Who’s choice is it?

[Reformed Baptist]

Did God choose you because He knew you were going to choose Him or did God choose you and that’s why you choose Him?

 

[Lotar]

I chose God because He first chose me.

1 John 4:19
We love him, because he first loved us.

 

[Reformationist]

Did God choose you because He knew you were going to choose Him or did God choose you and that’s why you choose Him?

Romans 9:11
for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls

"Choosing Him" is a work. If we are "chosen" based on the fact that God knew we would choose Him then we were chosen on the basis of our works and would, thus, have something to brag about.

Romans 9:16
So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy.

Scripture clearly tells us that our being chosen is the product of the mercy of God. If it were because He saw that we were going to choose Him then it wouldn't be the product of His mercy. It would be the wages of our work and be a debt God was obligated to pay:

Romans 4:1-4
What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness." Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.

If our salvation be by grace then it cannot, by virtue of the meaning of grace, be the result of our works because then we would have something to boast about.

Many will say, "Wait, verse 5 of that very same chapter distinguishes between belief and works so believing cannot be a work." To that I would unequivocably agree. However, "believing" is more than just acknowledging the existance of God, for even the demons believe and tremble (James 2:19). No, "believing" is more than that so we must ask ourselves what it means to truly "believe" on the Lord and whether or not this is something that carnal man is capable of doing.

I believe Scripture is clear that carnal (unregenerate) man is morally incapable of willfully submitting to the sovereign authority of God.

God bless,
Don

 

[Reformed Baptist]

That's the way I see it...any other way seems childish and silly. Like God is going to trust us to choose Him...

 

[II Paradox II]

Did God choose you because He knew you were going to choose Him or did God choose you and that’s why you choose Him?

God chose me first, therefore I choose Him.

ken

 

[Grace_Alone4gives]

God chose me first, therefore I choose Him.

ken

Agreed.

 

[BBAS 64]

Did God choose you because He knew you were going to choose Him or did God choose you and that’s why you choose Him?

Good Day, RB

God chose me, so that he could give me the capcity to chose Him.

For His Glory Alone!

BBAS

 

[Reformationist]

Good Day, RB

God chose me, so that he could give me the capcity to chose Him.

For His Glory Alone!

BBAS

If all He did was "give you the capacity to choose Him" then I guess it's not for "His glory alone." You get at least a little of the glory because you made the right decision.

God bless

 

[BBAS 64]

If all He did was "give you the capacity to choose Him" then I guess it's not for "His glory alone." You get at least a little of the glory because you made the right decision.

God bless

Ref,

LOL

What was I thinking


Still His

BBAS

 

[AVBunyan]

Until someone can show me how a dead man can choose God then I might give it some thought at least

 

[BBAS 64]

Until someone can show me how a dead man can choose God then I might give it some thought at least

Good Day, AV

That all depends on how you define "dead" and the application of your deff. I mean after all on whose authority do you claim to have the "correct" understanding.


Peace to u

BBAS

 

[Reformed Baptist]

What else could 'dead' mean?

 

[AVBunyan]

Choose

Good Day, AV

That all depends on how you define "dead" and the application of your deff. BBAS

Good day BBAS 64 - I mean dead spiritually according to Eph. 2:1 and blind according to II Cor. 4:3,4 and dead according to our Lord - Mat 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.
Can't get much "deader".

Have a nice day

 

[BBAS 64]

Choose
Good day BBAS 64 - I mean dead spiritually according to Eph. 2:1 and blind according to II Cor. 4:3,4 and dead according to our Lord - Mat 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.
Can't get much "deader".

Have a nice day

Same to you AV, see you are an Independant Baptist, and a Calvinist thought I might be the only one.

Have a great Christmas

BBAS

 

[Blackhawk]

God wooed me and drug me into heaven with his love. He set me up in a family and a situation in which it was natural to choose him. And he came to me and made sure that I would choose him by displaying himself. He was so irresistable I had to choose him. His love was so natural and awesome that I really had and still have no otehr choice but to love and serve my Master all the days of my life. So I chose Him because he is so wonderful that words cannot express. And simply he did not let me choose any other way. I really do not why he chose a broken vessel like me but he did. Everything to his glory alone. Peace out!

 

[AVBunyan]

Same to you AV, see you are an Independant Baptist, and a Calvinist thought I might be the only one. Have a great Christmas BBAS

BBAS 64 - good to hear from you - yes, I'm a Calvinist and Independent Baptist and 1611 AV, and right division (I'm really whacked, huh!) - looking forward to chatting with you - good to know we are not alone out here - it appears there are some more

You have a blessed and safe holiday

 

[AVBunyan]

God wooed me and drug me into heaven with his love. He set me up in a family and a situation in which it was natural to choose him. And he came to me and made sure that I would choose him by displaying himself. He was so irresistable I had to choose him. His love was so natural and awesome that I really had and still have no otehr choice but to love and serve my Master all the days of my life. So I chose Him because he is so wonderful that words cannot express. And simply he did not let me choose any other way. I really do not why he chose a broken vessel like me but he did. Everything to his glory alone. Peace out!

Thanks, Blackhawk - I needed that - May God bless

 

[theseed]

If all He did was "give you the capacity to choose Him" then I guess it's not for "His glory alone." You get at least a little of the glory because you made the right decision.

God bless

I agree, but any glory we take, takes away from God. And will cause others to reject Christ based on our display of self-rightousness. I think, we can't imagine how awesome Christ will be and how humble we will be when we see him.

Believing in Christ and living the Christian life is self-serving b/c of the blessings it brings.

 

[orthedoxy]

God chose to bring the gospel to us we responded, he saved us because we chose him.

 

[Reformationist]

I agree, but any glory we take, takes away from God.

I agree. My statement was to point out, in jest of course, what I perceived as a theological error in his statement. I do believe it undercuts the role God plays in our regeneration and redemption to claim that His grace merely gives us the "capacity to choose." I am well aware of God's monergistic work within me that sovereignly brought me to life in Him and gave me the desire and ability to be His servant.

And will cause others to reject Christ based on our display of self-rightousness.

If we are blessed enough to acknowledge that our own awakening to His Lordship be the product of His irresistable grace it seems a bit presumptuous to assume that any action we may take would interfere with His divine ability to gather another of His chosen unto His flock. Not only is our own salvation solely by His grace, but our brethren's salvation as well. If we are in no position to take credit for His work for us then we are equally in no position to credit ourselves with thwarting His holy will for another. If someone be elected unto His redemption then our impotent efforts, either for or against Him, will certainly not hinder His cause.

Believing in Christ and living the Christian life is self-serving b/c of the blessings it brings.

Hmmm . . . I must admit that I'm a bit confused by this statement. Up until this point I was of the impression that you were a Christian but, I must say, this seems more in line with what a non-believer would say.

Are you a Christian or have I just misunderstood?

God bless