Why is Hell permanent?

[Stealth001]

ATTENTION Stealth001:

Hear ye the word of God:

Luke 16:22-28 (NASB)
22 "Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. 23 "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.' 25 "But Abraham said, 'Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. 26 ~'And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.' 27 "And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father's house— 28 for I have five brothers—in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

All we can conclude from this passage is that the rich man died and found himself in torments. We also discover that the wicked cannot exit these torments at will, nor can the righteous cross over and be with those in Hell. We know that the wicked do not wish these torments to befall those they love and care about.

I agree with everything in this passage. However, I also agree with this passage:

Luke 12:46-48

King James Version (KJV)

46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.
47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

​

It's obvious that the rich man knew the Lord's will, for he speaks of brothers that Abrahm states has possession of the law and the prophets (the law of Moses and the prophetic writings). Therefore, I submit to you that if BOTH passages be true... the rich man is receiving "many stripes". Those who did not know the Father's will are going to receive fewer stripes. None the less, at some point their torments will end.

Colossians 1: 16 and 20.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

​

He shall truly reconcile ALL THINGS (no exceptions) to Himself.

Here YE the Word of the LORD.

 

[Stealth001]

ATTENTION Stealth001:

Hear ye the word of God:

Luke 16:22-28 (NASB)
22 "Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. 23 "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.' 25 "But Abraham said, 'Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. 26 ~'And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.' 27 "And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father's house— 28 for I have five brothers—in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

If you refuse to believe that some will receive many stripes and others will receive fewer stripes... rip Luke 12:46-48 out of your Bible after reading this post. Or... you can receive the Word of the Lord and realize that Jesus was sent to save the world... and indeed He has succeeded and that those who knew the Father's will shall therefore be punished longer than those who didn't.

Jesus came to save the world...

John 12:47. And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

​

If Jesus didn't truly save the entire world... He failed His mission. Did He not?

If the entire world will not be reconciled to God through Jesus Christ... and Jesus came to reconcile the entire world to the Father... how can you claim that Jesus succeeded???

And if you admit that Jesus came to save the world, but the world will not be saved, you have to admit that you are essentially stating that Jesus failed. If one believes that God will loose the majority of the human race to un-ending torture, or vaporize them, you have a God who failed to save His creation.

My God is victorious through the cross. Sin and Satan will have won... NOTHING.

 

[dollarsbill]

All we can conclude from this passage is that the rich man died and found himself in torments. We also discover that the wicked cannot exit these torments at will, nor can the righteous cross over and be with those in Hell.

From the eternal fire???

We know that the wicked do not wish these torments to befall those they love and care about.

GASP! SHOCK!

I agree with everything in this passage. However, I also agree with this passage:

Luke 12:46-48

King James Version (KJV)

46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.
47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

​

It's obvious that the rich man knew the Lord's will, for he speaks of brothers that Abrahm states has possession of the law and the prophets (the law of Moses and the prophetic writings). Therefore, I submit to you that if BOTH passages be true... the rich man is receiving "many stripes". Those who did not know the Father's will are going to receive fewer stripes. None the less, at some point their torments will end.

Colossians 1: 16 and 20.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

​

He shall truly reconcile ALL THINGS (no exceptions) to Himself.

Here YE the Word of the LORD.

The bottom line: The lost die and are alive in the fire, without escape.

 

[dollarsbill]

If you refuse to believe that some will receive many stripes and others will receive fewer stripes... rip Luke 12:46-48 out of your Bible after reading this post. Or... you can receive the Word of the Lord and realize that Jesus was sent to save the world... and indeed He has succeeded.

John 12:47. And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

​

If Jesus didn't truly save the entire world... He failed His mission.

If the entire world will not be reconciled to God through Jesus Christ... and Jesus came to reconcile the entire world to the Father... how can you claim Jesus that succeeded???

And if you admit that Jesus came to save the world, but the world will not be saved, you have to admit that you are essentially stating that Jesus failed.

If YOU refuse to believe that ETERNAL means FOREVER then why do you believe in ETERNAL life?

 

[Stealth001]

If YOU refuse to believe that ETERNAL means FOREVER then why do you believe in ETERNAL life?

