Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

[Ophiolite]

Do the authors think that the hands of other primates, or the forelimbs of other tetrapods, were designed by a Creator? And what about the human foot; was it designed, or did it evolve?

I recall looking into this incident at the time. My reading of it then was it was a bit of a storm in a teacup. My reading of it was the aithors intended something along the lines of "the human hand is an excellent piece of design by Nature". As they were working in a second language that was easily conflated with "the human hand is an excellent piece of design by the Creator".

 

[Zoii]

No evidence was generated.

The creation week consisted of a series of miracles over a period of six days that raised the level of mass/energy in the universe from zero to what it is now.

um...... isnt that saying you have no evidence?

 

[Aman777]

Not one of your sentences follows logically from the last. Prehistorical people already were reasoning humans. The transition from our apelike ancestors to ourselves occurred due to mutations. I’m sure this has been explained to you before, right?

Where did these prehistoric people get their superior intelligence? Certainly NOT from mindless Nature. Some would have us believe that we "evolved" our superior intelligence over time with numerous mutations, all leading us to have our wonderful minds, which are much superior to ANYthing Nature has.

God's Truth tells us that Humans came from Adam's world which was totally destroyed in the flood. ll Pet 3:6 Is it coincidental that EVERY Human trait can be traced FIRST to the area God tells us the Ark arrived? Gen 8:4 Is it coincidence that the same Rivers are still there? with the SAME Names as in Genesis?

The answer is simple and provided by Secular History which shows the FIRST Human farming, city building, reading and writing, etc all developed from Northern Mesopotamia, the land between the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, in total AGREEMENT with the flood story.

The Ark arrived in Lake Van, Turkey in the mountains of Ararat. Noah walked into the valleys of Northern Mesopotamia and planted the FIRST Human crop, ever planted on Planet Earth. He then demonstrated the FIRST Human trait:

Gen 9:20 ¶ And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard:
Gen 9:21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.

He got drunk and naked in the first TENT ever assembled on our Earth. How much more Human can you get? Apes nor prehistoric people EVER made a tent nor had a home. That's WHY they call them Cavemen. They lived as all innocent animals, live. Noah's grandsons married and produced children with these innocent people God had created here Millions of years before the Ark arrived. Gen 6:4 That is God's Truth of our Human (descendants of Adam) origin. History and Science AGREE.

 

[Aman777]

Aman, You have nothing to base this on. Dust is a product of this Universe, it is something that came about in our universe after the first stars went Supernova, and not before. Based on that fact, how could you even know what's in the Cosmos, let alone that there's time outside (another intrinsic property of this universe) and that it's permeated by something that didn't even exist in this universe for millions, if not billions of years after it appeared to begin?

Yet again, you completely short Science and the scientific process to arrive at violently speculative and unfounded assumptions about things we're not even sure exists?

I didn't write it. It's the story of the Creation as told in Genesis 1. I read it with a good understanding of evolution since I was one. I read it to prove it wrong and found that the Christians of the last days, with our increased knowledge, CAN understand Genesis. Dan 12:4

God created a perfect world which consisted of heaven/air, ground without form/dust and water. Gen 1:1-2 Adam's firmament, which God called Heaven, was made in the midst or immersed in WATER. Gen 1:6-8 Our 2nd Heaven/Universe was made the next Day/Age in the midst of the ground without form/DUST of Heaven. That's God's Truth Scripturally in Genesis.

Adam's world was "clean dissolved" in the flood. Isa 24:19 ll Peter 3:6
The present Universe will be burned. ll Peter 3:10
The 3rd Heaven, ll Cor 12:2, with it's streets of Gold and Gates of Pearl, will be forever. It's also called the New Heaven and New Earth in Rev 21:1.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

I didn't write it. It's the story of the Creation as told in Genesis 1. I read it with a good understanding of evolution since I was one. I read it to prove it wrong and found that the Christians of the last days, with our increased knowledge, CAN understand Genesis. Dan 12:4

God created a perfect world which consisted of heaven/air, ground without form/dust and water. Gen 1:1-2 Adam's firmament, which God called Heaven, was made in the midst or immersed in WATER. Gen 1:6-8 Our 2nd Heaven/Universe was made the next Day/Age in the midst of the ground without form/DUST of Heaven. That's God's Truth Scripturally in Genesis.

