Why do you believe in the evolution theory?

[DerelictJunction]

You cannot be biased and unbiased at the same time.

But you can take steps to minimize a bias that you recognize in yourself.

 

[JacksBratt]

Martyrs are generally labeled as such by their own groups. Radical Muslims call a suicide bomber a martyr then he's just as much a martyr as the ones in your group. It doesn't matter anyway. Your criteria for my bunny could be met given enough time. It still wouldn't make it true/valid/believable/not silly/ etc.

A martyr is not someone who pulls the trigger on their own life..... in order to take someone else'

Full Definition of MARTYR

1
: a person who voluntarily suffers death as the penalty of witnessing to and refusing to renounce a religion

2
: a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle

3
: victim; especially : a great or constant sufferer <a martyr to asthma all his life — A. J. Cronin>


It is not a conscious premeditated act of aggression toward others of a different view wherein you sacrifice yourself to accomplish it.

The victim's of suicide bombers are martyrs. The bomber is a premeditated weapon and murderer.

 

[DerelictJunction]

A martyr is not someone who pulls the trigger on their own life..... in order to take someone else'

Full Definition of MARTYR

1
: a person who voluntarily suffers death as the penalty of witnessing to and refusing to renounce a religion

2
: a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle

3
: victim; especially : a great or constant sufferer <a martyr to asthma all his life — A. J. Cronin>


It is not a conscious premeditated act of aggression toward others of a different view wherein you sacrifice yourself to accomplish it.

The victim's of suicide bombers are martyrs. The bomber is a premeditated weapon and murderer.

Then you don't think that a suicide bomber "sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle"?

 

[Belk]

This one should be acceptable to you.
ATTENTION: The scholarship of Kersey Graves has been questioned by numerous theists and nontheists alike; the inclusion of his The World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors in the Secular Web's Historical Library does not constitute endorsement by Internet Infidels, Inc. This document was included for historical purposes; readers should be extremely cautious in trusting anything in this book.

Sixteen Saviors Crucified

Perfect! Thank you very much.

Indeed. I am. However, do you think that being biased means you can't look at information in an unbiased way?

Yes, that is exactly what I think. Now that is not to say we cannot attempt to minimize our bias as much as possible but it is impossible for us to do so completely. It is especially hard for a single person to do so. The best methods employ as large a number of people as is practical.

Seems this is not only seen in Gish.

Unsurprisingly all humans share common characteristics. We even display the same fallacious tendencies. The hard part is recognizing the ones we do ourselves.

Are you claiming that certification is necessary for one to do research?

In no way, shape, or form. However, I am going to think the research of a research librarian more trustworthy then that of someone who has never opened a book before. Therefore I was trying to ascertain how much trust I should put into your research abilities.

 

[selfinflikted]

But you can take steps to minimize a bias that you recognize in yourself.

Of course. But minimized is not the same as unbiased.

 

[ThinkForYourself]

Kersey Graves is not a reputable researcher and has been shown to use false material.

The following might be moot, because we can use the God Osiris, who existed before Christ, and died and was resurrected.

So that proves my point that Jesus wasn't the first.


But I'm still interested in your claims that the article I quoted wasn't true.

You can make claims about the author, but really the only thing that matters is if the information article is correct, in particular the part I quoted below.

Please point out any falsehoods, and provide evidence for your claims:

About two thousand years before the Christian era Mut-em-ua, the virgin Queen of Egypt,was said to have given birth to the Pharaoh Amenkept(or Amenophis) III, who built the temple of Luxor, on the walls of which were represented:

1) The Annunciation: the god Taht announcing to the virgin Queen that she is about to become a mother.

2) The Immaculate Conception: the god Kneph (the holy spirit) mystically impregnating the virgin by holding a cross, the symbol of life, to her mouth.

3) The Birth of the Man-god.

4) The Adoration of the newly born infant by gods and men, includingthree kings (or Magi?), who are offering him gifts. In this sculpture the cross again appears as a symbol.

In another Egyptian temple, one dedicated to Hathor, at Denderah, one of the chambers was called "The Hall of the Child in his Cradle";and in a painting which was once on the walls of that temple, and is now in Paris, we can see represented the Holy Virgin Mother with her Divine Child in her arms. The temple and the painting are undoubtedly pre-Christian.

