Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

[tas8831]

Trump? How would I know what Trump has in his heart? I've never met the man or talked to him. I am well aware that many Christians say that he...had a visitation from the Lord and the Lord put him in office...Is it absolutely true? I have no proof of that one way or the other. Am I inclined to believe it?! You bet I am. The fix was in! Hillary was supposed to win, all monies had been paid! Then Trump won...Huh. So it could very well be so what they say. Why do you think she's so [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] that she lost?! God jerked the rug out from under her! That's funny.

But I don't have any proof for you guys. So, who knows?

So you are a conspiracy theorist. Didn't see that coming....

Yes, so funny that she lost. Pity that actual vote tallies don't matter in our outdated system.

She is no prize, but seeing as how the Orange Buffoon looks to be up to his eyeballs in criminal mischief - and what with his love of wealth - not sure how a Christian could possibly support him.

Of course, it seems pretty obvious to me that modern Christianity is more about wealth and power and not so much God's Kingdom and all that jazz.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Of course, it seems pretty obvious to me that modern Christianity is more about wealth and power and not so much God's Kingdom and all that jazz.

Absolutely. And franky, I don't think it does history justice to just single out "modern" christianity.

The catholic church is one of the richest organizations in the world. And they don't produce or sell anything. Their wealth is entirely the result of sucking money from their followers.

Been to the Vatican lately? It's very beautifull for sure. It's also extremely decadent. Gold everywhere. Worth billions. All paid for by the "faithful". And that's just one location. Let's not forget all the Cathedrals accross Europe, which notoriously depleted all treasuries. To the point where most of the cathedrals were never actually finished buildings. Because the money would run out before completion of the construction.

Take the cathedral of antwerp, belgium, for example. Here's what it looks like:

Here's how it was supposed to look like:

But the money ran out. So they quickly slapped a silly looking roof on it, because that was the only thing for which there was enough money left.

And then, the entire region plummeted into economic disaster. With starvation of many as a direct result.

"money well spend".

Sure, it's nice to look at, uhu.
Thousands died horrible deaths, to build that unecessary thing.

I guess we Antwerp folks may be glad that we managed to at least finish one tower. Many other cities didn't even succeed in that...

Yet another unfinished cathedral. Yet another city that went bankrupt (with the inevitable famines and starvation that again followed).

Throughout history, churches have been sucking their flock dry.

 

[Divide]

Since there is no way to demonstrate that the old appearance of the planet/universe is fraudulent when you factor in an omnipotent being, it's pointless to bring up.

Wait a minute...there is a way to demonstrate it. "I" can not demonstrate it for "you" though. Scripture talks about the war within us. The flesh body vs the spirit.

Now, the flesh body is our logical thinking mind. We've been trained to have formulated thinking. You know this better than most, being educated. We preform experiments, observe, record the results...then we expect it to happen the same way again the next time. We're usually right, but not always. We get used to being able to repeat results and they work a certain way. If it doesn't work that way, reject it, there's no proof, it don't make sense, da da da. Right?

Now, the spirit man within us is totally illogical. He is the one who...falls in Love with (whoever). When men fall in love, they go insane. You're a girl, I'm sure you've seen this! When women fall in love, they go insane too. Why would she ever go for a guy like THAT? Right?

When you hug the person that you love, it's almost electrical. When the two spirit's merge in a hug, they become one and begin resonating this union of spirits. It's on a different frequency and feels good! Better than when I am alone. I (presume) that everyone here has been in love before, so you all should know what I am talking about. The point here, is, this is proof (already demonstrated to you) that we have a spirit within us. It is us, not your educated formulated thinking. Your spirit is real. The spirit realm is real. And our logical thinking has nothing to do with it whatsoever. If it did, she wouldn't like bad boys and would marry for power or money, lol.

