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Who Are the Multitude of Revelation Chapter 7?

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by NJBeliever, Nov 20, 2013.

  1. NJBeliever

    NJBeliever Newbie

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    After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. 11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen. - Revelation 7:9-11.



    A Biblical study on the Multitude of Revelation 7.
    Who Are The Multitude Of Revelation Chapter 7? | Beginning And End
     
  2. L0U

    L0U Regular Member

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    I believe they are all of the saved of every nation from the creation to that time.
     
  3. PhillipLaSpino

    PhillipLaSpino Achieve; don’t plunder!

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    It's the bride of Christ. No-one would be allowed into heaven and stand before the Father's throne unless they were saved by the blood of Christ, they being one with him. They passed through the open door which represents Jesus Christ in order to enter into heaven.

    It will not include those Jews and Gentiles who died under the law (before Christ) These will be judged by their works. For those who did not have the law, they will be judged by their conscience, and by their belief in the Creator and his creation. All these will be raised from the dead Rev.20:12-15, than judged rightious, or unrighteous.

    Phil LaSpino
     
  4. John S

    John S I'm Here - For Now

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    They are martyrs who have been killed because they believe in Jesus Christ. They are NOT those who have been Raptured.
    I'm Sorry - but the Pre-Trib Rapture doctrine is false.
     
  5. PhillipLaSpino

    PhillipLaSpino Achieve; don’t plunder!

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    John! John! is that all you have to offer is an off the cuff comment?

    Phil
     
  6. Interplanner

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    there are people in heaven before and apart from the rapture.

    And, there are OT believers who are saved by faith; Heb. 11. Abraham believed and was reckoned righteous. That happened apart from circumcision. Gal. 3, Rom 4.
     
  7. n2thelight

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    Revelation 7:9 "After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;"

    This is after John's second vision has taken place. Only here, and in John 12:13 were palms used to glorify our Lord. The Jews used these palm branches, "and cried Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord". That is a fact, Jesus did come in the name of the Lord God Almighty.

    Revelation 7:10 "And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb."

    In other words, these great numbers of people, came from all races and nations and languages on the face of the earth, and each and every one of them have been saved.

    This is not part of the "rapture" as many teachers teach. No; but it is the people who have died in the Lord's work, and have gone to be with Him. It is my father who died twelve years age, and my uncle Ron who has passed on; It's my grandmother Knecht, who passed on when I was a child, and every other saint of God, who lived a life on this earth, and died and went to be with the Lord; from any century in this earth age. Those are the ones John sees standing before the Lord in their white robes, washed in the blood of the Lamb, and their sins made white as snow.

    Though we laid their fleshly bodies in the ground, Praise God their souls went immediately to be with the Father. [Ecclesiastes 12:7] From Adam and Eve to this present time, all these saints of God are now angelic soul beings; though they sinned in the flesh, each has repented of their sins, and God is faithful and just to forgive all those sins, and make them white and pure as snow.

    Revelation 7:11 "And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts [living creatures], and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God."

    John is seeing in this vision this beautiful scene through the heavenly door.

    Revelation 7:12 "Saying, A'-men: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. A'-men."

    There are seven-fold blessings the saints are ascribing back from themselves to the Lamb of God [Jesus Christ]. These are given to Jesus Christ because of what Jesus has done. They again are; Blessing, Glory, Wisdom, Honor, Thanksgiving, Power, and Might. Remember back in Revelation 5:12 it named the seven spirits of life given Jesus Christ by the Father? Here the saints recognize them and praise the Lamb. However rather than "riches", in verses 5:12, we have "Thanksgiving".

    The saints have already received their riches, at this time; and they are part of those riches through all eternity. So now they stand before our Lord in their white robes and bow and praise God in Thanksgiving. What a glorious Wonder to watch.

    Revelation 7:13 "And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?"

    Revelation 7:14 "And I said unto him, Sir [My Lord], thou knowest. and he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

    Notice where they came from, the great tribulation. They came out of the tribulation and "washed their own robes" in the blood of the Lamb. Nobody washed the robes for them. They were made white by the blood of the Lamb by their repentance and confession in Jesus Christ. These "witnesses", we will read of in Revelation 19, and our robes are the product of our righteous acts done in our flesh body, while living on this earth.

    Those acts are the things you do, and in helping others in the name of the Lord. Our Salvation comes only by grace [unmerited favor] of God, through the blood of the Lamb [Jesus Christ on the cross]; yet our righteous acts are what we are clothed in throughout all eternity. True righteousness is only in Christ, but when you try, God accepts it as perfect. So these saints are standing there in their righteous works.
    The term "great tribulation" is better translated "great afflictions" in the flesh, or body. For these saints went through afflictions in the flesh, or body; However they may not have lived in the period of the "Great Tribulation". That is the time when Satan will rule the earth, in person, as Antichrist. Many millions have suffered greatly in the name of God, and even given their lives in His service.

