Why is "MAGA" offensive?

[Hazelelponi]

(Kenyan Marxist).

President Obama's Marxist-Leninist Economics: Fact And Fiction

 

[whatbogsends]

And then along came Obama.

Yes, the debt skyrocketed under Obama. However, not by as high an increase (%) as Reagan, Bush I or Bush II.
----------------------------------------
Barack Obama: Added $8.588 trillion, a 74-percent increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget, FY 2009.

George W Bush: Added $5.849 trillion, a 101-percent increase from the $5.8 trillion debt at the end of Clinton's last budget, FY 2001.

Bill Clinton: Added $1.396 trillion, a 32-percent increase from the $4.4 trillion debt at the end of George H.W. Bush's last budget, FY 1993.

George H.W. Bush: Added $1.554 trillion, a 54-percent increase from the $2.857 trillion debt at the end of Reagan's last budget, FY 1989.

Ronald Reagan: Added $1.86 trillion, a 186-percent increase from the $998 billion debt at the end of Carter's last budget, FY 1981.

Which President Increased U.S. Debt the Most?

Note: George H.W. Bush "only" increased it by 54%, but that was in 4 years, so his per-year rate is slightly over George W. Bush.

So you can "then along came Obama" as much of you want, but he was handed a crashing economy and didn't even raise the rate of increase as much as Bush or Reagan. And it was mostly his first 3 years after inheriting the mess. His rate over the last 5 years improved.

 

[bèlla]

So all the arguments against violent video games and rap music lyrics are nonsense? Advertisers spend billions for nothing because people can't be influenced? Affirmations don't work? Cult leaders don't exist? Jim Jones was a myth? Why do we renew our minds in the Word? Are pastors who tell us to avoid certain TV shows and movies because of how they can influence our lifestyle and make us susceptible to sin by normalizing and glorifying certain behaviors wrong?

The keyword in my response is susceptibility. I am not advocating sin or foolishness. One person hears heavy metal and enjoys the song and the next wants to commit suicide. There's a reason for that and to ignore it and place the blame solely on the source is wrong.

Have you ever watched the interviews with cult survivors or the ones from the Jones group? There is one question that's always asked. What made you get involved? The interviewer is drawing us into the person's mindset at the time of their engagement. Because our rational self is saying, "what the heck were you thinking?"

I'm very familiar with cult groups and how their leaders think. I've delved deep in that subject and all kinds of mind control and brainwashing too. I'm not disputing the reality that their methods are diabolical. But buy-in is a must. Whether the message addresses pain, provides escape, validates a belief, or provides the onus to do something you've considered. It always connects with the other person in an intimate way.

The reason we are told to avoid those things by pastors is because the mind is the gateway. That's what Satan targets and it's the same thing evil people work on too. They're looking for a place of weakness and need that they can occupy with themselves.

I spent one year being demonically tortured. He worked on my mind constantly. Nevertheless, I did not ingest his suggestions. Because in my core that's NOT who I am. He glorified evil in ways no human should ever witness and did things I would never discuss. But I did not follow his lead. I never yielded to him. My confusion about God's existence didn't minimize the fact that I loved Him. Satan could never take His place.

So, when I say there must be susceptibility I'm speaking from experience. I had King Kong on my neck for one year. And if he could not break me through the grace and strength the Lord provided. No marketing ad or political rhetoric will sway me unless it testifies to something I carry within.

That's how influence works. We can be threatened and bullied into acting but that's another thing. I know what marketers do. I'm self-employed and use it myself. However, there is a negative side to the practice that exploits your weaknesses for their gain. So we should be careful. I agree.

People respond differently, and your threshold may be different than others, but don't tell me people can't and aren't being influenced. We even have folks around here parroting Trump lies and talking points like they're gospel, becoming insensitive to the suffering of others when it is someone who doesn't look or worship like them, denying the Christian love and compassion we are supposed to show to others.

There was a recent thread about sexual sin that I posted on. And I think it factors in our discussion. We often see the fruit of bad behavior and can name a few spiritual influences that are evident. But that is never the root. Remember Christ's words about the strongman. That's what I addressed in the thread. Knowing the root takes a lot of digging. Understanding behavior requires us to grasp its trigger and cause.

According to your comments you're seeing insensitivity in others and they're sharing remarks you feel are inappropriate. At first glance one could say their insensitivity is a spirit of pride and self-deception may be present. But it's more complicated than it appears. It's a many-layered beast. Picture a wedding cake.

You are glimpsing the top level but the structure has been strengthening itself over time. It's the bottom layer that's the issue. It's the one that's controlling everyone. It supports the structure. That's the strongman. He's the hidden mastermind and taking him out is hard. You need to go beneath the surface.