Stay with me on this, I'm takin' a roundabout way into your demonstration, setting foundation. Now, the word of God says that...well, here:

1 Corinthians 2:13-15
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.../(KJV)

This is telling us that our formulated thinking and educated flesh mind will never understand about God because God is a Spirit, and spiritual matters are spiritually discerned. So one first has to, for the sake of the "experiment", set aside everything you "know" in your thinking mind. Then you engage your spirit (the same one that fell in love that one time, that said, I don't care what people say, I love him...!) and then you focus on God and pray and ask Him to reveal Himself to you. To talk to you, come visit! I want to meet you...

and then wait. Focused on Him and with no distractions. Not checking your email while you wait, not cooking. Not having told him come knock on the door and I'll drop what I'm doing and we can talk...No, He wont come. Drop everything first.

Now, your flesh man (formulated thinking) will begin squirming and screaming at you. He wont come, my cousin had an experience and it was after this or that happened so it's supposed to happen like this or that...No. He is a real person and not a formula or being only associated with "events" or miracles every single time. He is alive and dynamic. Real.
So you tell your flesh to shut up, and continue to wait and be open to your spirit and receiving God's Spirit. It's almost guaranteed to not happen like you *think* it will, or should. God is love, Love is not logical, so set that aside.

God knows your heart and your mind. You do this enough and I guarantee you'll get your demonstration right there in the comfort of your own home. He did it for me, He'll do it for you. But the word is, that He wants to be sure that you are serious and really really want to meet Him. If you are not, then you will not get it. Another thing is that, they say 1000 of our years is like a day with God. So...if the Lord tells you, wait a minute, it may be a couple years, lol!

 

[DogmaHunter]

Wait a minute...there is a way to demonstrate it. "I" can not demonstrate it for "you" though

Then you can't demonstrate it.
It's one or the other, not both.

Now, the flesh body is our logical thinking mind. We've been trained to have formulated thinking. You know this better than most, being educated. We preform experiments, observe, record the results...then we expect it to happen the same way again the next time. We're usually right, but not always. We get used to being able to repeat results and they work a certain way. If it doesn't work that way, reject it, there's no proof, it don't make sense, da da da. Right?

Now, the spirit man within us is totally illogical. He is the one who...falls in Love with (whoever). When men fall in love, they go insane. You're a girl, I'm sure you've seen this! When women fall in love, they go insane too. Why would she ever go for a guy like THAT? Right?

Your poetic descriptions of human beings and their potentially irrational emotions, has no relevancy to the points being discussed.

I (presume) that everyone here has been in love before, so you all should know what I am talking about

yes, it's called dopamine, serotonin, oxytocin, etc

The point here, is, this is proof (already demonstrated to you) that we have a spirit within us.

No. They are brain functions.
Not "ghosts" or "spirits" or whatever abstract label you wish to slap on it.
Poetically, you can call them that.

But in reality, it's your brain doing what it does.

Your spirit is real.

If by "spirit" you mean a poetic labeling of the physical brain, I agree
If by "spirit" you mean some kind of ghost that exists independently of the brain, then no.

The spirit realm is real

Evidence for this claim?

Stay with me on this, I'm takin' a roundabout way into your demonstration, setting foundation. Now, the word of God says that...well, here:

1 Corinthians 2:13-15
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.../(KJV)

This is telling us that our formulated thinking and educated flesh mind will never understand about God because God is a Spirit, and spiritual matters are spiritually discerned. So one first has to, for the sake of the "experiment", set aside everything you "know" in your thinking mind. Then you engage your spirit (the same one that fell in love that one time, that said, I don't care what people say, I love him...!) and then you focus on God and pray and ask Him to reveal Himself to you. To talk to you, come visit! I want to meet you...

and then wait. Focused on Him and with no distractions. Not checking your email while you wait, not cooking. Not having told him come knock on the door and I'll drop what I'm doing and we can talk...No, He wont come. Drop everything first.

Now, your flesh man (formulated thinking) will begin squirming and screaming at you. He wont come, my cousin had an experience and it was after this or that happened so it's supposed to happen like this or that...No. He is a real person and not a formula or being only associated with "events" or miracles every single time. He is alive and dynamic. Real.
So you tell your flesh to shut up, and continue to wait and be open to your spirit and receiving God's Spirit. It's almost guaranteed to not happen like you *think* it will, or should. God is love, Love is not logical, so set that aside.