Because "eternal" (aionos) is an adjective. lol It relates to it's subject. Slow down and "think" about this. In Matthew 25:46 Jesus spoke of "everlasting punishment" or "eternal punishment". The Greek term is "aionos kolasis", meaning, "eternal correction". What is a "correction"? A "correction" is a chastisement designed to "correct" it's object. To make something "correct". We "correct" our children. Discipline is painful, but it makes them better. The root of "kolasis" (translated "punishment") is "kolazo", meaning to "prune", as when one prunes a bush or a vine to make it grow better. Therefore an "eternal correction" is a punishment designed to bring an eternal result. Else we'd have a "correction" that never succeds in correcting! lol

The Greek word "aionos" (eternal, or "of the age/ages") is used elswhere in the Scriptures. Let's incert the idea of "eternity" or "eternal" into these verses. Do they make sense? Consider the N. T. use of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]aion[/FONT][/FONT]. Does eternity make any sense in the following passages? To make my point unmistakable, I have translated the Greek word [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]aion [/FONT][/FONT]with the English word eternity.

What will be the sign…f the [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]end of the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Mt. 24:3)?
I am with you…o the [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]end of the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Mt. 28:20).
The sons of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]are more shrewd (Lu. 16:8).
The sons of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]marry (Lu. 20:34).
Worthy to attain [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]that [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Lu. 20:35).
Since [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]began [/FONT][/FONT](Jn. 9:32; Ac. 3:21).
Conformed to [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Ro. 12:2).
Mystery kept secret [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]since the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]began [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]but now [/FONT][/FONT]made manifest (Ro. 16:25-26).
Where is the disputer of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](1Co. 1:20)?
Wisdom of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia], [/FONT][/FONT]nor of the rulers of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT]ordained [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]before the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternities (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT]which none of the rulers of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT](1Co. 2:6-8)
Wise in [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]([/FONT][/FONT]1Co. 3:18).
​

As you can see... the terms "eternal" or "eternity" (aion, aionos) can be translated many ways. It all depends on it's subject and context. The term "kolasis" with regards to "eternal punishment" is key. It's the "kolasis" that is eternal. And since "kolasis" means "correction" as in a "pruning" (kolazo), it's the correction wrought upon the subject that is eternal, not the correcting itself.

Get it?

 

[Stealth001]

If YOU refuse to believe that ETERNAL means FOREVER then why do you believe in ETERNAL life?

If you propose that the "eternal correction" (Matthew 25:46) is a correcting that continues throughout all eternity... you have a correction that fails to correct. That isn't the concept in the Greek of the text. You can only have an "eternal correction" if the correction made endures throughout all ages. Hence the use of "theion" (brimstone), a sacred incense used to purify, when speaking of the phrase "the lake of fire AND brimstone".

 

[dollarsbill]

As you can see... the terms "eternal" or "eternity" (aion, aionos) can be translated many ways.

MANY???

Matthew 25:46 (NASB)
46 "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

NEVER ending.

 

[Stealth001]

If YOU refuse to believe that ETERNAL means FOREVER then why do you believe in ETERNAL life?

So, with all that was said in the two previous posts we realize that the correction wrought upon the wicked is one that endures throughout the ages... and the life given to the righteous is one without a correction that endures throughout the ages.

 

[Stealth001]

MANY???

Matthew 25:46 (NASB)
46 "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

NEVER ending.

You couldn't order hot dog in a Greek restaurant. LOL

Again, "aionios" is an adjective that modifies "kolasis" (a formal noun) meaning "correction". Therefore, it's the correction that endures throughout all ages... not the correcting itself. lol Jeesh. Take a Greek lesson.

So, in Matthew 25:46, we have the wicked entering into a period of correction wherein the results will last forever. You also have the righteous entering a life without correction that lasts forever.

 

[dollarsbill]

So, with all that was said in the two previous posts we realize that the correction wrought upon the wicked is one that endures throughout the ages... and the life given to the righteous is one without a correction that endures throughout the ages.

There is ZERO reason to believe that Hell Fire results in correction.

 

[Stealth001]

There is ZERO reason to believe that Hell Fire results in correction.

I'll paste the entry concerning the "lake of fire and brimstone" (the word "brimstone") from the Strong's...

Strong's Greek Definition for # 2303

2303 // yeion // theion // thi'-on //

probably of 2304 (in its original sense of flashing); TDNT - 3:122,*; n n

AV - brimstone 7; 7

1) brimstone
1a) divine incense, because burning brimstone was regarded as having power to purify, and to ward off disease

​

So let's translate this as the Greek mind would read it....

Revelation 20:10

King James Version (KJV)

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and (purifying incense) , where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for (ages) and (ages).


​

Nothing here demands that the tormens be un-ending. In fact, the very Greek terms imply a punishment that will end at some unspecified point. Why? Because "brimstone" purifies.

 

[Stealth001]

If YOU refuse to believe that ETERNAL means FOREVER then why do you believe in ETERNAL life?

