WHY DO MANY PEOPLE STILL BELIEVE THAT THE OLD COVENANT IS STILL IN EFFECT ?

[ralliann]

Doesn't Jesus say
The kingdom of God is here now (Lk 11:20, Mt 12:28). It was set up at the first coming of Christ.

Yes INSIDE YOU. We are it's citizenship. But here in this world, this life we are strangers and sojourners.

It is not of this world (Jn 18:36), but rather of the spiritual world, hidden and within (Lk 17:20-21).
It is everlasting (Lk 1:33) and never-ending, as prophesied in Da 2:44.

It being never-ending, it is for all time as well as eternity.

Not so with the earthly kingdom. But, those with earthly promise remain until this temporal world is no more. It has the purpose of God as well in it. I think Israel as a nation still carries God's judgement in this world and this life. Those of us in Christ have been judged already.

 

[dwb001]

This almost speaks like we die in Adam teaching type contract. man's faithfulness
It depends on
1. The specifics of the contract
2. The persons involved in the contract

God's faithfulness....
Rom 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

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[Clare73]

Yes INSIDE YOU. We are it's citizenship. But here in this world, this life we are strangers and sojourners.

Not so with the earthly kingdom. But, those with earthly promise remain until this temporal world is no more. It has the purpose of God as well in it. I think Israel as a nation still carries God's judgement in this world and this life. Those of us in Christ have been judged already.

Is the kingdom of God not here now (Lk 11:20, Mt 12:28)?
It being everlasting (Lk 1:33) and never ending (Da 2:44), there is no other kingdom of God to come.
Jesus said the promised kingdom of God is here now. It came with him at his first coming, and it is forever.

 

[ralliann]

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You are speaking like because Adam disobeyed all men die.
The covenant made with Abraham, has multiple peoples involved.

 

[ralliann]

Is the kingdom of God not here now (Lk 11:20, Mt 12:28)?

It is within us.

It being everlasting (Lk 1:33) and never ending (Da 2:44), there is no other kingdom of God to come.

Yes? What did I say differently?

Jesus said the promised kingdom of God is here now. It came with him at his first coming, and it is forever.

Yes, it is within us! He reigns and rules us. we are in the world not of it. I don't know why you cannot understand Clare.

 

[dwb001]

You are speaking like because Adam disobeyed all men die.
The covenant made with Abraham, has multiple peoples involved.

I am talking about the difference between contract and covenant.
I have not mentioned either Adam or Abram.

And where is the difference between one and many when covenant is the issue?

 

[ralliann]

I am talking about the difference between contract and covenant.
I have not mentioned either Adam or Abram.

And where is the difference between one and many when covenant is the issue?

So we all die in Adam because Adam had a contract with God?

 

[Clare73]

It is within us.

Yes? What did I say differently?

Yes, it is within us! He reigns and rules us. we are in the world not of it. I don't know why you cannot understand Clare.

I'm not seeing any other future temporal or eternal kingdom of God than the temporal and eternal kingdom that came with Jesus (Lk 11:20, Mt 12:28) at his first coming.

 

[dwb001]

So we all die in Adam because Adam had a contract with God?

What are you talking about?

 

[ralliann]

I'm not seeing any other future temporal or eternal kingdom of God than the temporal and eternal kingdom that came with Jesus (Lk 11:20, Mt 12:28) at his first coming.

The Temporal is a kingdom of priests, in Moses. The natural seed.
The eternal is only through in Jesus.

 

[ralliann]

What are you talking about?

Nevermind. Asked you to explain the difference and between contract and covenant.
Here is your response.

"Right... so man is bad at keeping his promises. Does the covenant become null and void? No. But a contract would be."

What are you talking about. The terms of a covenant/ contract determine it's end.
this says nothing of the difference between your view and Clare's.

 

[dwb001]

Nevermind. Asked you to explain the difference and between contract and covenant.
Here is your response.

"Right... so man is bad at keeping his promises. Does the covenant become null and void? No. But a contract would be."

What are you talking about. The terms of a covenant/ contract determine it's end.
this says nothing of the difference between your view and Clare's.

Do you have a question?

 

[Clare73]

The Temporal is a kingdom of priests, in Moses. The natural seed.
The eternal is only through in Jesus.

The temporal church is a kingdom of royal priests (1 Pe 2:5, 9).

 

[ralliann]

Do you have a question?

I already asked it.

 

[ralliann]

The temporal church is a kingdom of royal priests (1 Pe 2:5, 9).

Temporal Church?

 

[dwb001]

I already asked it.

Never saw a question in your last post... maybe I missed it.

 

[ralliann]

Never saw a question in your last post... maybe I missed it.

Ah, I did edit it.
You did not speak to the difference between Clare's view and your own as an example of your claims. It just seems semantics without it.

 

[Clare73]

Temporal Church?

The church on earth in time (temporal), not temporary.

 

[ralliann]

The church on earth in time (temporal), not temporary.

merriam-webster.com
temporal
ˈtem-p(ə-)rəl
ADJECTIVE

1. of or relating to time as opposed to eternity
   of or relating to earthly life
   ...
2. of or relating to grammatical tense or a distinction of time
3. of or relating to time as distinguished from space

 

[Clare73]

The covenant made in Jesus blood is the kingdom not of this world, this life.

But Jesus said the kingdom of God was here now, before his shed blood.

Which were shadows, examples etc. for the heavenly eternal inheritance.

Shadows and examples (sacrifices, defilements, cleansings, feasts, etc.) are the physical representations of the spiritual.
The kingdom of God now spiritually within is not a physical representation of another (spiritual) kingdom to come.
That is the reverse of God's Biblical pattern, which is: the physical represents the spiritual, not the other way around.

The spiritual kingdom of God which Jesus brought at his first coming is the promised (spiritual) kingdom of God.
It is the only kingdom of God. There is no other.
A future earthly kingdom was the false misunderstanding of the OT Jews, and which caused them to reject their Messianic king and his spiritual kingdom.

Just as the promised everlasting possession (Ge 17:8, 48:4) of physical land was a promise of spiritual (heavenly) land (Heb 11:13-16,
so also the promised physical Messianic kingdom of God was a promise of the spiritual kingdom of God, brought in by the Messiah at his first coming, and which they rejected.
There is no other kingdom of God. They don't get a second bite at the apple.
All mankind is on the same footing, salvation is by faith in Jesus Christ.
The NT kingdom of God (within the people of God, the church) is the fulfillment of God's promised kingdom.

Two covenants Clare,
Earthly inheritance, temporal, worldly.
Celestial inheritance, eternal, heavenly.

The Old Covenant promises were types of their fulfillment in the New Covenant.
The New Covenant kingdom is not celestial, it is the kingdom of God now (Mt 12:28, Lk 11:20), as well as for all eternity.