God knows your heart and your mind. You do this enough and I guarantee you'll get your demonstration right there in the comfort of your own home. He did it for me, He'll do it for you. But the word is, that He wants to be sure that you are serious and really really want to meet Him. If you are not, then you will not get it. Another thing is that, they say 1000 of our years is like a day with God. So...if the Lord tells you, wait a minute, it may be a couple years, lol!

Sounds like a combination of preaching and an invitation for self-deception.

 

[Divide]

again has no relevance to what the science is actually all about and how biology actually works.

Exactly. That's what I was saying to Sarah. It can not be understood, pinned down, or proven by science, it is a different aspect of life. We are Body-soul-spirit. This is something that is not body, it is spirit. The Bible even says that this will be foolishness to the flesh mind. Of course you think I'm stupid, because you are trying to discern spiritual matters with your formulated thinking, and it can't be done. So...you've never been in love before?

 

[Divide]

So instead of Hillary, your god thought it would be better to put a narcistic sociopath in power with a long history of harassing women, dating porn stars while his actual wife is pregnant and who's on tape while saying about women "you just grab them by the *kitten*" (kitten, because I'm guessing that the actual word he used, will be censored here), and who is nothing short of a proven pathological liar?

So what are you trying to say? That you are a better man than he is? I don't buy that. So he's a man. They aired his dirty laundry. Your has not been on the news like his has and you darn sure are not going to tell us what it is! We're all on the same level. You may have your favorite sins, he may have his. But it's like Josey Wales said to the kid in Unforgivin...We all got it comin', kid...

So your point is not even relevant that, Oh my god, Trump is a man, he likes women...so what? He's also smart enough to have made billions of dollars. Can you say that? I can't.

If you are sinless, go ahead and cast the first stone at Trump. If you are not sinless, you're out of line, lol.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Exactly. That's what I was saying to Sarah. It can not be understood, pinned down, or proven by science, it is a different aspect of life.

You say "exactly" and then proceed to contradict the point. That doesn't make any sense.

We are Body-soul-spirit

Evidence for this claim?

This is something that is not body, it is spirit. The Bible even says that this will be foolishness to the flesh mind

Why should I care what the bible says?

Of course you think I'm stupid, because you are trying to discern spiritual matters with your formulated thinking, and it can't be done. So...you've never been in love before?

I have no need for undemonstrable, undetectable supernatural things, to explain human emotion.

 

[Divide]

That is not at all what he said. Read it again.

Well Duh! He quipped at me so I quipped at him. Don't be obtuse brother.

 

[Divide]

Then you can't demonstrate it.
It's one or the other, not both.

Oh come on man. You couldn't even follow what I was saying? You do the demonstration, (ask for it) not me.
God revealed Himself to me in ways that I was able to understand that it is real...but not in such ways that I can go demonstrate it to some airheads like a magic show.
You want me to part the sea for you or something? Geez.

But in reality, it's your brain doing what it does.

Neo...wake up. The Matrix has you.

You mean to tell me that you can't even discern reality?

If by "spirit" you mean a poetic labeling of the physical brain, I agree
If by "spirit" you mean some kind of ghost that exists independently of the brain, then no.

Ok, so you choose the blue pill.
If you think that when that sweet girl that comes up and embraces you and says I love you, then focuses her spirit upon you doesn't affect you, then you my friend are being very short sighted. Her spirit will even affect your flesh body and brain, yes! It is that strong. But there's a whooole 'nother side of life going on right then. You trying to reduce your wife and her love down to an equation?! Wow man, just wow.

Sounds like a combination of preaching and an invitation for self-deception.

Sounds like you want everyone else to tell you how life is supposed to be, and never want to open your eyes and look for yourself.

 

[DogmaHunter]

So what are you trying to say?

Why would a (benevolent) god want a pathological liar, woman abuser and narcistic sociopath as the head of a super power? What good could possibly come from it?

That you are a better man than he is?

I can confidently answer that question with a very loud, very confident YES.
For starters, I actually respect women, I am not a narcistic sociopath and I am not a pathological liar.

I don't buy that. So he's a man. They aired his dirty laundry.

I'm a man. I'm not sleeping around with pornstars and playboy bunnies while my wife is having my child. I would never just "grab women by the *kitten*" nore would I ever suggest to anyone to do that.