Therefore, we find that long before the Christian era there were already pictured -- in pagan places of worship -- virgin mothers and their divine children, and that such pictures included scenes of an Annunciation, an Incarnation, and a Birth and Adoration, just as the Gospels written in the second century A.D. describethem, and that these events were in some way connected with the God Taht, who was identified by Gnostics with the Logos.

 

[AV1611VET]

Then you don't think that a suicide bomber "sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle"?

Should we honor Japan's kamikaze pilots for their sacrifices at Pearl Harbor?

 

[Gracchus]

Should we honor Japan's kamikaze pilots for their sacrifices at Pearl Harbor?

Just a quibble, AV1611VET: There were no kamikaze pilots at Pearl Harbor, the Divine Wind did not begin to blow until late in the war.

 

[AV1611VET]

Just a quibble, AV1611VET: There were no kamikaze pilots at Pearl Harbor, the Divine Wind did not begin to blow until late in the war.

Uh-huh.

And Buddhist monks lit what? cigars to protest anti-Buddhist government programs?

 

[DerelictJunction]

Should we honor Japan's kamikaze pilots for their sacrifices at Pearl Harbor?

Kamikaze pilots are honored by both sides in that war.
Are you trying to say that because they were our enemy, the Japanese soldiers were bad people that had no honor?

 

[AV1611VET]

Kamikaze pilots are honored by both sides in that war.
Are you trying to say that because they were our enemy, the Japanese soldiers were bad people that had no honor?

Have a nice day.

 

[DerelictJunction]

Uh-huh.

And Buddhist monks lit what? cigars to protest anti-Buddhist government programs?

Non sequitur? or is there a connection to the conversation that I am not privy to?

 

[DerelictJunction]

Have a nice day.

....lives to fight another day.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

You mean, the writers of the Bible, to be clear.

Like Wonder Woman's jet:

Now you are adding to the Bible. Not just the power of invisibility, but the power of undetectibility.

Don't forget to add that in a very real sense, that outside of Christ we are pretty much invisible to God.

On another note, this invisible God has made himself known and that would of course be Jesus.

I'd definitely be careful to mock the divine attributes of God, for you are forgetting that God also lives in light unapproachable and is referred to as an all consuming fire. Yet, for reasons only known to God, God has chosen to reveal himself in Son. Whatever that means?

 

[JacksBratt]

The speed of light is slowing down.

If you repeated those same exact experiments with the same exact instruments YOU WOULD GET THE SAME RESULTS THAT THEY DID IN THE PAST. Why can't creationists understand this simple, simple concept?

Posted 10/6/99. A University of Toronto professor believes that one of the most sacrosanct rules of 20th-century science -- that the speed of light has always been the same - is wrong. Ever since Einstein proposed his special theory of relativity in 1905, physicists have accepted as fundamental principle that the speed of light -- 300 million meters per second -- is a constant and that nothing has, or can, travel faster. John Moffat of the physics department disagrees - light once traveled much faster than it does today, he believes. Recent theory and observations about the origins of the universe would appear to back up his belief. For instance, theories of the origin of the universe -- the "Big Bang"- suggest that very early in the universe's development, its edges were farther apart than light, moving at a constant speed, could possibly have traveled in that time. To explain this, scientists have focused on strange, unknown and as-yet-undiscovered forms of matter that produce gravity that repulses objects.
Moffat's theory - that the speed of light at the beginning of time was much faster than it is now - provides an answer to some of these cosmology problems. "It is easier for me to question Einstein's theory than it is to assume there is some kind of strange, exotic matter around me in my kitchen." His theory could also help explain astronomers' discovery last year that the universe's expansion is accelerating. Moffat's paper, co-authored with former U of T researcher Michael Clayton, appeared in a recent edition of the journal Physics Letters.
A University of Toronto Release. CONTACT: Bruce Rolston, U of T Public Affairs, (416) 978-6974

 

[Astrophile]

Some were before and some were after. Here are some pre-Jesus gods. There are also pre-Yahweh gods.

10 Christ-like Figures Who Pre-Date Jesus


And no, I'm not wrong about the virgin birth.

The Ancient Beginnings of the Virgin Birth Myth
"Therefore, we find that long before the Christian era there were already pictured -- in pagan places of worship -- virgin mothers and their divine children, and that such pictures included scenes of an Annunciation, an Incarnation, and a Birth and Adoration, just as the Gospels written in the second century A.D. describe them."

