Why is there a secular music part to a Christian site?

[blackwasp]

Blackwasp, I find your comments about Bono offensive and I would no matter who you said them about. But for the record, if Bono's not a Christian, we're all off to Hell.

Introduction to the Psalms by Bono: http://enterprise.is.tcu.edu/~bplate/introreligion_files/bono.htm

I don't see anywhere in that link where Bono claims that salvation is through Christ alone. Although he mentioned a lot of "religious" points, mainly it was about music.

If Bono is not a christian, then why are we all off to Hell?

 

[blackwasp]

The same things that are great about anything that helps people suffer and die less.

As noble as that sounds, we've decided that that is meaningless unless the individual is led by the Spirit.

I mean, do you give a starving man a sandwich, or a sermon? What you're saying here is effectively like saying to someone who's just fed a starving person "if you were a Christian you would've shared the gospel"....

This is EXACTLY what I was talking about.....

What is the point of giving a starving person a sandwich and leaving? Have you prolonged their starvation by a week? Offer them living water so that they won't thirst again. Sheez...you can share the gospel and give a sandwich.

Quick bible quiz. James says pure religion before God is.... what?

Hmm, I believe you are referring to the passage about "faith without works is dead" etc, etc. However, works without faith is nothing.

 

[blackwasp]

Well, Bono sent two Christian books to Noel Gallagher and his Girlfriend called "Searching for the Invisible God" and "What’s so amazing about Grace?" Apparently he talked to them about God, for three hours.


http://www.almenconi.com/news/apr02/042602.html

This link does nothing but add to the lack of clarity in this discussion. Bono says that we have to go to God and ask Him to work with us? How can we equate this with the fact that God draws us, and upon salvation we are a new creation?

 

[xtxArchxAngelxtx]

why is a news and current events thread?

**yawns**

 

[Grover143]

How did this thread turn into a "IS BONO SAVED?" thing. :topic:

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS SECULAR.......PERIOD......GET OVER IT!!!

Sorry...

Couldn't hold it in any longer .

 

[nadroj1985]

Go get 'em Grover!!!!

 

[blackwasp]

How did this thread turn into a "IS BONO SAVED?" thing. :topic:

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS SECULAR.......PERIOD......GET OVER IT!!!

Sorry...

Couldn't hold it in any longer .

There was a very long post towards the beginning posted by the individual who started the thread that made many claims about Bono, therefore I think that this is still somewhat on topic.

How is there no such thing as secular? Secular is non-christian.

 

[nadroj1985]

How is there no such thing as secular? Secular is non-christian.

See post 106.

 

[blackwasp]

See post 106.

That is one person's opinion. If there should be no distinction between christianity and the rest of the world then why are we called to be separate of the world? Why was Jesus initially sent to preach only to the Jews? The idea of separating from the world is very christian; it did not begin with the greek philosophers. However, I believe that some christians have taken this too far and created a subculture that is unbiblical. However, I think that stating there is no such thing as secular is a bit inaccurate.

 

[nadroj1985]

That is one person's opinion. If there should be no distinction between christianity and the rest of the world then why are we called to be separate of the world? Why was Jesus initially sent to preach only to the Jews? The idea of separating from the world is very christian; it did not begin with the greek philosophers.

The point isn't that there should be no difference between Christians and non-Christians. We're talking about entertainment here, and in that arena, there is not necessarily any such thing as secular because some music that is secular to one person can be Christian to another, and vice versa.

 

[EliasEmmanuel]

As noble as that sounds, we've decided that that is meaningless unless the individual is led by the Spirit.

Okay, wait.... as far as whether X or Y person is saved, yes, it's meaningless. Works cannot save. But are you actually saying that That it would be "meaningless" to feed the hungry, clothe the naked and give sacrificially to those in need?

What is the point of giving a starving person a sandwich and leaving? Have you prolonged their starvation by a week? Offer them living water so that they won't thirst again. Sheez...you can share the gospel and give a sandwich.

That was my point exactly. You seemed to be coming at it from the perspective that meeting people's tangible needs is secondary or unimportant.

Hmm, I believe you are referring to the passage about "faith without works is dead" etc, etc. However, works without faith is nothing.

Why are you arguing against something I'm not arguing FOR?

Works can't save. They never could. They never will. I firmly believe that. But I hope you're not saying that anything but missions is a waste of time, or that showing Christ's love tangibly ("Do justly, love mercy") isn't as important.

 

[EliasEmmanuel]

That is one person's opinion. If there should be no distinction between christianity and the rest of the world then why are we called to be separate of the world? Why was Jesus initially sent to preach only to the Jews? The idea of separating from the world is very christian; it did not begin with the greek philosophers. However, I believe that some christians have taken this too far and created a subculture that is unbiblical. However, I think that stating there is no such thing as secular is a bit inaccurate.

It is absolutely Christian to be seperate from the world. The point of the "no secular" idea that I and others have propounded is that we're called to be seperate by love, character and holiness, not culture, and that there is pretty much nothing in this world that God is totally incapable of using (because everything was made by God and for God). You can see my full thoughts on this in post#123 on page 13.