    Revelation 7:15 "Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he hat sitteth on the throne shall dwell among [spread His tabernacle over] them."

    Many of these saints will return with Christ at the seventh trumpet. However, when the Godhead, and His throne move to earth eternally, it will be following the Great White Throne Judgment. Then all souls will be on earth and in God's eternal kingdom, or they will simply not exist. Not even the memory of them will exist

    http://www.theseason.org/revelation/revelation7.htm
     
  8. John S

    John S I'm Here - For Now

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    When that's enough - YUP.
     
  9. Bible2

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    That's right.

    Revelation 7:9-17 doesn't require that there will be a pre-tribulation rapture. For in Revelation 7:9-17, the great multitude can be only that part of the church (Revelation 7:14b) which will enter the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, and then come out of it (Revelation 7:14) and enter heaven (Revelation 7:15) by dying (cf. Philippians 1:21,23; 2 Corinthians 5:8) during the 2nd through 6th seals in the chapter just prior (Revelation 6), the tribulation's first stage.

    This would be similar to how the souls of "them that were slain for the word of God", who will be under the altar in heaven at the 5th seal (Revelation 6:9-11), will enter heaven by dying sometime before the 5th seal. And it would be similar to how those in the church who will be on the sea of glass in heaven (Revelation 15:2, cf. Revelation 12:11) at the tribulation's 7 last plagues (Revelation chapters 15-16), the tribulation's final stage, will enter heaven by dying during the just-preceding, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign of the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

    Good point.

    For nothing in the Bible teaches or requires a pre-tribulation rapture of the church. Instead, the Bible makes clear that Jesus won't come and gather together (rapture) the church until immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). That's why the marriage of the church doesn't happen until Revelation 19:7, in connection with Jesus' 2nd coming and the bodily resurrection of the church at that time (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16). Matthew 24:30-31 refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus and gathering together (rapture) of the church as 2 Thessalonians 2:1, which refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus and catching up together (rapture) of the church as 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17.

    Jesus won't return and gather together (rapture) the church until sometime after there's a falling away (an apostasy) in the church, and the Antichrist sits in a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem and proclaims himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, Daniel 11:31,36, Revelation 11:1-2, Revelation 13:4-8), and the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the 3rd Jewish temple (Matthew 24:15-31, Daniel 11:31). For when Jesus returns to gather together (and marry) the church he will destroy the Antichrist (2 Thessalonians 2:1,8, Revelation 19:7,20). Before Jesus returns, the church will have to go through the future, literal 3.5 years of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-31).

    At Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:30), the church will be resurrected and caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:31), not to remove the church from the earth (Proverbs 10:30, John 17:15,20), but to take the church only as high as the clouds of the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

    At that meeting, Jesus will judge everyone in the church (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) by their works (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30). And then Jesus will marry in the clouds the obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), those in the church (of all times) who "overcame" to the end (Revelation 3:5, Revelation 2:26). They will then mount white horses and come back down from the sky (the first heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:14) as he defeats the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) and all the armies of the world (Revelation 19:15-21). Jesus will then make the marriage supper of Revelation 19:9 for the resurrected and married obedient part of the church in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54). Jesus and the obedient part of the church will then reign on the earth for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29).

    --

    The mistaken idea of a pre-tribulation rapture is dangerous because when no pre-tribulation rapture occurs, and pre-trib believers begin to suffer in the tribulation, they could think that God has somehow been defeated by Satan, that Satan by his power has caused a pre-trib rapture not to happen despite God wanting one to. Or they could think that God has cruelly broken his (supposed) promise, that he has pulled the rug out from under them, that he cruelly lied to them and must now be laughing at their surprise and suffering (Proverbs 1:26), so that in their rage they could curse God and commit apostasy during the tribulation (Isaiah 8:21-22, Matthew 24:9-13, Matthew 13:21), to the ultimate loss of their salvation (Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6; 2 Timothy 2:12).

    And even if they instead rightly think, "Okay, we must have just been mistaken in thinking that the rapture was supposed to be pre-trib. Satan hasn't defeated God, and God didn't lie to us", nonetheless, because they had held so strongly to the pre-trib idea for so long, their minds could be completely unprepared to face the long tribulation that lies ahead of them (just as holding too strongly to the mistaken idea of preterism, or historicism, or symbolicism, or spiritualism, could leave some believers less prepared mentally to endure the future tribulation).