The guy doesn't just have dirty laundry. The guy IS dirty laundry.

Your has not been on the news like his has

Nore could it ever be. Because I have no such laundry.
I don't force myself on women, nore do I publicly utter easily refuted lies.

and you darn sure are not going to tell us what it is!

If I were to become a celebrity, then the worst thing the media could write about me, is that I am somewhat of a pothead and that's it.

So your point is not even relevant that, Oh my god, Trump is a man, he likes women...so what?

Wow!

So here's a guy who is your president, who's being accused by plenty of women that he forces himself on them, who dates pornstars while his wife carries his child, who has "so much respect" for women that he suggests (with a smile on his face) that you just have to "grab them by the *kitten*" and you say............. "so what"?????????

He's also smart enough to have made billions of dollars.

Correction......
He inherited a fortune. He's not a self-made rich person. He started out rich.

I founded my own company. I started with nothing. Well, not nothing. I started with 3500 euro and attracted investment of 60k. Today, my initial 3500 is worth around 150k.
If when I started out I had 3.5 million instead of 3.5k, then my 3.5 million would have been worth 100 million. I would have been able to hire an army of developers (instead of just 1) and the release of our software product would have been global instead of regional.

I would have been able to move a LOT faster and thereby make a lot more money in far less time.

Making a bundle while starting with nothing, is hard work and slow (depending on what you do, off course).

Assuming a marketable idea and a viable business model, making a bundle "squared" while starting with a bundle.... that's easy. You'ld have to really mess it up big time in order to fail.

Can you say that? I can't.

I hope I will be able to one day.
Trump however, can't say that. He's not a self made guy. He's one of those guys who was born in a golden crib and then melted a part of it to replace it with diamonds later on.

If you are sinless, go ahead and cast the first stone at Trump. If you are not sinless, you're out of line, lol.

1. I don't subscribe to your concept of "sin".
2. I'm certainly not perfect, but that doesn't mean that I can't make moral judgements. It's not like I'm being a hypocrit or something. As said, it wouldn't even occur to me to fool around with someone else when my wife is carrying my child - let alone with a bunch of hookers (yeah... i don't buy for a second that that pornstar and playboy playmate had a "love" affair with Mr Orange for his beautiful eyes).

 

[Divide]

You say "exactly" and then proceed to contradict the point. That doesn't make any sense.

No I did not. It's merely that you will not accept that we have a spirit and it so it must be that it's all in your head and a chemical rush. You couldn't be further from the truth. So in reality, your "Wife" doesn't really love you? You just get a hit of dopamine and that's it, that all it is and means?!

Evidence for this claim?

Ok, so you have never been in love before. So I can't.

Why should I care what the bible says?

So you don't even really give a crap about anything and even really knowing truth. Totally closed mind. Have you hugged your scientist today?

I have no need for supernatural things, to explain human emotion.

Ok fair enough. So stop replying to me and my posts because that is the direction that it takes, whether you choose to see that or not.

 

[Divide]

Why would a (benevolent) god want a pathological liar, woman abuser and narcistic sociopath as the head of a super power? What good could possibly come from it?



I can confidently answer that question with a very loud, very confident YES.
For starters, I actually respect women, I am not a narcistic sociopath and I am not a pathological liar.



I'm a man. I'm not sleeping around with pornstars and playboy bunnies while my wife is having my child. I would never just "grab women by the *kitten*" nore would I ever suggest to anyone to do that.

The guy doesn't just have dirty laundry. The guy IS dirty laundry.



Nore could it ever be. Because I have no such laundry.
I don't force myself on women, nore do I publicly utter easily refuted lies.



If I were to become a celebrity, then the worst thing the media could write about me, is that I am somewhat of a pothead and that's it.



Wow!

So here's a guy who is your president, who's being accused by plenty of women that he forces himself on them, who dates pornstars while his wife carries his child, who has "so much respect" for women that he suggests (with a smile on his face) that you just have to "grab them by the *kitten*" and you say............. "so what"?????????



Correction......
He inherited a fortune. He's not a self-made rich person. He started out rich.

