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What's wrong with gravity theory?

devin553344

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I've been studying physics now for 10 years and I was running some calculations and realized that if gravity was correct the sun would rip all of us off the planet as its acceleration field is stronger than the earths.

I was running some time dilation calculations when I realized this. The sun produces about 6,000 m/s^2 acceleration while the earth produces about 9.8 m/s^2

Am I thinking about this wrong?
 
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Yttrium

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Sorry, broken in an edit. Will repair later.

We can't be ripped off the Earth due to gravity. The Sun's gravity pulls us, the Earth, the Moon, the whole shebang. The whole Earth system falls towards the Sun at the same rate.
 
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Sabertooth

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g= force of gravity
G= a gravitational constant
m₁= mass of the first object (like a planet or sun)
m₂= mass of the second object (like a person)
d= the distance between the two centers of mass

In Newtonian physics, g = (Gm₁m₂)/d²
That means that the farther two masses are from each other, the weaker their gravitational attraction.

I believe the two acceleration figures that you cited were those at the surface (of the Sun & Earth).
 
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devin553344

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g= force of gravity
G= a gravitational constant
m₁= mass of the first object (like a planet or sun)
m₂= mass of the second object (like a person)
d= the distance between the two centers of mass

In Newtonian physics, g = (Gm₁m₂)/d²
That means that the farther two masses are from each other, the weaker their gravitational effect on each other.

I believe the two acceleration figures that you cited were those at the surface (of the Earth & Sun).

I used Gm/r^2 and the surface of the earth and the distance from sun to earth.
 
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SkyWriting

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I've been studying physics now for 10 years and I was running some calculations and realized that if gravity was correct the sun would rip all of us off the planet as its acceleration field is stronger than the earths.

I was running some time dilation calculations when I realized this. The sun produces about 6,000 m/s^2 acceleration while the earth produces about 9.8 m/s^2

Am I thinking about this wrong?

When they touch, perhaps then.
 
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Freodin

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I've been studying physics now for 10 years and I was running some calculations and realized that if gravity was correct the sun would rip all of us off the planet as its acceleration field is stronger than the earths.

I was running some time dilation calculations when I realized this. The sun produces about 6,000 m/s^2 acceleration while the earth produces about 9.8 m/s^2

Am I thinking about this wrong?
Nevermind I forgot to add a 1000 to the kilometers for the sun distance :doh:
I'm not quite sure what to make of that, and if it is meant as a kind of joke, I apologize in advance.

But if this is serious, I have to wonder about your mindset... a mindset that seems to be very wide spread today.

See, when I was still in high school, I once had to solve a physics problem, involving an ice cube suspended over a candle. We were to calculate how long it would take the ice to melt.

So, then I "was running some calculations and realized" that my cube would take something a little over three days to melt.

Of course I realized that I had made a mistake somewhere, and even if I didn't manage to identify it and correct my answer, I knew that the mistake was on my side.

But today it seems fashionable, if you made such a mistake, to first go on the internet and declare that all of physics has been wrong for the last centuries, and you only now discovered this.

Sometimes I dispair of people today.
 
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FrumiousBandersnatch

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I'm not quite sure what to make of that, and if it is meant as a kind of joke, I apologize in advance.

But if this is serious, I have to wonder about your mindset... a mindset that seems to be very wide spread today.

See, when I was still in high school, I once had to solve a physics problem, involving an ice cube suspended over a candle. We were to calculate how long it would take the ice to melt.

So, then I "was running some calculations and realized" that my cube would take something a little over three days to melt.

Of course I realized that I had made a mistake somewhere, and even if I didn't manage to identify it and correct my answer, I knew that the mistake was on my side.

But today it seems fashionable, if you made such a mistake, to first go on the internet and declare that all of physics has been wrong for the last centuries, and you only now discovered this.

Sometimes I dispair of people today.
Yes - it's worth noting that when the OPERA experiment detected neutrinos travelling faster than light, the experimenters did multiple checks of their results, then asked for help from the scientific community, to investigate what was going on. They didn't announce that Einstein was wrong, they announced an anomalous result. This is the correct scientific procedure - not only do you attempt to falsify your hypothesis, but if you get an anomalous experimental result, you try to falsify that too - bearing in mind that others in the field will try to do that if you don't.
 
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Sabertooth

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But today it seems fashionable, if you made such a mistake, to first go on the internet and declare that all of physics has been wrong for the last centuries, and you only now discovered this.
In his defense, the thread is entitled "What's wrong with [my?] gravity theory?"
 
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I do not believe that gravity affects in the manner that we think it does. I do not believe that it causes an elliptical orbit of planets. Like the orbits that we have observed and measured for hundreds of years. I believe it to be an illusion and nature has been laughing at us.

