Why do other Christians hate Calvinist so much?

[Skala]

well I agree with what you said concerning the clothed with Christ righteousness, as for the chosen, I don't know any other terminology better fitting than the elect, I guess it just flys in the face of your doctrine that people were called to be saved but left the faith and fell away into apostasy

My are you hostile! And what in the world are you talking about? lol.

 

[DeaconDean]

From what I understand (and that can be taken with a grain of salt), most scholars think Job is a contemporary if Abraham.

It is possible.

However, I believe the scripture I posted supports what I believe.

Job was a son of Issachar, and Issachar was born from Leah, wife of Jacob.

And Jacob was a "Hebrew".

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[His_disciple3]

His_disciple

I have a straightforward question and it only needs a "yes" or "no" response from you.

Does "kosmos" (translated as "world" in English) only and always mean, without exception "every single individual human being in the human race since Adam"?

Yes or no?

Please answer.

see post # 359 please I am not talking about every single time I am referring to when it referrs to grace in John 3:16 what it means in other parts of scriptures has no bearing on what it means in John 3:16 or in 1John 2 again please see post #359

 

[Hupomone10]

Gotta be fair, it also looks like this...

 

[Skala]

see post # 359 please I am not talking about every single time I am referring to when it referrs to grace in John 3:16 what it means in other parts of scriptures has no bearing on what it means in John 3:16 or in 1John 2 again please see post #359

Please provide an exegetical or grammatical reason why "kosmos" In John 3:16 means "every single person since Adam"

Thanks.

 

[His_disciple3]

Please provide an exegetical or grammatical reason why "kosmos" In John 3:16 means "every single person since Adam"

Thanks.

i provided a bibical reason, you can trust in the other reasons you asked if you want here is a part of post #359 that will answer your question it is all there in scriptures no need to look at any other information!

John 3:17
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
KJV
ok now I know world can mean different from the human race which is intended in john 3:16 But It don't! it don't even mean the world of the elect, we can see this in john 3:17. look carefully see it yourself please don't take this cooked fish's word. God sent His son not to condemn the elect (world) but that the World (elected) MIGHT BE saved. so if world in JOHN 3:16 means that Jesus only died for the world of the elect then "MIGHT' implies that the elect could be saved or it can also means that the elect could not be saved, this is red letters in My KJB meaning this is coming straight From the MOUTH of God himself, No No!! Jesus Died for the Whole world in john 3:16 that some might be saved, and limited atonement is a false teaching, I have shown you from scriptures which world God meant in John 3:16 the whole world, all sinners, that some might be saved, not all.

 

[Skala]

sigh

Do you know what exegesis is? You haven't done it yet.

 

[DeaconDean]

A note to the posters here:

Recently, as of this week, this thread has turned incredibly hostile.

And to be honest, the hostility has turned towards those of us who are Calvinist.

Myself personally, I have been accused of "changing the meaning of words" just because I align myself with Calvinism, as Calvinists do.

Myself personally, just with today, I have been accused of judging who was and who wasn't saved eternally.

There is nothing good that can come out of this thread.

The only thing that has become evidently clear is the hatred of Calvinists is alive and well on January 19, 2012.

A statement was made in post #283 that evidently went over the heads of everybody here. I know it has because I have been patiently waiting for somebody to take the poster to task over what was said, but nobody has.

Let me re-post it and add my emphasis:

Most Calvinists, not always but in general, are better versed and therefore have a unfair advantage over most Christians. While this should imho simply force those to study more! Not get mad.

Also, some Calvinists tend to be arrogant, certainly not all! This adds to the mix.

I happen to respect Calvinism and Calvinists despite not completely agreeing with every thing they believe or accept. I admire their zest and devotion to the scriptures, how ever wrong they may be.

They don't rattle my beliefs at all so I can listen to and read their stuff and fully enjoy my inter-reaction with them.

If any thing, Calvinists should make you examine the scriptures and do some more studying and there is nothing wrong with that! That's a win-win!

This is one of the most interesting topics we can discuss! No one will have the final word. No one one can claim to have won this debate! But we can each regardless of position, take this opportunity to grow spiritually and structurally!

I cannot help but believe that my continued presence here will do nothing more than increase the disharmony of this thread.

I have tried teaching, I have tried reasoning, and still stand accused of a great many things for no other reason on earth than I am a Calvinist, therefore because Calvinists change the meaning of words, I change the meaning of words.

I am therefore going to un-subscribe from this discussion.

There is nothing good that can come from this thread.

Good-Bye and

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Hammster]

It is possible.

However, I believe the scripture I posted supports what I believe.

Job was a son of Issachar, and Issachar was born from Leah, wife of Jacob.

And Jacob was a "Hebrew".

God Bless

Till all are one.

How about Adam? Or Noah?

 

[Skala]

Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

His_disciple

What does John 3:16 say?

A) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, so that everyone should not perish but have eternal life.

B) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Which is it?

 

[Hammster]

well I agree with what you said concerning the clothed with Christ righteousness, as for the chosen, I don't know any other terminology better fitting than the elect, I guess it just flys in the face of your doctrine that people were called to be saved but left the faith and fell away into apostasy

The reason God grants mercy to some is because if He didn't, then none would believe. So the Gospel is preached to all, but most will reject it.