I founded my own company. I started with nothing. Well, not nothing. I started with 3500 euro and attracted investment of 60k. Today, my initial 3500 is worth around 150k.
If when I started out I had 3.5 million instead of 3.5k, then my 3.5 million would have been worth 100 million. I would have been able to hire an army of developers (instead of just 1) and the release of our software product would have been global instead of regional.

I would have been able to move a LOT faster and thereby make a lot more money in far less time.

Making a bundle while starting with nothing, is hard work and slow (depending on what you do, off course).

Assuming a marketable idea and a viable business model, making a bundle "squared" while starting with a bundle.... that's easy. You'ld have to really mess it up big time in order to fail.



I hope I will be able to one day.
Trump however, can't say that. He's not a self made guy. He's one of those guys who was born in a golden crib and then melted a part of it to replace it with diamonds later on.



1. I don't subscribe to your concept of "sin".
2. I'm certainly not perfect, but that doesn't mean that I can't make moral judgements. It's not like I'm being a hypocrit or something. As said, it wouldn't even occur to me to fool around with someone else when my wife is carrying my child - let alone with a bunch of hookers (yeah... i don't buy for a second that that pornstar and playboy playmate had a "love" affair with Mr Orange for his beautiful eyes).

You just told me...you don't give a crap anyway. So no answer needed here because you wont even try to understand anything except what you already are embracing. Have a good day.

 

[Divide]

1. I don't subscribe to your concept of "sin".
2. I'm certainly not perfect, but that doesn't mean that I can't make moral judgements. It's not like I'm being a hypocrit or something. As said, it wouldn't even occur to me to fool around with someone else when my wife is carrying my child - let alone with a bunch of hookers (yeah... i don't buy for a second that that pornstar and playboy playmate had a "love" affair with Mr Orange for his beautiful eyes).

1. Huh. How 'bout that? I've not described my concept of sin on this board! (I've described my concept of God only)

2. What? No sexual sins before you ever got married? No lust? liar. Lol. We have all done that. So Trump hires the high payed girls, lol?! I've never paid a woman in my life (in that manner). I've been married once. We have two kids. I wasn't getting laid when she was having the babies or out drinking with my friends. I was there for the birth of both of my sons. I never cheated on her. She became my first (and only to date, lol!) Wife and we were married 26 years.

So I know a little bit about walking with honor. But I'm as guilty as the next guy about integrity or the lack thereof. And so are you. We all got it comin' kid...

 

[Divide]

My Wife used to love it when I grabbed her by the kitten.

 

[tas8831]

Absolutely. And franky, I don't think it does history justice to just single out "modern" christianity.

The catholic church is one of the richest organizations in the world. And they don't produce or sell anything. Their wealth is entirely the result of sucking money from their followers.

Been to the Vatican lately? It's very beautifull for sure. It's also extremely decadent. Gold everywhere. Worth billions. All paid for by the "faithful". And that's just one location. Let's not forget all the Cathedrals accross Europe, which notoriously depleted all treasuries. To the point where most of the cathedrals were never actually finished buildings. Because the money would run out before completion of the construction.

Take the cathedral of antwerp, belgium, for example. Here's what it looks like:

View attachment 225864

Here's how it was supposed to look like:

View attachment 225865


But the money ran out. So they quickly slapped a silly looking roof on it, because that was the only thing for which there was enough money left.

And then, the entire region plummeted into economic disaster. With starvation of many as a direct result.

"money well spend".

Sure, it's nice to look at, uhu.
Thousands died horrible deaths, to build that unecessary thing.

I guess we Antwerp folks may be glad that we managed to at least finish one tower. Many other cities didn't even succeed in that...

View attachment 225866

Yet another unfinished cathedral. Yet another city that went bankrupt (with the inevitable famines and starvation that again followed).

Throughout history, churches have been sucking their flock dry.

All very true. Then there are the millionaire pastors of megachurches, etc. Sickening.

 

[Divide]

Evidence for this claim?

There was a time period in my marriage that, me and my Wife were so much in love and so close...that we could talk telepathically. We did demonstrate it too, I remember now. We could be talking about one subject audibly and then look at the other one, change the subject and ask a different question of her or something, inaudibly.

