Where gravity and forces come from..!

[Split Rock]

That's pretty close -- some think they are the habitats of angels.

I think they are inhabited by invisible pink unicorns.

 

[Nabobalis]

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I think they are inhabited by invisible pink unicorns.

Nope, pink gnomes to be exact.

Anyone know what causes gravity? Exactly? How about the strong or weak nuclear forces? How about atomic spin? Where do the forces in our universe, or part of it, come from? How did they get there, according to science? Why must they be as they are?

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"We" know what causes the fundamental forces (not gravity as of yet). Nothing "causes" spin; spin is a property of the particle itself

The last 3 questions you ask are not science questions but philosophy questions and this is the wrong place to ask them..[/FONT]

 

[dad]

On stars, i've said this before, but i believe stars are ancient heros who looks down at us. Jesus had a star!!

OK. Who knows?

 

[dad]

... this is how gravity works.

I think we know how the forces work. Man has looked at how God set things up, and learned somewhat how it works in our world. We can look at an atom, and see things spinning. Then man gives it a name, like he invented it! 'Let's call it spin'.

 

[Delphiki]

You are in no position to declare the bible absurd, when it speaks of the future state. You are in no position to declare forces you do not even understand will or will not last!

On the contrary. I'm the one with evidence on my side. You've got an old book.

The physical only world is temporal, not eternal. The things that govern it will no longer be needed.

Are they needed now? For what? What evidence do you have that they will no longer be "needed"?

 

[dad]

No, it isn’t a free-for-all if one has an ounce of reason and intellectual honesty. When there is a lack of sound evidence supporting any conclusion, reasonable people don’t leap to any conclusion they feel like.

No idea what you are talking about? Someone lept to some conclusion on exactly what time and apace and gravity and strong nuclear force are?

Only credulous people jump to conclusions unsupported by any sound evidence. Christians such as yourself have leapt to the conclusion that your God created gravity, despite a complete lack of sound evidence supporting that credulous conclusion. There is zero sound evidence that your God even exists.

Nonsense. God says He created all things. That would include the laws in place at the moment and forces.

What a classic case of projection and lack of self-awareness. Scientists don’t believe they know what created gravity. Scientists have no such belief. Those with beliefs that have masqueraded as science here are the Christians. It is Christians who believe they know what created gravity. However, that unsubstantiated belief is not correct.

The beliefs I have in mind are not explanations of what the fundamental forces are. They are the belief that the laws and forces must apply to the future universe.

What you are saying here is: “I don’t know what causes gravity, but not knowing makes me anxious so I’m going to assume an answer that reinforces my comforting religious beliefs and I’m unable or unwilling to investigate any further.”

No. I am saying that man has investigated and come up empty. It is a waste of money and time to investigate things with a pre conceived belief applied to all that is being investigated. If the spiritual will be and was part of the universe then investigations that are framed around assuming the physical is all there was or will be or is, cannot find out the actual knowledge. Ever learning, never able to come to a knowledge...

Actually, I do have a way of knowing that. After decades of asking Christians questions about their beliefs, their responses have shown me that most of their religious beliefs are unsubstantiated and not true. Your responses confirm it. You too will be unable to show me that your beliefs that your God is real or that it created gravity are substantiated or true.

There is a knowledge of God in the world. There has been sacred texts passed down, and observations, and miracles, and the future revealed in advance, and people risen from the dead, etc. Science has merely chosen to keep the knowledge of God out of their knowledge pool. Therefore, asking to be shown within that little pool is hypocritical.

Looking without, men have been shown already often, and through all time.

As I said before, most of Christians’ religious beliefs depend on the core belief that their God is real. If your God isn’t real then it didn’t create gravity or anything else, it doesn’t answer prayers, Jesus wasn’t its son and it doesn’t grant eternal life.

Unless you are a bible believer, don't worry about what others believe. We all have beliefs.

Nowthen, let's look at what science doesn't know, shall we?

Time
Gravity

• Electromagnetism
• Weak Interaction (or Weak Nuclear Force)
• Strong Interaction (or Strong Nuclear Force)

Space

Then there is the causes of nuclear spin, and Intrinsic spin, and all sorts of things we may be able to tack on to the list here. Anyone have a good one?


Science is mostly an observer that looks at the wonders God has done, and tries to steal the credit for it all.

 

[dad]

On the contrary. I'm the one with evidence on my side. You've got an old book.

Evidence? For what, where? Focus.