Arguments and accusations aren't the way. We need to speak to one another in love and be willing to hear the other. To listen. There are many reasons why something resonates with one person more than the other. Knowing these reasons are important. Especially if their root is negative or evil. We will have a new arsenal in our tool belt that we didn't have before.

I am listening to you. I have listened to the others. I have heard President Trump speak. I've heard President Obama and some of his predecessors. Listening allows me to determine if their words and fruit testify to my spirit. And I wait for the Holy Spirit's input.

I will say this and end. This issue has divided Christians. I am observing the same behavior I witnessed in the past on a secular site. And there was nothing redeeming about its content. It is unfortunate to watch.

No matter how passionate I am about a topic. It does not change the divinity of my audience. It doesn't give me permission to treat my brother or sister with disrespect. It doesn't give me a right to make jabs and barbs. One would hope our brotherhood would inspire a different approach. How are we different?

God bless and thank you for sharing your heart.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Context context context...

Reagan's "great again" was a reference to turning around the worsening economy...

Trump's "great again" was a reference to a very different, more divisive, premise...

 

[rambot]

1) Because Trump himself never really defined it in a meaningful way. And in doing that, he created a vaccuum that allowed people to create their own definition for the phrase.

To more directly answer the question:
2) I don't find it offensive. I find it stupid. I find "loaded" nationalism (so, pumped up, not even necessarily extreme nationalism) to be the liquor of the fool.
It is a base response that invites racism and all forms of prejudice.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Trump is hated by Democrats because he's a Republican POTUS.

 

[bèlla]

I think we'd find greater common ground if we addressed the subject in a different way. By focusing solely on the president or whatever issue at hand it creates an either or dynamic. You will have a portion of the audience in favor and those that are opposed. There's no middle ground.

Hearing requires something more. If you stated your opinion by referencing yourself and placing it in a human context that the person interacting with you can relate to the results are better. It is impossible to understand the other person if you don't know where they're coming from.

If you stated I feel this way because of a personal experience, event, background, or whatever you wish to share. It is possible for the other to empathize and see your point of view. But if you relegate it to a good versus bad debate you'll have an endless round robin.

Knowing the other person's story makes a difference.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Trump is hated by Democrats because he's a Republican POTUS.

Nonsense. He'd be an embarrassment as a Democrat. That he calls himself a Republican is about the only thing I like about the guy.

 

[camille70]

The keyword in my response is susceptibility. I am not advocating sin or foolishness. One person hears heavy metal and enjoys the song and the next wants to commit suicide. There's a reason for that and to ignore it and place the blame solely on the source is wrong.

Have you ever watched the interviews with cult survivors or the ones from the Jones group? There is one question that's always asked. What made you get involved? The interviewer is drawing us into the person's mindset at the time of their engagement. Because our rational self is saying, "what the heck were you thinking?"

I'm very familiar with cult groups and how their leaders think. I've delved deep in that subject and all kinds of mind control and brainwashing too. I'm not disputing the reality that their methods are diabolical. But buy-in is a must. Whether the message addresses pain, provides escape, validates a belief, or provides the onus to do something you've considered. It always connects with the other person in an intimate way.

The reason we are told to avoid those things by pastors is because the mind is the gateway. That's what Satan targets and it's the same thing evil people work on too. They're looking for a place of weakness and need that they can occupy with themselves.

I spent one year being demonically tortured. He worked on my mind constantly. Nevertheless, I did not ingest his suggestions. Because in my core that's NOT who I am. He glorified evil in ways no human should ever witness and did things I would never discuss. But I did not follow his lead. I never yielded to him. My confusion about God's existence didn't minimize the fact that I loved Him. Satan could never take His place.

So, when I say there must be susceptibility I'm speaking from experience. I had King Kong on my neck for one year. And if he could not break me through the grace and strength the Lord provided. No marketing ad or political rhetoric will sway me unless it testifies to something I carry within.

That's how influence works. We can be threatened and bullied into acting but that's another thing. I know what marketers do. I'm self-employed and use it myself. However, there is a negative side to the practice that exploits your weaknesses for their gain. So we should be careful. I agree.



There was a recent thread about sexual sin that I posted on. And I think it factors in our discussion. We often see the fruit of bad behavior and can name a few spiritual influences that are evident. But that is never the root. Remember Christ's words about the strongman. That's what I addressed in the thread. Knowing the root takes a lot of digging. Understanding behavior requires us to grasp its trigger and cause.

According to your comments you're seeing insensitivity in others and they're sharing remarks you feel are inappropriate. At first glance one could say their insensitivity is a spirit of pride and self-deception may be present. But it's more complicated than it appears. It's a many-layered beast. Picture a wedding cake.

You are glimpsing the top level but the structure has been strengthening itself over time. It's the bottom layer that's the issue. It's the one that's controlling everyone. It supports the structure. That's the strongman. He's the hidden mastermind and taking him out is hard. You need to go beneath the surface.