 

[His_disciple3]

also let me give you all something to chew on< i have been accused of limiting words to one definition, and thus I can't see the calvinist doctrine of grace, but the very ones that have accused me of this are guilty of the same thing and this is how they have been lead to follow the false doctrine of calvinist grace. elect can mean more than those that are predestined. Mole you asked Me if world meant the stars and what ever does grace given to the elect mean that angels can receive salvation ? could elect mean his chosen people the Jewish nation? oh yeah you all need to get the beam out of your own eyes before trying to teach me anything! or is there just one elect lady

2 John 1
1 The elder unto the elect lady and her children, whom I love in the truth; and not I only, but also all they that have known the truth;
KJV

 

[Hammster]

also let me give you all something to chew on< i have been accused of limiting words to one definition, and thus I can't see the calvinist doctrine of grace, but the very ones that have accused me of this are guilty of the same thing and this is how they have been lead to follow the false doctrine of calvinist grace. elect can mean more than those that are predestined. Mole you asked Me if world meant the stars and what ever does grace given to the elect mean that angels can receive salvation ? could elect mean his chosen people the Jewish nation? oh yeah you all need to get the beam out of your own eyes before trying to teach me anything! or is there just one elect lady

2 John 1
1 The elder unto the elect lady and her children, whom I love in the truth; and not I only, but also all they that have known the truth;
KJV

I agreed that you brought up an interesting point. Then I asked in what way do you think Christ died for the whole world? I'm still waiting for that answer.

 

[His_disciple3]

The reason God grants mercy to some is because if He didn't, then none would believe. So the Gospel is preached to all, but most will reject it.

I am sorry i referred to you as mole, when I read that about you digging a hole I thought of moles, I meant no disrespect from it. but one question are you saying that Jesus died for the elect, but that the elect might refuse that love, so Jesus died for someone you will not get into the kingdom Of God?

 

[His_disciple3]

I agreed that you brought up an interesting point. Then I asked in what way do you think Christ died for the whole world? I'm still waiting for that answer.

wow my answer would be in Post # 359 or you can look up 1 john 2 if you wish wait to make up for calling you mole, I will post it for you.

KJV
1 John 2:1-2
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
KJV

 

[His_disciple3]

1 Timothy 5:21
21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.
KJV
do angels receive the doctrine of Grace ??? no way !!

 

[Hammster]

I am sorry i referred to you as mole, when I read that about you digging a hole I thought of moles, I meant no disrespect from it. but one question are you saying that Jesus died for the elect, but that the elect might refuse that love, so Jesus died for someone you will not get into the kingdom Of God?

Apology accepted.

No, what on saying is that only the elect repent and believe, even though the gospel is preached freely to all.

 

[Hammster]

wow my answer would be in Post # 359 or you can look up 1 john 2 if you wish wait to make up for calling you mole, I will post it for you.

KJV
1 John 2:1-2
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
KJV

Cool. What does propitiation mean?

 

[Hammster]

1 Timothy 5:21
21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.
KJV
do angels receive the doctrine of Grace ??? no way !!

Right, because words have meaning in their context. I don't think that anyone has said that every time 'elect' is used it is referring to elect believers.

 

[MichaelKelley]

I really don't understand this very clear hatred of those who believe in the theory of Calvinism. You may disagree and that is your right but it is also our right to believe in it. There are scriptures to back both sides of this debate to each his own after doing your own individual research. I see it all over CF and it gets very mean and cruel at times. Something about this debate makes people leave the Christian part of them outside the debate and the anger takes over. I don't see why this has to divide us as much as it does we all have the same big goal and the same big belief system. The little stuff is stupid to fight over discuss it give your views fine but when it crosses into being sinful behavior to back your side enough is enough you are no longer pleasing anyone especially not God!

Everyone here really needs to reel it in on this topic. I have seen enough around here to make me sick. Many should be ashamed of the way they have behaved toward others because of this topic.

Get it together and be like Christ in all things!!

I've heard a lot of people say that same thing about Calvinism. I've never understood it either...we all get along just fine with Calvinists where I'm from, and we always suggest to new believers to find either a good Baptist or Presbyterian Church. Sure, there's the free will/predestination issue, but the Bible CLEARLY teaches BOTH...sometimes people get wrapped up in one aspect of a particular doctrine that they close off all other parts of it that they are uncomfortable with.

My stance on the issue is that the Bible teaches both, and thus, I believe both free will and predestination. This ONLY seems like a contradiction because we only know what life is like WITHIN the spacetime domain...but God exists OUTSIDE of both space and time, as He is Creator. When you take that in account the paradox vanishes...do I completely understand that? Well no, I'm not a Quantum Physicist. We have proven much of this through Quantum mechanics, and it has been called the "silliest theory proposed in the 20th century," and that "the ONLY thing it has going for it is that it is unquestionably correct."

We have reached a point in science in which we know this is true, yet it apparently contradicts most of what we know... but of what we know in science, Quantum theory MUST be true. A paradox again, which is rooted in the old free will/predestination paradox.

Like Paul said, we truly do "see through a glass darkly" (1 Corinthians 13).