Adam's world was "clean dissolved" in the flood. Isa 24:19 ll Peter 3:6
The present Universe will be burned. ll Peter 3:10
The 3rd Heaven, ll Cor 12:2, with it's streets of Gold and Gates of Pearl, will be forever. It's also called the New Heaven and New Earth in Rev 21:1.

You still make no sense. You're also adding to this nonsense with more nonsense made up from whole cloth.

 

[Aman777]

You still make no sense. You're also adding to this nonsense with more nonsense made up from whole cloth.

False accusation since I listed supporting Scripture for my views. Now, it's your time to refute me (prove me wrong) either Scripturally, Scientifically or Historically. You cannot, but go ahead and try and learn something in the process. Amen?

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

False accusation since I listed supporting Scripture for my views. Now, it's your time to refute me (prove me wrong) either Scripturally, Scientifically or Historically. You cannot, but go ahead and try and learn something in the process. Amen?

Done that already. Not just me though Aman, but pretty much everyone has at some point demonstrated you to be wrong on your reinterpretations and assumptions. You just don't want to accept the fact.

 

[Yonny Costopoulis]

Where did these prehistoric people get their superior intelligence? Certainly NOT from mindless Nature. Some would have us believe that we "evolved" our superior intelligence over time with numerous mutations, all leading us to have our wonderful minds, which are much superior to ANYthing Nature has.

Please provide evidence that it is impossible for a child to be more intelligent than the parent. Because if child can be higher intellect than parent, and that happens many time (which million years gives us much time for), then it is demonstrated that nature can produce creature with superior intelligence.

So question is: Can a child be more intelligent than parents?

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Hey @Divide, you haven't forgotten me now, have you? I'm Particularly interested to know what God literally whispered in your ear...

Well, Spirits can step in and out of our natural realm.

How do you know this?

I differentiate Ghosts because they are deceiving spirits in disguise, whereas spirits are the real thing, whether good or evil.

How do you know this?

I know they exist because I am fairly well aquainted with God's Holy Spirit,

How do you know it's God's Holy Spirit?

and...I have had some evil spirits try to scare me one night by jiggling my bedroom doorknob. There was no one there to be able to do that. I was alone.

How do you know this?

It didn't work, I ordered them away (laughing) in the name of Jesus, and they went away.

Could there be another reason for your experience?

Oh, plus one time God's Spirit spoke to me audibly...so there's that.

O.O

sooooo..... How do you know it was your God? Could it have been another Supernatural being? How would you tell them apart? ....and out of interest, what mind-blowing tidbit of information was imparted upon you during this audible experience?

I don't really qualify ghosts as spirits because it is a deception that our dead loved ones can come to us. (They're dead)

How do you know this?

 

[Aman777]

Done that already. Not just me though Aman, but pretty much everyone has at some point demonstrated you to be wrong on your reinterpretations and assumptions. You just don't want to accept the fact.

False and everyone can see your deceptive ways since you cannot repeat your "supposed" refute. IF you had refuted me in any way, I'm sure that you would have saved the refute, but you didn't, and you cannot. All you can do is be like Trump.

 

[Aman777]

So question is: Can a child be more intelligent than parents?

That's not the question since a dummy can have a smart child. The question IS:

How and When did mindless Nature change prehistoric people into Humans (descendants of Adam)? Godless evolutionists forget that Nature produces changes in intelligence through sex. Leaving this fact, these people are pushing the idea that once upon a time, it happened a an entirely different way, not shown in any other living creature. They push the fantasy story that Humans (descendants of Adam) evolved from the common ancestor of Apes.

When you ask them where the common ancestor of Apes came from, they dodge the answer and say from it's parents. When you ask them where the Universal Common Ancestor of ALL life came from, they dodge and say, that's not evolution. They speak with forked tongues. Can you help them explain the process? apart from sex?