Are they needed now? For what? What evidence do you have that they will no longer be "needed"?

According to the bible this world will be no more as is. What about science? Does it know better!!?? No. It knows nothing as is the case on all important issues it seems.

 

[Split Rock]

According to the bible this world will be no more as is. What about science? Does it know better!!?? No. It knows nothing as is the case on all important issues it seems.

Ahhhh... but dad does know. He is God's lonely Prophet on Earth. All alone with The Truth.

 

[sandwiches]

According to the bible...

No more need be said. The Biblist has spoken.

 

[Nabobalis]

Nowthen, let's look at what science doesn't know, shall we?

Time
Gravity

• Electromagnetism
• Weak Interaction (or Weak Nuclear Force)
• Strong Interaction (or Strong Nuclear Force)

Space

Then there is the causes of nuclear spin, and Intrinsic spin, and all sorts of things we may be able to tack on to the list here. Anyone have a good one?


Science is mostly an observer that looks at the wonders God has done, and tries to steal the credit for it all.

The issue here is that you want to know why and that isn't what science is for, it explains the how.

We know how electromagnetism,weak interaction and the strong interaction work, what particles are used in the interactions, how they interact, we can work out how often that decay can happen etc

Nothing causes spin, it just exists as property of the particle much like the charge of particles. Also I'm sure nuclear spin and Intrinsic spin are the same.

 

[dad]

The issue here is that you want to know why and that isn't what science is for, it explains the how.

So how did the forces come to exist as is? How do you know they will remain the same? How do the forces work?

We know how electromagnetism,weak interaction and the strong interaction work, what particles are used in the interactions, how they interact, we can work out how often that decay can happen etc

Oh really? So tell us then, how does the strong interaction work? By that, I mean, what causes it precisely?

Nothing causes spin, it just exists as property of the particle much like the charge of particles. Also I'm sure nuclear spin and Intrinsic spin are the same.

"An intrinsic property is an essential or inherent property of a system or of a material itself or within. " wiki


So how did the property get into the material?

Also, how about time? Do you know what it is? Can we say that time exists in the far universe? If so, how do you know that? And please, don't say because it exists here!

 

[sandwiches]

So how did the forces come to exist as is? How do you know they will remain the same? How do the forces work?

We don't know they will always be the same but we have no reason to think they won't be.

"An intrinsic property is an essential or inherent property of a system or of a material itself or within. " wiki


So how did the property get into the material?

You quote the definition and still don't understand it... just... wow...

 

[dad]

We don't know they will always be the same but we have no reason to think they won't be.

I would think that if you do not know something you have no reason to think something. Well, Christians have reason to think something.

You quote the definition and still don't understand it... just... wow...

What I want to see science understand is what embeds the property in there. Not just declaring that they notice one is embedded! Science is so shallow intellectually.

 

[AV1611VET]

Science is so shallow intellectually.

Mom would never let us kids play in the deep end of the pool until we could swim.

Likewise, mother nature won't let her kids play in the deep end of the knowledge pool until they can swim.

 

[Split Rock]

What I want to see science understand is what embeds the property in there.

Nothing is "embedded." You have been reading too many of AVET"s posts.

Science is so shallow intellectually.

LOL!! You aren't really a creationist.. are you dad? How many times have I asked you to actually tell us what practical benefit dadology is to understanding anything?
Put your money where your mouth is, scoffer!

 

[Split Rock]

Mom would never let us kids play in the deep end of the pool until we could swim.

Likewise, mother nature won't let her kids play in the deep end of the knowledge pool until they can swim.

only by interpreting scripture the way you do... right?

 

[Lillen]

Mimers well...

 

[dad]

Mom would never let us kids play in the deep end of the pool until we could swim.

Likewise, mother nature won't let her kids play in the deep end of the knowledge pool until they can swim.

So they may have to wait a while.

 

[dad]

Nothing is "embedded." You have been reading too many of AVET"s posts.

Well, call it what you like, or have the tooth fairy put it there while we all sleep. Whatever. In other words how does it get there?

LOL!! You aren't really a creationist.. are you dad? How many times have I asked you to actually tell us what practical benefit dadology is to understanding anything?
Put your money where your mouth is, scoffer!

No idea what that has to do with the inability of physical only science to delve into the deeper basics of life and forces and laws.

 

[Lillen]

Knowledge allows us to percive our world the way others has described it.... whether hawking describes a universe as a hologram, or God describes it as being created in six days...