 

[EliasEmmanuel]

Well, Bono sent two Christian books to Noel Gallagher and his Girlfriend called "Searching for the Invisible God" and "What’s so amazing about Grace?" Apparently he talked to them about God, for three hours.

And he has great taste in authors too, apparently :-D

 

[blackwasp]

Elias, I think we are in agreement more than it seems.

 

[blackwasp]

The point isn't that there should be no difference between Christians and non-Christians. We're talking about entertainment here, and in that arena, there is not necessarily any such thing as secular because some music that is secular to one person can be Christian to another, and vice versa.

How can someone who is not a christian produce something that is christian? I don't believe he/she can. I do, however, believe that a christian can relate something in a secular song to their christian walk. There are certain lyrics that I can relate to my christian walk in Black Sabbath songs! Despite this, I don't think this eliminates the labels of secular and christian in music. I don't believe that one is better than another, but a difference exists. I'm not saying it is a complete dichotomy, as certain bands ride the fence, but a separation is still legitimate.

 

[brettnolan]

How can someone who is not a christian produce something that is christian?

I don't have the evidence immediately at hand...but I would say that this has happened plenty, especially in the music world. You, yourself, have said how easy it is to produce a polished pop song. How much harder can it be to produce a polished gospel song? You may have noticed the increase in athletes and entertainers "giving the glory to God," while barely dressed and grinding on every living being in sight.

 

[blackwasp]

How can someone who is not a christian produce something that is christian?

I don't have the evidence immediately at hand...but I would say that this has happened plenty, especially in the music world. You, yourself, have said how easy it is to produce a polished pop song. How much harder can it be to produce a polished gospel song? You may have noticed the increase in athletes and entertainers "giving the glory to God," while barely dressed and grinding on every living being in sight.

Hmm, a truely genuine "gospel" song would probably need to be written by a christian, but I'm sure that that is not necessary for the CCM.

 

[PreacherFergy]

What is so great about contributing money to AIDS relief? Works on our own are nothing but filthy rags to God. If Bono was a christian and cared so much for those people, then why wouldn't he share the gospel? Why wouldn't he pour his money into missions instead?

Great point!

Also, who is this Tony Campolo guy? He's supposed to be a Christian pastor? I'd leave the church in a heart beat if he couldn't "bridle" his tongue anymore than that ("this man's religion is vain," <---that verse from James ring a bell? *ding* *ding* *ding*)

Face it people, U2 isn't a Christian band, and from what I've seen, they're not Christian themselves, just religious

Edit:
By the way, from a scriptural viewpoint, I think Bono should recant/repent publickly for cursing on national telivision. If he were a true Christian, something like,

"I have sinned against my Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ. I'm terrible sorry that I portayed a pathetic Christian testimony on national telivision. . .etc"

 

[EliasEmmanuel]

Great point!

Please see my response to it. How, scripturally, is feeding the hungry and caring for the sick a less "Christian" thing to do than preaching a sermon? And again, how do we know that Bono doesn't support missional AIDS relief work (Like Jars of Clay do, with their Blood-Water Mission)? Don't judge by appearances.

Also, who is this

Tony Campolo guy? He's supposed to be a Christian pastor? I'd leave the church in a heart beat if he couldn't "bridle" his tongue anymore than that ("this man's religion is vain," <---that verse from James ring a bell? *ding* *ding* *ding*)

What, for calling people to the carpet for caring more about a "dirty word" than about thousands of people dying? Thank you for proving his point.....

Also, for having no idea who the guy is you're sure quick to dismiss his faith entirely over a little 4 letter word.

Face it people, U2 isn't a Christian band, and from what I've seen, they're not Christian themselves, just religious

Examples?

By the way, from a scriptural viewpoint, I think Bono should recant/repent publickly for cursing on national telivision. If he were a true Christian, something like,

"I have sinned against my Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ. I'm terrible sorry that I portayed a pathetic Christian testimony on national telivision. . .etc"

Personally, I'd be more pleased if, say, Pat Robertson recanted and repented for owning a diamond mine in a despot-led african nation (and maintaining that said despot, who had a tendancy to kill people he didn't like, was a good Baptist)or TBN repented for suing their neighbors for exorbitant amounts of money for trimming their ficus trees without permission. You wanna talk about "pathetic christian witness", there's a thousand things Christians do every day that contradict the teachings of Jesus and make him look bad more than letting a "bad word" slip.

Talk about swallowing camels and choking on gnats....

 

[Neenie]

He claims to be a Believer, "U2 singer Bono made a clear confession before about three dozen evangelicals. "He said, 'I'm a believer and I have faith in Christ,' " recalls Richard Cizik, vice president for governmental affairs for the National Association of Evangelicals" http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2002/005/14.18.html

Also Bono states religion is the enemy of God, he is not a religious person. I not saying anymore. believe what you want to believe.


Also "PreacherFergy" get off your high horse!!!!!!!! I wish i could call you a non-Christian, but i would break forum rules.