 

[HitchSlap]

False and everyone can see your deceptive ways since you cannot repeat your "supposed" refute. IF you had refuted me in any way, I'm sure that you would have saved the refute, but you didn't, and you cannot. All you can do is be like Trump.

For the umpteenth time...

G1/2 were written by unknown persons... G1 is older by 200-300 years than G2, and both accounts are Hebrew twists on earlier creation myths. History, science, anthropology, geology, and every other branch of science in no way supports the biblical creation myth.

The power of a myth is in the story... it tells us something about ourselves.

and poof, just like that... Amen?!

 

[Yonny Costopoulis]

That's not the question since a dummy can have a smart child. The question IS:

How and When did mindless Nature change prehistoric people into Humans (descendants of Adam)? Godless evolutionists forget that Nature produces changes in intelligence through sex. Leaving this fact, these people are pushing the idea that once upon a time, it happened a an entirely different way, not shown in any other living creature. They push the fantasy story that Humans (descendants of Adam) evolved from the common ancestor of Apes.

When you ask them where the common ancestor of Apes came from, they dodge the answer and say from it's parents. When you ask them where the Universal Common Ancestor of ALL life came from, they dodge and say, that's not evolution. They speak with forked tongues. Can you help them explain the process? apart from sex?

I am not sure what you are saying or how much knowledge you lack. Could you please answer a question or two so we can find out?

Are you not aware of the very complete fossil record from our common ape ancestor to mankind?

Nature is mindless, but it works through Natural Selection. Are you aware of this, and do you understand how natural selection works?

 

[Aman777]

For the umpteenth time...

G1/2 were written by unknown persons... G1 is older by 200-300 years than G2, and both accounts are Hebrew twists on earlier creation myths. History, science, anthropology, geology, and every other branch of science in no way supports the biblical creation myth.

The power of a myth is in the story... it tells us something about ourselves.

and poof, just like that... Amen?!

False, since your view is the SAME as ancient theologians who lived thousands of years before Science. Where is your refute? All you have posted are the changeable thoughts of men who haven't learned anything in the past 5,000 years. Your limited knowledge cannot explain the Fact that God tells us He made at least 3 universes by the 3rd Day. Science hasn't learned that yet. Nor have you.

 

[Aman777]

Are you not aware of the very complete fossil record from our common ape ancestor to mankind?

Sure. The descendantcy of the common ancestor was interrupted 11k years ago when Noah's grandsons had NO other Humans to marry. They married and produced children, like Cain on Adam's Earth, with the sons of God (prehistoric people) who diverged from Chimps some 6 Billion years ago. Gen 6:4 and Gen 10:10

Nature is mindless, but it works through Natural Selection. Are you aware of this, and do you understand how natural selection works?

God tells us He "created" life from water on the 5th Day (3.8 Billion years ago in man's time). The creatures descended with modifications over time within a population. More than 150 years ago, a group of Godless people CHANGED that Scriptural Fact into "everything that came forth from water is Natural". Reminds me of a Trumpism. If you don't like the word, lie about it.

 

[bhsmte]

Priceless stuff.

 

[Yonny Costopoulis]

Sure. The descendantcy of the common ancestor was interrupted 11k years ago when Noah's grandsons had NO other Humans to marry. They married and produced children, like Cain on Adam's Earth, with the sons of God (prehistoric people) who diverged from Chimps some 6 Billion years ago. Gen 6:4 and Gen 10:10

So you are apparently not aware of the very complete fossil record showing how mankind evolved from a common ape ancestor.

Before we can have a meaningful conversation, you must learn some facts, or I will be arguing with the wind. Please visit a good Natural History museum and read a University level book on the Theory of Evolution. It is impossible to understand and discuss this topic without that understanding.

God tells us He "created" life from water on the 5th Day (3.8 Billion years ago in man's time). The creatures descended with modifications over time within a population. More than 150 years ago, a group of Godless people CHANGED that Scriptural Fact into "everything that came forth from water is Natural".

