Who Are Gentiles, Really??

[GospelS]

It might be as simple as, they just assume they aren't. For example if you were to ask people "are you Spanish?" Those who aren't aware of being Spanish would just say "No". It is of course possible they may have some Spanish blood, but they wouldn't take that into consideration. In all honesty when ever we are asked are race/ethnicity, we should perhaps all check "Other".

Thanks @jacks

That is what I don’t understand. Why assume when it comes to the matters that of their spiritual nature. Shouldn’t we all check “Israel”, since gentile or Jew or any other race is not an option?

 

[jacks]

Thanks @jacks

That is what I don’t understand. Why assume when it comes to the matters that of their spiritual nature. Shouldn’t we all check “Israel”, since gentile or Jew or any other race is not an option?

I agree it would be best to know. However, I don't think most people think that deeply about it. (Perhaps they should.) They only think "I'm not a Jew, so I must be a gentile."

 

[Loversofjesus_2018]

The point being that what's now doctrinally appropriate in the New Testament age is to abide by what Paul clearly shows.

Who says that now that’s what is doctrinally important is this, to abide by what Paul shows?

 

[ViaCrucis]

The new Israel has both grafted-in branches (gentiles) and natural branches (remnant of Israel). But how do some people know they are not the remnant of Israel unless they know their whole ancestry.

Well, my mother wasn't Jewish, and I am not a convert to Judaism. By definition that makes me a non-Jew, i.e. a Gentile.

Jewishness is not, strictly speaking, geneological. In the Bible we have Ruth, a Moabite woman, a Gentile, who converts. Ruth went from being a Gentile to being a Jew. Thus a convert to Judaism makes one a Jew; and likewise anyone born to a Jewish mother is Jewish. The children of Ruth--a convert--were born Jews.

Further: Simply having a Jewish ancestor would not make me hallachically Jewish. I would need to have been born a Jew from a Jewish mother, or else convert to Judaism. Since neither of these is true, that makes me a Gentile.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[faroukfarouk]

Who says that now that’s what is doctrinally important is this, to abide by what Paul shows?

Beyond saying it's the witness of Scripture, I'm not going to get into any argument with you.

 

[crossnote]

Some Christians assert or claim that they are gentiles. I have no idea how they come to that conclusion. The people of the nation of Israel mixed with other nations and they are spread across the world. I wonder how some people are able to trace their ancestry all the way back to the period of Genesis where all nations first started. Because I think there is no way someone can say they are gentile unless they know for sure that none of their whole ancestors ever belonged to the line of Jacob (Israel).

Hitler and his cronies seemed to have little trouble in picking out the Jews; how much less trouble will God have in singling out His own people the Jews?

 

[buzuxi02]

The people of the nation of Israel mixed with other nations and they are spread across the world.

In Judaism once your "mixed" you can only be a jew if your mother is jewish. The jewish bloodline is not passed through a jewish father only a jewish mother.

 

[StephenDiscipleofYHWH]

We are all Jews in Christ, Children of Abraham, and of the Circumcision of the Heart. We are Jews after the promise, we are all NT Jews through Faith. We are all one nation, one people, and one blood in Christ Yahshua.

 

[GospelS]

Well, my mother wasn't Jewish, and I am not a convert to Judaism. By definition that makes me a non-Jew, i.e. a Gentile.

Jewishness is not, strictly speaking, geneological. In the Bible we have Ruth, a Moabite woman, a Gentile, who converts. Ruth went from being a Gentile to being a Jew. Thus a convert to Judaism makes one a Jew; and likewise anyone born to a Jewish mother is Jewish. The children of Ruth--a convert--were born Jews.

Further: Simply having a Jewish ancestor would not make me hallachically Jewish. I would need to have been born a Jew from a Jewish mother, or else convert to Judaism. Since neither of these is true, that makes me a Gentile.

-CryptoLutheran

Ok. Jews won’t recognize you as Jewish as per their tradition or Judaism. Their definition is their own. But why are we defining ourselves by their definition of a Jew when its God who defines who His people the Jews are?.

> Can I find this definition in the Bible that your mother ought to be Jewish for you to be a Jew?
> Can I find in the Bible that if your mother wasn't Jewish, then you are a wild olive shoot, a grafted-in branch in God's olive tree? and if she was Jewish, then you are a natural branch? How can we take that definition to assume who we are in the olive tree?
> And what if my mother never knew if she comes from a Jewish bloodline?