We did demonstrate a few times because it was so cool. But, that was a long time ago, she jumped ship so there'll be no demonstration for you, lol! SHe don't love me no more and is in a different state.

But! If this happened to me and my Wife, then...we can't be the only people in the world who this ever happened to! I would think that, someone on this board has been that much in love before?

Science notwithstanding, It sure pays to...know thyself. Science is there, in the bigger picture.

 

[DogmaHunter]

1. Huh. How 'bout that? I've not described my concept of sin on this board! (I've described my concept of God only)

When a theist mentions the word "sin", especially in a sentence like "casting the first stone", it's pretty clear what you mean. I don't subscribe to your religious concepts.

2. What? No sexual sins before you ever got married? No lust? liar.

"liar"? Did I say I didn't have sex before getting married? Or that I didn't have lust?
As a matter of fact, I live together with my woman, with whom I've been involved for twenty years now, and we have a lovely son. And we're not married.

But these would be your religious concepts of sin to which I do not subscribe.
I don't consider it a problem to have sex without being married. I do consider it a problem to have sex with someone while being involved with someone else. If that someone else is even about to give birth to your kid while you are cheating, just makes it that much worse.

What kind of a horrible person would you have to be, to do that?
And it's not like it was an opportunistic "heat of the moment" kind of thing (which I don't consider that much better though). No, it was a very deliberate effort of seeking out women, carefully planned out and everything.

What kind of a horrible person do you have to be, to do something like that?

Lol. We have all done that. So Trump hires the high payed girls, lol?!

While involved with someone else, who's even carrying their child. And don't forget all the times he forced himself on women (or at least tried to).

I've never paid a woman in my life (in that manner). I've been married once. We have two kids. I wasn't getting laid when she was having the babies or out drinking with my friends. I was there for the birth of both of my sons. I never cheated on her. She became my first (and only to date, lol!) Wife and we were married 26 years.

Good for you.

So I know a little bit about walking with honor. But I'm as guilty as the next guy about integrity or the lack thereof. And so are you. We all got it comin' kid...

How you dare to defend a man like Trump who behaves like he does, is beyond me.

 

[DogmaHunter]

My Wife used to love it when I grabbed her by the kitten.

Trump wasn't talking about his wife, when he said that. The point exactly.

 

[DogmaHunter]

There was a time period in my marriage that, me and my Wife were so much in love and so close...that we could talk telepathically. We did demonstrate it too, I remember now. We could be talking about one subject audibly and then look at the other one, change the subject and ask a different question of her or something, inaudibly.

We did demonstrate a few times because it was so cool. But, that was a long time ago, she jumped ship so there'll be no demonstration for you, lol! SHe don't love me no more and is in a different state.

But! If this happened to me and my Wife, then...we can't be the only people in the world who this ever happened to! I would think that, someone on this board has been that much in love before?

Science notwithstanding, It sure pays to...know thyself. Science is there, in the bigger picture.

Unverifiable anecdotes, aren't evidence. They are just more claims.
You don't support a claim, by piling on even more claims.

 

[Tayla]

And it is always... ALWAYS... 'arguments' against evolution.

NEVER arguments FOR creation/ID.

What good is it to provide good sound arguments when the conclusions are always ignored out of hand? Anyway, here are two:

Argument #1 for young earth creationism (notice the word "evolution" doesn't appear):

1. The Bible is provably the inerrant word of God.
2. The Bible clearly and unambiguously teaches young earth creationism.
3. Therefore, young earth creationism is true.

Argument #2 for young earth creationism:

1. Evolution claims via long time periods with its mutations and gene copying errors.
   
2. I am yet to find any evidence that the long time periods are sufficient for such complex biological systems to evolve. The probability of such a thing occurring is zero and evolutionists can't say otherwise.
   
3. Therefore, the only explanation for evolution via long time periods is intelligent design which intervenes to perform the required mutations and gene copying errors.
4. In considering how an intelligent designer could accomplish such a task, two possibilities come to mind: (1) Top-down: God is a micro-manager and choreographs every smallest detail, or (2) Bottom-up: the molecules themselves have intelligence and check in with God to learn what they should do next.
   
5. Since neither option is reasonable, the only possible conclusion is young earth creationism.