    The Bible gives those in the church clear warning ahead of time about everything that they're going to have to face during the future tribulation (Mark 13:23, Revelation chapters 6 to 18, Revelation 1:1, Revelation 22:16), so that they can be better prepared mentally not to be blindsided (1 Peter 4:12-13) or deceived by anything that's coming (Matthew 24:4-5,23-25, Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20), and so that they can be better prepared mentally to endure the future tribulation with patience and faith to the end (Matthew 24:9-13, Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6), that is, until death or until Jesus returns immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 19:2 to 20:6; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8).
     
  10. Bible2

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    Amen.

    And all the obedient believers who died during Old Testament times are now part of the church in heaven (Hebrews 11:13-16, Hebrews 12:22-24), for now there are no believers outside of the church (Ephesians 4:4-6). And 1 Peter 4:6, 1 Peter 3:18c-19, and Ephesians 4:9 show that there was a post-resurrection descent of Jesus into Hades to preach the fulfillment of the gospel (of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) to the souls of the dead in Hades, after which preaching, Jesus ascended into heaven with all the souls of those in Hades who had died in faith (Ephesians 4:8-9, Hebrews 11:13-16, Hebrews 12:22-24).

    And 1 Thessalonians 3:13 and 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 show that at Jesus' 2nd coming, the souls of all obedient dead believers of all times will be brought down from the 3rd heaven with Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:14-15), and their souls will descend to the earth and their bodies will resurrect/rise from their graves (1 Thessalonians 4:16). Then they and all believers who will survive the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 on the earth (those who will still be "alive and remain") will be raptured up high into the air above the places all around the globe where they will be (1 Thessalonians 4:17a), and then they will be gathered together from the sky (the first heaven) all around the globe (Matthew 24:31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1) to the one place in the sky where the returned Jesus will be (1 Thessalonians 4:17b), which will be right above Jerusalem, before he sets his feet on the Mount of Olives (Zechariah 14:4-5, Acts 1:11-12).

    It's because of this 2nd-coming rapture into the sky, and then the gathering to where in the sky Jesus will be (and then the marriage of the obedient part of the church there to Jesus: Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), that the obedient part of the church will already be with Jesus when he subsequently descends from the sky (the first heaven) to the earth (Revelation 19:14, Revelation 17:14, Zechariah 14:5c,4).
     
  11. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    Last edited: Dec 7, 2013
  12. rdclmn7

    rdclmn7 Regular Member

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    These are gentiles, and its up to the reader to figure out why.
     
  13. SG9

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    In Revelation are the 144k and the multitude in heaven, they are two groups and not the same, although they are all in the same heaven after the multitude was caught up to the 144k in heaven. The 144k are who rise first and who rule the nations and afterwards are the multitude determined at the second harvest. Don't forget the two harvests. John sees the multitude when they arrive in heaven after the 144k are first seen. Thanks :)
     
  14. SG9

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    There is a reason for the two harvests, the 144k and the multitude, and they must be two groups of God's people. The 144k are to re-establish God's law and order on earth so that the multitude will be able to equate in Christ's Glory. The problem is the current world order and it's laws do not permit God's people (multitude) into heaven because they are held in spiritual captivity even though they don't believe it.

    This has been an issue because of the people who are of the new world order believe that there is no need for our salvation because they don't see anything wrong with themselves or the world; they think that all is well and we are just merely waiting to be taken to heaven but that cannot be without the 144k first restoring the things and they do it with the two resurrected witnesses and the Spirit of them. The Spirits of Elijah and Moses are who come in the 144k and they restore the world as it were before the new world order that now holds God's people in spiritual captivity.

    Once the 144k establish God's law and order once again, then the multitude will and may equate in Christ by God's laws and orders. The multitude will be freed from captivity and then later arrive in heaven after the 144k have battled the antichrist's new world order and have defeated it. God will be renown and the entire world who remain will then know God.

    The purpose of the 144k then tells us that there is something horribly wrong with the world in the last days and we are here. Some believe that a new world order has risen and others do not, and those who do not believe will not be able to understand the identity and mission of the 144k and the multitude who arrive in heaven after the 144k do. We do have a problem and the 144k will conquer the beast to open the door and make the path clear to heaven, making the way for Christ to come to make this possible.

    Two harvests, first the harvest of the elect 144k and then the multitude of the family of God. Those who believe that the 144k represents the entire family of God are not allowing for the harvesting of the multitude as they would be left out of the picture if the 144k are all of God's people; who then are the multitude if all of God's people are already accounted for in the 144k? And what are they then doing in heaven? The wrongful interpretation of the 144k and the multitude then suggest that the multitude are the wicked and they too are permitted in heaven; this is blasphemous and it nullifies the law of God and His plan of salvation. Thanks :)
     
  15. vinsight4u

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  16. vinsight4u

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  17. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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