Why are there so few power miracles anymore?

[NBB]

Paul was made an apostle to the gentiles, by the ascended Christ himself (Acts 22:21).

the 'ascended Christ himself' still does stuff today and interacts with people. Is not like he is far away from us.

 

[Guojing]

the 'ascended Christ himself' still does stuff today and interacts with people. Is not like he is far away from us.

And your point is?

 

[NBB]

And your point is?

That you seem to not believe he still does things today like the bible says believers would do if i read correctly what you say.

 

[Guojing]

That you seem to not believe he still does things today like the bible says believers would do if i read correctly what you say.

I was asking specifically about Matthew 10:5-8.

Do you have an opinion on that passage?

 

[TruthSeek3r]

I'm not cessationist. I just want to see evidence of real healings backed up with actual medical evidence that a miracle has taken place.

Medical records here: Jesus's Ministry

Here another case: A Remarkable Case of a Peer-Reviewed Modern Miracle | Sean McDowell

Another case: The Blind Receive Sight: A Peer-Reviewed Modern… | Sean McDowell

More resources here: Library – Global Medical Research Institute

 

[GirdYourLoins]

Miracles do still happen. Ive had a couple, healing of a lot of the psychological damage done by my violent father, quite probably with physical healing of my brain. I was delivered from smoking on the spot at a meeting. I've also seen people inn wheelchairs be physically healed and walk, one I didnt see the prayer and standing up but immediately after it happened he carried his wheelchair into from a youth event at a conference into the main meeting to say what had happened. He'd been in the wheel chair so long his legs should not have been strong enough for that.
However, these are few years ago now. I would say we are in a season of the move of the Spirit being slower now, but there will be a new wave soon.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I am sorry I missed this thread as the issue is close to my heart.

I think poor teaching is the main reason.

Also the modern mega churches need action to attract followers. The object of the exercise then is to 'move in the gifts' this provides visual stimulation and draws a crowd.

This is a mistake.

Folks must learn to hear Him first.

Jesus could do nothing without seeing what the father was doing first.

Are we greater than Jesus ???

NO.

It comes back to a fear of total commitment which I believe is common.

The harvest is ripe and the workers are few - folks need to understand that the gifts operate in the 'edge of the kingdom' on the streets and the marketplace where if He doesn't show up your toast.

So an over emphasis of the gifts is problematic because we simply read "confess your sins one to another and pray for one another that you may be healed". No mention of gifts and a clear directive to all as a matter of obedience.

Another factor is that the faith levels were high in the early church because we are speaking of those who saw the resurrection first hand.

What we need today then is life changing encounters with Him - how many today have 'seen' Him in one way or the other? This is where faith comes from.

I remember a vision I had years ago - throngs of believers walking in the same direction - amazing singing overhead - and on the side of the crowd folks saying "this is the way to walk" and I knew they didn't know but were blind guides. Looking in the distance I could see there was a common destination - it was the cross.

Just a few thoughts.

 

[lismore]

Repentance

 

[Carl Emerson]

Repentance

Yes it is worth remembering that the Spirit of Elijah was with John the Baptist who never did a miracle. The ministry of Elijah then is fundamentally is one of seeing folks come to repentance.

So seek the gifts as we are encouraged to do but seek even more the gift of repentance.

If we got this the right way around the face many churches would change.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I am sorry I missed this thread as the issue is close to my heart.

I think poor teaching is the main reason.

Also the modern mega churches need action to attract followers. The object of the exercise then is to 'move in the gifts' this provides visual stimulation and draws a crowd.

This is a mistake.

Folks must learn to hear Him first.

Jesus could do nothing without seeing what the father was doing first.

Are we greater than Jesus ???

NO.

It comes back to a fear of total commitment which I believe is common.

The harvest is ripe and the workers are few - folks need to understand that the gifts operate in the 'edge of the kingdom' on the streets and the marketplace where if He doesn't show up your toast.

So an over emphasis of the gifts is problematic because we simply read "confess your sins one to another and pray for one another that you may be healed". No mention of gifts and a clear directive to all as a matter of obedience.

Another factor is that the faith levels were high in the early church because we are speaking of those who saw the resurrection first hand.

What we need today then is life changing encounters with Him - how many today have 'seen' Him in one way or the other? This is where faith comes from.

I remember a vision I had years ago - throngs of believers walking in the same direction - amazing singing overhead - and on the side of the crowd folks saying "this is the way to walk" and I knew they didn't know but were blind guides. Looking in the distance I could see there was a common destination - it was the cross.

Just a few thoughts.

These are good thoughts, and I give a hearty AMEN to the bit about mega-churches. Those places are cesspools of unbelief laden with tricks and gimmicks to pad some person's heavenly resume.

I definitely believe that our amount of faith has an effect on this. Faith comes from hearing and hearing by the word of God. So there is definitely an element here of how close we are to God that correlates to our walking in the Spirit's power. Time spent reading/studying the scriptures and in prayer (fasting included).

Something new that has come to mind since posting this is a rather intriguing element to this that fascinates me.