These websites may or may not be accurate. However, they would be more believable if they gave references for their assertions.

 

[JacksBratt]

Then you don't think that a suicide bomber "sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle"?

Are you saying that there is no difference between a suicide bomber and the Coptic Christians who were beheaded for not denouncing their faith in Christ?

Are you saying that a person who has a gun, put to their head, and then asked to denounce their faith or die, doesn't denounce their faith and is shot to death, is no different than a person who straps a bomb to their body and explodes it in a crowd of innocent people???????

If you are correct, a suicide bomber could go into a classroom of kindergarten kids of a different faith or belief and blow their self and everyone else up and they would ALL be martyrs.

That is one twisted view of martyrdom....

 

[Davian]

Don't forget to add that in a very real sense, that outside of Christ we are pretty much invisible to God.

I have no idea what you mean by the use of the phrase "in a very real sense" when "God" has not been established as "real".

On another note, this invisible God has made himself known and that would of course be Jesus.

Claims made by Jesus, or attributed to the character of Jesus, about any sort of divinity have yet to be substantiated.

I'd definitely be careful to mock the divine attributes of God,

I am only mocking how they are presented here, as arm waving motions that apparently are supposed to establish this clearly-visible-but-undetectable-something-or-other that cannot be defined as being more than imaginary.

for you are forgetting that God also lives in light unapproachable

Not omnipresent, then.

and is referred to as an all consuming fire.

But not subject to entropy, I am told. I am not buying purpetual motion machines this week, thanks.

Yet, for reasons only known to God, God has chosen to reveal himself in Son. Whatever that means?

If you don't know what that means, don't be looking at me.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Posted 10/6/99. A University of Toronto professor believes that one of the most sacrosanct rules of 20th-century science -- that the speed of light has always been the same - is wrong. Ever since Einstein proposed his special theory of relativity in 1905, physicists have accepted as fundamental principle that the speed of light -- 300 million meters per second -- is a constant and that nothing has, or can, travel faster. John Moffat of the physics department disagrees - light once traveled much faster than it does today, he believes. Recent theory and observations about the origins of the universe would appear to back up his belief. For instance, theories of the origin of the universe -- the "Big Bang"- suggest that very early in the universe's development, its edges were farther apart than light, moving at a constant speed, could possibly have traveled in that time. To explain this, scientists have focused on strange, unknown and as-yet-undiscovered forms of matter that produce gravity that repulses objects.
Moffat's theory - that the speed of light at the beginning of time was much faster than it is now - provides an answer to some of these cosmology problems. "It is easier for me to question Einstein's theory than it is to assume there is some kind of strange, exotic matter around me in my kitchen." His theory could also help explain astronomers' discovery last year that the universe's expansion is accelerating. Moffat's paper, co-authored with former U of T researcher Michael Clayton, appeared in a recent edition of the journal Physics Letters.
A University of Toronto Release. CONTACT: Bruce Rolston, U of T Public Affairs, (416) 978-6974

Simple, basic astronomical observations show that the speed of light has been roughly constant ever since light left the distant galaxies. Because if light left those galaxies . . . millions and billions of light year distant as they are . . . then slowed down on its way to us . . . then all dynamic things we observe would be slowed down by the same factor as the slowing of the light. This would include the time for the waxing and waning of supernova and the rotation rate of the galaxies. Because those are about the same, not slowed with distance, no matter how distant the galaxy, we can directly observe the light has not slowed by very much at all over billions of years.

 

[crjmurray]

Are you saying that there is no difference between a suicide bomber and the Coptic Christians who were beheaded for not denouncing their faith in Christ?

Are you saying that a person who has a gun, put to their head, and then asked to denounce their faith or die, doesn't denounce their faith and is shot to death, is no different than a person who straps a bomb to their body and explodes it in a crowd of innocent people???????

If you are correct, a suicide bomber could go into a classroom of kindergarten kids of a different faith or belief and blow their self and everyone else up and they would ALL be martyrs.

That is one twisted view of martyrdom....

I'm saying they're both martyrs. Both going to extremes for their faith. The fact that someone is willing to go to such an extreme does not give validity to their beliefs.