God does not tell us this. The bible states it, but the bible is written by man. Not just 150 years go, but at the beginning as well. This is what I understand from the best biblical scholars. Please note that almost all are Christians.

Reminds me of a Trumpism. If you don't like the word, lie about it.

It is always the pleasant surprise to discover common ground while having a discussion.

EDIT: I did the quick google search, and found this in wikipedia (Which is not the best source, but it does reflect what I have learned. If you have different testimony, please present it.)

Wikipedia:
In the 20th century the vast majority of theologians, both Catholic and Protestant, moved away from the divine dictation model and emphasised the role of the human authors.As a result, even many conservative scholars now accept, for example, that the Book of Isaiah has multiple authors and that 2 Corinthians is two letters joined together.

 

[Aman777]

So you are apparently not aware of the very complete fossil record showing how mankind evolved from a common ape ancestor.

The sons of God (prehistoric people) evolved from the common ancestor which came from Water. Humans were made from the dust of the ground Billions of years BEFORE. Gen 2:4-7 On another world. Gen 1:6-8 Which was destroyed in the flood. ll Peter 3:3-7 Our blood was contaminated when Noah's grandsons married and produced children with the prehistoric people who were here 11k years ago, when the Ark arrived.

God does not tell us this. The bible states it, but the bible is written by man. Not just 150 years go, but at the beginning as well. This is what I understand from the best biblical scholars. Please note that almost all are Christians.

Christians believe by Faith. In the last days, God is going to pour out His Spirit of Truth upon "ALL" flesh Act 2:17 including Atheists, Agnostics and Phonies. Currently, God is fulfilling His promise through the discoveries of Science, since that's the only way to get through to hard headed unbelievers. God Bless you

 

[Phred]

The sons of God (prehistoric people) evolved from the common ancestor which came from Water.

Please stop butchering the occasional scientific term that you learn along the way. When you say "common ancestor" you're not using that term even close to correct. You don't know what it means. For example, there was a creature that is the ancestor of both chimpanzees and human beings. It's our common ancestor. So when you say, "the common ancestor" you're just showing how ridiculously ignorant you are of the subject. "the common ancestor" of what? What two species??? And "came from Water. That's just nonsense. Literally from water? Out of water? That means NOTHING.

Humans were made from the dust of the ground Billions of years BEFORE. Gen 2:4-7 On another world.

No. That's just nonsense too. There's no evidence of this. There's no way that humans got here from wherever you think they came from. Humans haven't been around for BILLIONS of years. We've only been around for hundreds of thousands of years. On THIS world. We EVOLVED here. There's genetic evidence and fossil evidence. Your particular interpretation of a story is incorrect at best.

Gen 1:6-8 Which was destroyed in the flood. ll Peter 3:3-7 Our blood was contaminated when Noah's grandsons married and produced children with the prehistoric people who were here 11k years ago, when the Ark arrived.

Uh huh. And when Bugs Bunny digs under the ground he goes from country to country in mere moments because I've seen him do it.

Christians believe by Faith. In the last days, God is going to pour out His Spirit of Truth upon "ALL" flesh Act 2:17 including Atheists, Agnostics and Phonies. Currently, God is fulfilling His promise through the discoveries of Science, since that's the only way to get through to hard headed unbelievers. God Bless you

Whatever you need to believe to get you though the day. I'm sorry, you find the Bible and you read far more into it than I've seen others do and you expect me to either believe you or be ridiculed by you. Neither option is acceptable. You're wrong scientifically and you're incorrect Biblically by any Christian interpretation I've come across. So don't expect me to give your versions of this any credence.

 

[HitchSlap]

False, since your view is the SAME as ancient theologians who lived thousands of years before Science. Where is your refute? All you have posted are the changeable thoughts of men who haven't learned anything in the past 5,000 years. Your limited knowledge cannot explain the Fact that God tells us He made at least 3 universes by the 3rd Day. Science hasn't learned that yet. Nor have you.

I agree, there is no evidence for the shiitake you post.