Instead, Bible gives a contrary definition to that in Romans 2:28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. 29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

How can we say we are gentiles by that definition in Romans 2? It doesn’t say that anyone who is not keeping Judaism traditions or culture is a gentile. In fact it says that God does not consider one a Jew by their keeping of tradition or by ancestry. Then, shouldn’t we also do so irrespective of how Judaism defines a Jew? Or maybe that we are neither Jew nor Gentile?

 

[GospelS]

In Judaism once your "mixed" you can only be a jew if your mother is jewish. The jewish bloodline is not passed through a jewish father only a jewish mother.

> Can I find this definition in the Bible that your mother ought to be Jewish for you to be a Jew?
> Can I find in the Bible that if your mother wasn't Jewish, then you are a wild olive shoot, a grafted-in branch in God's olive tree? and if she was Jewish, then you are a natural branch? How can we take that definition to assume who we are in the olive tree?
> And what if my mother never knew if she comes from a Jewish bloodline?

Instead, Bible gives a contrary definition to that in Romans 2:28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. 29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

How can we say we are gentiles by that definition in Romans 2? It doesn’t say that anyone who is not keeping Judaism traditions or culture is a gentile. In fact it says that God does not consider one a Jew by their keeping of tradition or by ancestry. Then, shouldn’t we also do so irrespective of how Judaism defines a Jew? Or maybe that we are neither Jew nor a Gentile?

Jews won’t recognize you as Jewish as per their tradition or Judaism. Their definition is their own. But why are we defining ourselves by their definition of a Jew when its God who defines who His people the Jews are?

 

[GospelS]

Hitler and his cronies seemed to have little trouble in picking out the Jews; how much less trouble will God have in singling out His own people the Jews?

Yes, so only God knows who are His own people the Jews. I do not.

 

[GospelS]

Thanks for replies. Here's my new thread related to this discussion.

‘I AM A GENTILE. This Is Not For Me’

 

[HARK!]

Anyone not Jewish is a Gentile

What about Hebrews?

 

[klutedavid]

You could have a direct bloodline to one of the tribes of Israel (from maybe one Israelite some 4000 years ago who journeyed and spread his legacy outside of Israel) and how would you know you are not?

I don't think there would be many people on earth that could trace, their ancestry back say 1000 years.

So everyone is in the dark about their ancestry.

 

[klutedavid]

What about Hebrews?

All three terms, Hebrew, Jew, and Israelite, describe the same descendants of Abraham.

I don't think anyone knows the origin of the word, Hebrew.

You left out the Samaritans.

 

[GospelS]

I don't think there would be many people on earth that could trace, their ancestry back say 1000 years.

So everyone is in the dark about their ancestry.

Right. I know. That is why I wonder how some assert or claim without being able to trace it completely. I think it's incorrect to assume and depend our spiritual walk on that assumption when God has already called us in to His family, the true Israel. These assumptions create division among God's children. It is displeasing to God and we are grieving the Holy Spirit by saying 'oh, I'm a gentile/Jew'. That is what my concern is toward our Father and all my brothers/sisters in Christ.

 

[HARK!]

I don't think anyone knows the origin of the word, Hebrew.

It comes from the root:

to pass over or by or through, alienate, bring, carry, do away, take, take away, transgress

(Qal)

1. to pass over, cross, cross over, pass over, march over, overflow, go over
   
   
   H5674 - `abar - Strong's Hebrew Lexicon (KJV)

 

[HARK!]

All three terms, Hebrew, Jew, and Israelite, describe the same descendants of Abraham.

(CLV) Hb 8:10
"For this is the covenant which I shall be covenanting with the house of Israel after those days," the Lord is saying: "Imparting My laws to their comprehension, On their hearts, also, shall I be inscribing them, And I shall be to them for a God, And they/ shall be to Me for a people.

(CLV) Mt 15:24
Now He, answering, said, "I was not commissioned except for the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

 

[HARK!]

I don't think there would be many people on earth that could trace, their ancestry back say 1000 years.

So everyone is in the dark about their ancestry.

Genetic studies on Jews - Wikipedia

 

[Barney2.0]

What about Hebrews?

Ancestors of the Jews.