The western world is a very logical place. We are well educated for the most part, and base a lot of our experiences on our physical senses. I've heard that in areas in the Middle East, Africa, and China that miracles are a regular thing in the church. Which is interesting for another reason to be explained in a second. But those areas for the most part are not as educated and logical as the West is. So perhaps there's an element where we cannot experience deep things in the Spirit because we base a lot of our experiences on our mind, not the Spirit.

Also, church father testified that miracles and gifts were still in operation well into the 3rd century, even the early 4th century. In 312, Constantine made Christianity the official religion of Rome and I truly believe at that moment, when the church traded message for security, is when the Spirit withdrew a good bit of power from the church as a whole. We traded our True Shepherd for a hireling. When you read in scripture about power miracles, they are normally in connection with someone who has or is willing to endure persecution for the gospel. Not that we should seek persecution, or rebel against our governments, but it really feels like in our compromising the message for security, we lose out on some of the power of the Spirit. This is why I feel those in the Middle East, China, etc probably do still see great miracles. They experience persecution on a daily basis, even still.

So it's perhaps a combination of things.

Now what does that mean for us?

Again, not espousing that we should be rebellious to our governing bodies. But I do believe we need to be honest with people about what the gospel is, not watered down like many mega churches and such preach. It's not a popular message, but a necessary one. Repent and be baptized calling on the name of Jesus and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. As for advancing past our logical, physical senses based existence? Just start walking in faith a bit more. When Jesus and them healed, they said get up and walk, not let me pray, "Father please heal in the name of Jesus." They didn't see people as they were, they saw them as God wanted them to be and commanded them forth as such.

Just some thoughts, but thank you for sharing!

 

[Graham Watkins]

Hi There, Interesting topic,
here is an image of why I believe we don't have many miracles and healings, when we believe and are saved through Christ the Holy Spirit slowly transforms us, but we don't truly let go of our fleshly/sinful ways completely, as this takes a lot of faith and sacrifice spiritually, doing works on behalf of the Holy Spirit, which are not our works which gives glory to God. Son and Holy Spirit, which I believe takes some steadfast conviction, If you feel the true presence of the Lord upon you, how will you truly act, only my opinion, but I would feel something that would completely terrify me, because if the world media got shot of it, it would make you into some kind of celebrity, and people everywhere will want you to perform miracles none stop, and then you would be at risk of taking away some of what the Lord, as already has done for us, all those years ago, even when many still did not believe. I believe we should let the Lord decide on what miracles he wants to perform in quiet solitude, so none of His Glory is Taken From Him, And Prayer for His Will Be Done. God Bless. and remember its just my opinion and I can still be wrong, I`m not quoting scripture, so keep the faith and peace be with you always.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

View attachment 315638
Hi There, Interesting topic,
here is an image of why I believe we don't have many miracles and healings, when we believe and are saved through Christ the Holy Spirit slowly transforms us, but we don't truly let go of our fleshly/sinful ways completely, as this takes a lot of faith and sacrifice spiritually, doing works on behalf of the Holy Spirit, which are not our works which gives glory to God. Son and Holy Spirit, which I believe takes some steadfast conviction, If you feel the true presence of the Lord upon you, how will you truly act, only my opinion, but I would feel something that would completely terrify me, because if the world media got shot of it, it would make you into some kind of celebrity, and people everywhere will want you to perform miracles none stop, and then you would be at risk of taking away some of what the Lord, as already has done for us, all those years ago, even when many still did not believe. I believe we should let the Lord decide on what miracles he wants to perform in quiet solitude, so none of His Glory is Taken From Him, And Prayer for His Will Be Done. God Bless. and remember its just my opinion and I can still be wrong, I`m not quoting scripture, so keep the faith and peace be with you always.View attachment 315638

I certainly do think that becoming a "celebrity" is a major major issue that could jeopardize a person's standing. Jesus faced this exact same issue and he gave us the remedy, humility, sacrifice and prayer.

 

[Guojing]

But I do believe we need to be honest with people about what the gospel is, not watered down like many mega churches and such preach. It's not a popular message, but a necessary one. Repent and be baptized calling on the name of Jesus and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. As for advancing past our logical, physical senses based existence? Just start walking in faith a bit more. When Jesus and them healed, they said get up and walk, not let me pray, "Father please heal in the name of Jesus." They didn't see people as they were, they saw them as God wanted them to be and commanded them forth as such.

To confirm, if people were to ask you, what is the gospel that saves today, you will reply with "Repent and be baptized calling on the name of Jesus and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

You are using Acts 2:38 as the gospel?

 

[ByTheSpirit]

To confirm, if people were to ask you, what is the gospel that saves today, you will reply with "Repent and be baptized calling on the name of Jesus and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

You are using Acts 2:38 as the gospel?

That's the response to the gospel

 

[Guojing]

That's the response to the gospel

So what exactly does this paragraph of yours mean?

But I do believe we need to be honest with people about what the gospel is, not watered down like many mega churches and such preach. It's not a popular message, but a necessary one. Repent and be baptized calling on the name of Jesus and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

So what exactly does this paragraph of yours mean?

What I mean are the problems started when the message was compromised. That began when Christianity was secularized in 312. It continues to compound to this day. The church needs to take back the narrative.

