

[Danthemailman]

I fear you are adding works to salvation!

You nailed that!

 

[Doug Brents]

This is false, sanctification is once and for all by the death of Christ Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Just FYI, Heb 10:10 says “once for all”, not ‘once and for all’.

“Once for all” means that Christ died once, and His sacrifice was for all (unlike the repetitive sacrifices of the Old Covenant).
This is not the common saying “once and for all” implying “finally” or “at long last” (which is true, but not the implication of this verse.

 

[Doug Brents]

The elect are elect and sanctified before they become believers.

Not even close.

 

[Doug Brents]

I fear you are adding works to salvation !

I fear you don’t have a clue what you are talking about. Action (works if you will) are absolutely required to receive salvation. And there is NO passage of Scripture that says differently (no, not even Eph 2:8-9). Without taking actions that demonstrate and give life to our faith, we do not receive justification, sanctification, forgiveness, or eternal life.

 

[Ligurian]

I fear you don’t have a clue what you are talking about. Action (works if you will) are absolutely required to receive salvation. And there is NO passage of Scripture that says differently (no, not even Eph 2:8-9). Without taking actions that demonstrate and give life to our faith, we do not receive justification, sanctification, forgiveness, or eternal life.

There are two different gospels. The First Gospel came to Galilee by Jesus and was called the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven and/or the Kingdom of God. And it's all about keeping the Commandments of God, which God gave Him to fully-teach the men who were already following the Father.
The second gospel teaches what Jesus could never have taught to His Galilean Discipled-Apostles: "christ crucified," and seems mainly to prove that Jesus was the Messiah, before going on to do away with the law... in too many verses to deny.

The process of sanctification and justification are so radically different in these two gospels that it defies one single definition... and so is the giving of the Holy Spirit, BTW.

 

[Doug Brents]

There are two different gospels.

Sorry, but there is only one Gospel. Only one “good news” which the New Covenant presents.

As Paul says in Gal 1:8-9, “But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.”

 

[Brightfame52]

Just FYI, Heb 10:10 says “once for all”, not ‘once and for all’.

“Once for all” means that Christ died once, and His sacrifice was for all (unlike the repetitive sacrifices of the Old Covenant).
This is not the common saying “once and for all” implying “finally” or “at long last” (which is true, but not the implication of this verse.

I know what Heb 10:10 says !

 

[Brightfame52]

I fear you don’t have a clue what you are talking about. Action (works if you will) are absolutely required to receive salvation. And there is NO passage of Scripture that says differently (no, not even Eph 2:8-9). Without taking actions that demonstrate and give life to our faith, we do not receive justification, sanctification, forgiveness, or eternal life.

It appears works is being added as a requirement for salvation.

 

[Doug Brents]

It appears works is being added as a requirement for salvation.

Again, where in Scripture does it say that they aren’t required? There is not a single passage of Scripture that says man doesn’t have to do anything to receive salvation. Quite the contrary, there are scores of passages that say we MUST do something, that we MUST take action to receive salvation.

The concept of a “works free” salvation is not Biblical in the least.

 

[Brightfame52]

Again, where in Scripture does it say that they aren’t required? There is not a single passage of Scripture that says man doesn’t have to do anything to receive salvation. Quite the contrary, there are scores of passages that say we MUST do something, that we MUST take action to receive salvation.

The concept of a “works free” salvation is not Biblical in the least.

I know you are an advocate for works salvation, understand that denies Grace Salvation.