Concerning Matthew 25:46 and the Greek term "kolasis" (punishment/correction) let's review what William Barclay, world-renowned Greek scholar, translator, and author of the popular Bible commentary had to say in, The Daily Study Bible and New Testament Words:

The Greek word for punishment here [Mt. 25:46] is
​

[FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]kola-sis[/FONT][/FONT], which was not originally an ethical word at all. It originally meant the pruning of trees to make them grow better. I think it is true to say that in all Greek secular literature [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]kolasis [/FONT][/FONT]is never used of anything but remedial punish-ment.6
​

William Barclay also wrote concerning "aionios":

The simplest way to put it is that [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]aionios [/FONT][/FONT]cannot be used properly of anyone but God; it is the word uniquely, as Plato saw it, of God. Eternal punishment is then literally that kind of remedial punishment which it befits God to give and which only God can give.11
​

So now... that's a world renown Greek scholar my friend. lol

 

[Sadalmelik]

Bro... the Bible states:

1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

​

It's God's will and desire to save all men. Am I in error if I believe He can do it???

1 Timothy 4:10
For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

​

God is the Saviour of all men, especiall we who believe. Therefore, I just accept it.

Here's the deal, many of those who go to Hell (whatever one believes about it) will go there because they rejected Christ and the Gospel. That's THEIR choice. But the vast majority of mankind that are religated to Hell because they never heard the Gospel. Out of those who do hear, far more people reject the notion of God over the idea of eternal torture (an evil worse than the Holcaust) than the notion that God justly punishes and corrects the soul. Please understand... no one truly "knows" beyond a doubt. That's why it's called "faith". We simply put our faith and trust in that which glorifies God and truly expresses His character. To some... they think God's character is one that would torture people forever... even those who never had a chance to hear. Yet others believe that God's character is one that would vaporize people out of existence after torments...even those who never had a chance to hear. Me... I'm inclined to believe that God knows how to purify the human soul. And I believe that it's through the cross of Jesus that God gains this leverage to deal with every soul. I'll also add... if a soul refuses to bow and confess that Jesus is Lord... if they continue to harbor rebellion and hatred against God... they will remain in the flames. So, if anyone burns forever... it's because they've chosen to and have resisted God even in the death. Remember... even David wrote that if he made his bed in hell (the grave, the state of death), God is there.

Here's an interesting verse...

Revelation 14:10
The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
​

Notice the torments of the wicked are "in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb". Imagine with me... every time you approach the throne of Christ in eternity... off to the left you can see a fiery pit of blazing fire and brimstone. In it you can hear your lost loved one's screaming in agonies. And Jesus wants you to bow and worship Him... because that could have been you. How can you worship a God like that? A mother can hear her daughter who never heard the truth burning forever? A son can hear his father who never heard the truth burning forever? A sister can hear a brother who left Christianity over being abused in church burn forever? Every time she comes into Christ's presence?

No. That's not right. You know it. I know it.

Now... if we know that Hell is God's Hell. He created it for a purpose. And we know that through it God is working corrective punishment upon those we love, we can rejoice before Him, praying that they be reconciled to us soon.

God is love. Love holds no record of wrongs. Love does demand justice. Love doesn't torture.

although i dont agree 100% with everything you say, this makes sense and only shows the realities of what it means when people say they believe in eternal hellfire, its absolutely amazing to me how anyone could believe the disgraceful idea, of bowing to Him, as He and His angels torture people off to the side of the thrown.....and its even more amazing anyone would want to honor a god like that......in fact they wouldnt, theyd only do it as fire insurance....there only problem is God could see thru that!

 

[Stealth001]

although i dont agree 100% with everything you say, this makes sense and only shows the realities of what it means when people say they believe in eternal hellfire, its absolutely amazing to me how anyone could believe the disgraceful idea, of bowing to Him, as He and His angels torture people off to the side of the thrown.....and its even more amazing anyone would want to honor a god like that......in fact they wouldnt, theyd only do it as fire insurance....there only problem is God could see thru that!

There is another issue that concerns me. People become what they worship. When the Catholic church made eternal torments a dogma, you'll notice a strong shift in their approach. They began to torment, torture, and murder those who opposed them. We see the same thing in radical Islam today. Among Evangelical Protestants that hold tightly to a never ending Hell you'll notice an "aloofness" towards those who don't hold their faith... often even with family. The notion that they will lose their friends and loved ones for eternity creates an emotional disconnect wherein those who knew them before their conversion testify that now they are just not as close and loving as before. In essence, they worship a God who can write people off into never ending Hell fire... they become able to write people off all too easily. Love begins to wane.

