• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Why Do We Get Onto the Rich About Taxes?

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality' started by Saucy, Nov 24, 2017.

  1. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    Yup. :D
     
  2. Belk

    Belk Senior Member

    +4,092
    Agnostic
    Married
    Ipsie dixit.
     
  3. Ancient of Days

    Ancient of Days Active Member Supporter

    465
    +261
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Why Do They Get Onto the Rich About Taxes?- fixed it for you.

    I call it the robin hood syndrome. Democratic politicians love it because they think the poor will look at them as heroes.
     
  4. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    "The poor you will always have with you" is not "ipsie dixit". In fact it didn't take Jesus to reveal this perennial human condition. And no government program, or tax revision, will change this fact. It's just part of human nature expressed in the economic condition of many. Happily it is a condition with simple solutions. Sadly many are unable or unwilling to grasp these simple concepts or put them to use.
     
  5. Belk

    Belk Senior Member

    +4,092
    Agnostic
    Married
    Claiming to hold answers is most assuredly Ipsie dixit. Claims that you know better then the experts is ipsie dixit.
     
  6. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    The experts tend to complicate things unnecessarily. They also like to impose top down solutions when the real solutions lie with the individual. They also tend to rely on statistics rather than individual cases. They often apply technical solutions to human nature problems. They also tend to make a career out of some problems rather than solving them and moving on.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  7. Belk

    Belk Senior Member

    +4,092
    Agnostic
    Married

    Yes, yes. If only those experts would stop being so stupid and listen to the laymen the worlds problems would be solved. Pull the other one, it has bells on.
     
  8. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    I think you've got it! :oldthumbsup:
     
  9. ToddNotTodd

    ToddNotTodd Iconoclast

    +1,599
    Seeker
    Married
    Dunnng-Kruger effect..
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  10. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

    +2,867
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Which is the effect that originally manifested itself with the idea that the rich are responsible for poor people being poor.
     
  11. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    The irony is that the poor in America remain poor in spite of boundless opportunities created by the rich.
     
  12. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

    +2,867
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Absolutely! We're the richest country in America, and yet we keep hearing about how it's so unfair, and how few opportunities there are. Ironic indeed.
     
  13. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    To me the biggest reason for failure here is the emphasis on college, starting in the early grades.
     
  14. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

    +2,867
    Non-Denom
    Single
    I think it's starting to become more known how college puts so many people on a never-ending cycle of debt. They pay so much for college, and then spend the rest of their lives at their dream job trying to pay off their college debt, and that's assuming they end up getting the type of job they went to college for in the first place. I've known people who have gone to college and then found that what they were training for was now outdated by the time they graduated. Then they had to try for a different field of work while saddled with their college debt at the same time.
     
  15. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Alpha Male (Retired)

    +3,337
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    US-Others
    True. And the damage that promoting college does to the self-esteem of those kids who know they will never go to college, and will thus remain "ignorant" for the rest of their lives. It really damages motivation feeling that you are a 'loser'.
     
  16. evoeth

    evoeth Man trying to figure things out

    757
    +472
    Atheist
    Married
    That's because the effective marginal tax rate when you're on welfare is essentially greater than 100%. This is a well known issue and is solved any number of ways, for example, phasing out the programs over a large range of incomes instead of having a qualification cliff.
    Economist here. This is literally how nothing works.

    News flash: public colleges were mostly free 50 years ago. Isn't it amazing how we managed to pay for it back then?
     
  17. jaybird88

    jaybird88 Active Member

    307
    +94
    Christian
    Single
    wow someone needs a reality check, how dare those rich folks pay an equal % share when they pay so much more of the taxes. of course they pay more, 5 percent of 20 dump truck loads will always be more than 20 percent of a shoebox.
    it really blows my mind that so many are so simple minded they fall for this logic. when Rome was at its peak of corruption the rich payed zero of the tax, the common folks payed all of it and at the same time fought all the wars and watched their children never get enough food.
    the US is called the new rome if i remember right, how ironic.
    60 years back the rich did pay their fair share and guess what, they were still just as rich as ever.
     
  18. jaybird88

    jaybird88 Active Member

    307
    +94
    Christian
    Single
    if you removed the welfare from the poor it wouldnt be enough to make a difference. our government actually gives more welfare to the elite than they do to the poor. if walmart builds a new store they get millions, if you or I start a store and ask the government for asst, not a chance.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • List
  19. RedPonyDriver

    RedPonyDriver Professional Pot Stirrer

    +2,270
    Christian
    Married
    US-Democrat
    Over the years, I've paid more in taxes than most folks make in a year.

    HOWEVER...the problem I see when people talk about poor folks is this...some idea that if they work harder they'd find their way out of poverty. It doesn't quite work that way. The inequality of OPPORTUNITY...the crummy inner city schools compared to suburban schools. The idea that if people just WORKED they'd get themselves out of poverty...nope. The misguided idea that people on SNAP buy crummy food and therefore suffer for it is baloney too.

    Homeless families...35% of all homeless were families with children. https://www.hudexchange.info/resources/documents/2016-AHAR-Part-1.pdf

    SNAP and health Data and Statistics | Food and Nutrition Service. Most SNAP recipients are working The rest are elderly and children.

    "welfare" is a drop in the bucket compared to other governmental expenditures.

    You all have bought into a bunch of baloney. Go out and live a little and find out the reality of poverty in the US. When 1% of the population owns over 50% of the wealth, there's a problem. Someone mentioned Sam Walton...yeah, he has billions (or his family does) yet his employees (who are the reason he makes so much money) qualify for many welfare benefits.

    I was a business owner, a successful business owner. I understood then and even now that it didn't matter how much money I made...it was made literally on the backs of those who worked for me. So, I chose to pay my employees well (better than industry average), provide an above average benefit package and profit sharing. It really didn't hurt MY bottom line...sure I made a few hundred grand a year less than what I could have made...BUT...my employees were taken care of, were loyal to a fault and by eliminating the churn of replacing employees, my business benefitted. I sold that business for a serious pile of cash...and promptly gave most of it away. I didn't need the millions of dollars a year. I couldn't spend it all even if I wanted to...I mean, once you have a decent place to live, a full pantry and a car, what else is there? Vacations? Bored me to tears. Another car? Can't drive but one at a time. Another house? Can't live in but one at a time. When it came time to file my taxes I thought it was pretty cool that the child of immigrants could be so successful that she'd pay a pile of money to the country that took her family in. I never have and never will begrudge the money that goes to help the poor, the ones who have not had the opportunities I did...I was fortunate, I was blessed. So many are not. To the ones who have much, much is expected, right?
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • List
  20. rambot

    rambot Senior Member

    +3,145
    Christian
    Married
    CA-Greens
    What an odd discussion:
    "There are SOOO many opportunities to get rich in the US....."
    "And education is a waste of time and money"
     
Loading...