Arguments and accusations aren't the way. We need to speak to one another in love and be willing to hear the other. To listen. There are many reasons why something resonates with one person more than the other. Knowing these reasons are important. Especially if their root is negative or evil. We will have a new arsenal in our tool belt that we didn't have before.

I am listening to you. I have listened to the others. I have heard President Trump speak. I've heard President Obama and some of his predecessors. Listening allows me to determine if their words and fruit testify to my spirit. And I wait for the Holy Spirit's input.

I will say this and end. This issue has divided Christians. I am observing the same behavior I witnessed in the past on a secular site. And there was nothing redeeming about its content. It is unfortunate to watch.

No matter how passionate I am about a topic. It does not change the divinity of my audience. It doesn't give me permission to treat my brother or sister with disrespect. It doesn't give me a right to make jabs and barbs. One would hope our brotherhood would inspire a different approach. How are we different?

God bless and thank you for sharing your heart.

I agree with what you have said. The fact is people ARE susceptible. Some are hurting and want someone to blame. Others are fearful of demographic changes. Some are struggling, not getting ahead, don't understand why, and Trump is telling them it's because of Mexicans and trade. Some have a legitimate fear of terrorism. Or crime. Some don't feel like they are respected enough. Or their religion. Or their place in society. Some don't like seeing others who they feel are less than themselves doing well. The underlying theme to most of it is fear, which we are commanded over and over again in the bible to not do.

I have made conscious choices to avoid certain things because of how it makes me feel, how it makes me think of others or because I want to avoid being so comfortable with certain behaviors that it comes out in my daily speech and how I react to things.

I commend you for overcoming what you have faced. In my experience very few people question why they do something or think something. I have very little confidence that people are sitting down and reflecting on WHY they are doing something or responding in a certain way. Many just absorb what they hear without question. I feel Trump has influenced many, and not for the better. I see evidence of this far too regularly to rule it out.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Nonsense. He'd be an embarrassment as a Democrat. That he calls himself a Republican is about the only thing I like about the guy.

When Bush was POTUS he was hated by Dems as much as they now hate Trump. And one day when we get a new Republican POTUS after Trump then they'll say Trump wasn't as bad the new one.

 

[Strathos]

President Obama's Marxist-Leninist Economics: Fact And Fiction

Summarize what you are trying to convey here.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

When Bush was POTUS he was hated by Dems as much as they now hate Trump. And one day when we get a new Republican POTUS after Trump then they'll say Trump wasn't as bad the new one.

Maybe you guys should seek to elect better presidents.

 

[Strathos]

When Bush was POTUS he was hated by Dems as much as they now hate Trump. And one day when we get a new Republican POTUS after Trump then they'll say Trump wasn't as bad the new one.

Only if the new one is someone like David Duke or Steve King.

 

[rambot]

Trump is hated by Democrats because he's a Republican POTUS.

Personally, I have already explained why I think Trump is a terrible, terrible president and it has very little to do with him being Republican. It is the quality of his character that makes him unfit to be president.

And frankly, I have a hard time with people who argue the opposite and assume that they are unable to properly judge character. And to be honest, they are more likely to support his boorish,graceless and mean behaviours BECAUSE he has a R behind his name.

If a democrat president acted this way, I'd say the same thing. He is a human of low moral virtue. Just as worthy of God's grace as anyone, but far too narcissistic to consider anything more powerful than him.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Only if the new one is someone like David Duke or Steve King.

Dems will treat any Republican POTUS as they are treating Trump. We know this just by the fact that that's how they've treated every Republican POTUS of recent memory.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Summarize what you are trying to convey here.

That saying someone who foists Marxist economic policies on the American people is Marxist (in their philosophy for America) isn't doing more than saying if it walks like a duck then calling it a duck isn't a big stretch of the imagination.

And Obama was of Kenyan parentage, so pointing it out also isn't a stretch. It seems you have an issue with truth.

 

[rambot]

Dems will treat any Republican POTUS as they are treating Trump. We know this just by the fact that that's how they've treated every Republican POTUS of recent memory.

Trump is getting, MUCH, MUCH, MUCH harsher treatment than any President I have come across.

And fair enough. He invites it on himself.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Trump is getting, MUCH, MUCH, MUCH harsher treatment than any President I have come across.

And fair enough. He invites it on himself.

Bush was treated with just as much hate by Hollywood and other left-wing media.

 

[cow451]

Trump is getting, MUCH, MUCH, MUCH harsher treatment than any President I have come across.

And fair enough. He invites it on himself.

He has earned every syllable of it.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Bush was treated with just as much hate by the Hollywood and other left-wing media.

No. I don't think so. The venom against Trump (and anyone who supports him) is unprecedented in my lifetime.

I'm really believing at this point we are close to civil war, and there is no help for it.

The only time nations become this polarized is before civil war..