 

[Sadalmelik]

Because "eternal" (aionos) is an adjective. lol It relates to it's subject. Slow down and "think" about this. In Matthew 25:46 Jesus spoke of "everlasting punishment" or "eternal punishment". The Greek term is "aionos kolasis", meaning, "eternal correction". What is a "correction"? A "correction" is a chastisement designed to "correct" it's object. To make something "correct". We "correct" our children. Discipline is painful, but it makes them better. The root of "kolasis" (translated "punishment") is "kolazo", meaning to "prune", as when one prunes a bush or a vine to make it grow better. Therefore an "eternal correction" is a punishment designed to bring an eternal result. Else we'd have a "correction" that never succeds in correcting! lol

The Greek word "aionos" (eternal, or "of the age/ages") is used elswhere in the Scriptures. Let's incert the idea of "eternity" or "eternal" into these verses. Do they make sense? Consider the N. T. use of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]aion[/FONT][/FONT]. Does eternity make any sense in the following passages? To make my point unmistakable, I have translated the Greek word [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]aion [/FONT][/FONT]with the English word eternity.

What will be the sign…f the [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]end of the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Mt. 24:3)?
I am with you…o the [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]end of the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Mt. 28:20).
The sons of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]are more shrewd (Lu. 16:8).
The sons of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]marry (Lu. 20:34).
Worthy to attain [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]that [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Lu. 20:35).
Since [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]began [/FONT][/FONT](Jn. 9:32; Ac. 3:21).
Conformed to [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](Ro. 12:2).
Mystery kept secret [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]since the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT]began [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]but now [/FONT][/FONT]made manifest (Ro. 16:25-26).
Where is the disputer of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT](1Co. 1:20)?
Wisdom of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia], [/FONT][/FONT]nor of the rulers of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT]ordained [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]before the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternities (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT]which none of the rulers of [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal)[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]…[/FONT][/FONT](1Co. 2:6-8)
Wise in [FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]this [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]eternity (eternal) [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Georgia][FONT=Georgia,Georgia]([/FONT][/FONT]1Co. 3:18).
​

As you can see... the terms "eternal" or "eternity" (aion, aionos) can be translated many ways. It all depends on it's subject and context. The term "kolasis" with regards to "eternal punishment" is key. It's the "kolasis" that is eternal. And since "kolasis" means "correction" as in a "pruning" (kolazo), it's the correction wrought upon the subject that is eternal, not the correcting itself.

Get it?

 

[Stealth001]

I think many fail to understand that a translation isn't sacred. The Scriptures can only be said to be truly inerrant in their autographs. At least, that's the position I've come to believe. I used to believe in King James Only.

 

[Sadalmelik]

the problem here is many are so 'hung up' on their churches ideology of theologically brainwashing people, that they refuse to acknowledge anything to the contrary of what is spewed from the pulpit, they run home and look to their bibles to study and confirm sundays sermon of condemnation, never bother thinking to themselves....hmmmm, shall i go on listening to this rhetoric, or should i begin study on this myself....and listen and learn from others who have gotten off their lazy duffs and spent time researching and learning.

it should be no surprise in this day and age, of having everything at our fingertips, the spoiled west that we are, that we are far to busy to be bothered or troubled with ......wait......here it is........QUESTIONING our elders, and seeing if what they have been 'teaching' us for hundreds, almost thousands of years is actually what the word of God says. unfortunately, out of either laziness, apathy, or ignorance, they choose to go on believing in the dogmatic misinterpretation of scripture, which, like i said, truth be known, they are only believing out of fear.....not out of love. for no one could love a god who tortures someone endlessly and mercilessly without end, for no purpose, and no reason. they worship for one reason.....fire insurance.

 

[dollarsbill]

"No one could love a god who tortures someone endlessly and mercilessly without end."

He's right.

The Genesis Flood, burning Sodom alive, Try again.

 

[Stealth001]

Matthew 13:49-50 (NASB)
49 "So it will be at the end of the age; the angels will come forth and take out the wicked from among the righteous, 50 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

At the end of the "age" (aion, root of aionios). This proves my point, if you're into the Greek. The word "aionios" is best translated "ages" or "of the ages". When the Bible says "forever and ever" it more accurately means "for ages and ages".

I've never claimed that the wicked will be taken out from among the righteous. I've never claimed that they will not be thrown into a furnace of fire. I've never denied that they will experience torments. And these are the only things this verse mentions. However, I take it a bit further to explain the nature and purpose of that punishment based on the whole of Scripture.

 

[dollarsbill]

yes dollarsbill, its just my opinion......btw, do you ever right anything different?

Can someone translate?