Our message today is we are just sinners, it's all we can do. Weak and powerless, under grace. But if we say a nice little prayer, it'll fix everything. Free grace theology I think it's called.

How can we believe God for miracles when we can't even believe that He can keep us from sin? How can we expect power when we don't expect obedience?

Jesus said those who sin are slaves to sin and a slave has no place in the family, but whom the Son sets free shall be free indeed! John 8:34-36

Nothing about repenting, nothing about baptism, nothing about taking up our armor and contending for the faith. Nothing about working out our salvation with fear and trembling. Nothing about abiding in Christ by faith and trusting him to keep us from sin. We make Jesus Lord with our tongues but our hearts are far from him. We talk a good talk, but no walking the walk.

The gospel message tells people that they have fallen, they aren't good enough, destined to die. That's why it's not popular. People don't like being told they aren't good enough and never will be. That God has condemned them in their current state. They need to change and be washed clean. Of course God made a way for salvation, only if we obey Him. How can He give His power to those who can't walk in simple obedience?

To me the message and that compromise are why the church has lost its power. It started in 312 and is rapidly accelerating to this day.

 

[Neogaia777]

What I mean are the problems started when the message was compromised. That began when Christianity was secularized in 312. It continues to compound to this day. The church needs to take back the narrative.

Our message today is we are just sinners, it's all we can do. Weak and powerless, under grace. But if we say a nice little prayer, it'll fix everything. Free grace theology I think it's called.

How can we believe God for miracles when we can't even believe that He can keep us from sin? How can we expect power when we don't expect obedience?

Jesus said those who sin are slaves to sin and a slave has no place in the family, but whom the Son sets free shall be free indeed! John 8:34-36

Nothing about repenting, nothing about baptism, nothing about taking up our armor and contending for the faith. Nothing about working out our salvation with fear and trembling. Nothing about abiding in Christ by faith and trusting him to keep us from sin. We make Jesus Lord with our tongues but our hearts are far from him. We talk a good talk, but no walking the walk.

The gospel message tells people that they have fallen, they aren't good enough, destined to die. That's why it's not popular. People don't like being told they aren't good enough and never will be. That God has condemned them in their current state. They need to change and be washed clean. Of course God made a way for salvation, only if we obey Him. How can He give His power to those who can't walk in simple obedience?

To me the message and that compromise are why the church has lost its power. It started in 312 and is rapidly accelerating to this day.

The problem is people began to realize that they were not perfect before being saved, and still were not afterwards, not matter how hard they truly wanted to be and/or tried, etc, and people became sick and tired of the abuse from the churches/pulpits on this matter, since they also realized those people also were not even close to perfect as well, etc...

So, what is the solution then...? You tell me, etc...?

Judgement, even God's judgement, is not so black and white...

If no sinners at all could be saved, then none can ever be saved...

Except Jesus or God Himself that is, and we know God wants more people than just only that, etc...

But I also do also get your point also though, people everywhere are way, way too much like the world, and walk in it's ways, ways that do not take sin nearly seriously enough at all, etc, so I get you there, but still also yet, none are perfect also, or as well, etc...

So when you find the final solution, let me know, ok...

But as of right now, I do think I know a thing or two on how God truly judges, and will truly judge in the end, etc...

God Bless!

 

[Guojing]

What I mean are the problems started when the message was compromised. That began when Christianity was secularized in 312. It continues to compound to this day. The church needs to take back the narrative.

Our message today is we are just sinners, it's all we can do. Weak and powerless, under grace. But if we say a nice little prayer, it'll fix everything. Free grace theology I think it's called.

How can we believe God for miracles when we can't even believe that He can keep us from sin? How can we expect power when we don't expect obedience?

Jesus said those who sin are slaves to sin and a slave has no place in the family, but whom the Son sets free shall be free indeed! John 8:34-36

Nothing about repenting, nothing about baptism, nothing about taking up our armor and contending for the faith. Nothing about working out our salvation with fear and trembling. Nothing about abiding in Christ by faith and trusting him to keep us from sin. We make Jesus Lord with our tongues but our hearts are far from him. We talk a good talk, but no walking the walk.

The gospel message tells people that they have fallen, they aren't good enough, destined to die. That's why it's not popular. People don't like being told they aren't good enough and never will be. That God has condemned them in their current state. They need to change and be washed clean. Of course God made a way for salvation, only if we obey Him. How can He give His power to those who can't walk in simple obedience?

To me the message and that compromise are why the church has lost its power. It started in 312 and is rapidly accelerating to this day.

So back to the original question I asked, if someone were to ask you, "What is the gospel that saves today", exactly what would you say to him?

 

[SavedByGrace3]

There are fewer street-side miracles because there are fewer street-side preachers.
Happy, hidden in their cultural approved church buildings. No danger. No confrontations. No insults, physical abuse, arrests. These are the things that make the sharing of the gospel real.
It is only as real as we make it.
I personally would love to see companies of prophets in every town and city preaching and proclaiming the Word.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

So back to the original question I asked, if someone were to ask you, "What is the gospel that saves today", exactly what would you say to him?

I answered that for you already, read my last response again thanks