I think our orbit is a helix with two rotations at the same time. Two perpendicular rotations. Imagine a clock face, only replace the hours with months, with Dec. at 12:00 o'clock, with the months backwards, and counterclockwise.
Mar. at 9, June at 6 and Sept at 3. This clock has one hand which has a length of 1.5 millions miles. At the end of this hand is the earth. It rotates once around the clock in one year. The earth's axis remains vertical on the clock all year. The center of the clock, and the Mar. and Sept. of the clock always intersect on the sun's equatorial plane. The center of the clock is always at 93 million miles from the suns center. So the sun's radius and the clock's radius each make one rotation in one year. They are perpendicular rotations. This configuration is a one turn closed helix. Any one turn helix shadowed on a screen will appear as a ellipse. Because it removes the depth or 3D component. Vary the small radius, to adjust the flatness of the projected "ellipse". That's how nature does it.....check out the other plants. Subtract the perigee from the apogee....that gives you the clock diameter for that planet.

Elliptical orbits can not be conserved. That's why our solar system is relatively clean of elliptical debris. Many have doubted my premise, but I believe the images of satellite moons orbiting in volcanic/geyser debris have given favor for this idea.

It's a perpendicular interaction of attraction and momentum.

But the question remains, what causes the attraction? I don't believe that gravity is a fundamental property. I think that a gravity field only comes from a dipole or bonded matter. When a dipole forms, there are several un-equal motions and areas to a dipole configuration. As a matter of fact, the ONLY equal parameter they have in common is the electric field potential. The momentum and energy of the proton is 1800 times more than the electron. The motion of the proton is right handed and the electron is left handed. Even though the electric potential is equal, the positive field is much denser than the negative field......the negative occupies much more area than the proton. And the proton has more mass and inertia.......that means the electron does almost all the displacement. If we assume that gravity's attractive force...is to equalize a parameter......we have several here to track down.

The dynamic of gravity is just the opposite of the dynamic of charge. In the gravity dynamic, the configuration prevents the fall, or counteracts the "IN" direction. The whole function is to counter the attractive force. In the charge dynamic, the configuration prevents the expansion, due to charge self-repulsion.
The whole function is to counter the repulsive "out" force.

Science never teaches or realizes how important the in and out forces are. Or how they act. The reason that light always has the same velocity........is because it is a perpendicular acceleration that results in a constant velocity. Frame Velocity does not affect perpendicularity. Even at c speed, a perpendicular is still a perpendicular.....therefore the same apparent velocity. Don't think of light as having a velocity........think of it as an area acceleration. It's not like the velocity of a marble. The area acceleration is constantly losing density, or "mass" if you prefer. A marble does not.

Perpendiculars are common to all frames at all velocities.
 
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FrumiousBandersnatch

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I do not believe that gravity affects in the manner that we think it does. I do not believe that it causes an elliptical orbit of planets. Like the orbits that we have observed and measured for hundreds of years. I believe it to be an illusion and nature has been laughing at us...
People believe all kinds of crazy things. When it comes to gravity and planetary orbits, to be taken seriously you need to demonstrate that your ideas explain at least everything the current theory does, and explain it better.

The Dunning-Kruger effect seems the most likely explanation for your gravity beliefs; that or POE.
 
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Ophiolite

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I do not believe that gravity affects in the manner that we think it does. I do not believe that it causes an elliptical orbit of planets. Like the orbits that we have observed and measured for hundreds of years. I believe it to be an illusion and nature has been laughing at us.

I think our orbit is a helix with two rotations at the same time. Two perpendicular rotations. Imagine a clock face, only replace the hours with months, with Dec. at 12:00 o'clock, with the months backwards, and counterclockwise.
Mar. at 9, June at 6 and Sept at 3. This clock has one hand which has a length of 1.5 millions miles. At the end of this hand is the earth. It rotates once around the clock in one year. The earth's axis remains vertical on the clock all year. The center of the clock, and the Mar. and Sept. of the clock always intersect on the sun's equatorial plane. The center of the clock is always at 93 million miles from the suns center. So the sun's radius and the clock's radius each make one rotation in one year. They are perpendicular rotations. This configuration is a one turn closed helix. Any one turn helix shadowed on a screen will appear as a ellipse. Because it removes the depth or 3D component. Vary the small radius, to adjust the flatness of the projected "ellipse". That's how nature does it.....check out the other plants. Subtract the perigee from the apogee....that gives you the clock diameter for that planet.

Elliptical orbits can not be conserved. That's why our solar system is relatively clean of elliptical debris. Many have doubted my premise, but I believe the images of satellite moons orbiting in volcanic/geyser debris have given favor for this idea.

It's a perpendicular interaction of attraction and momentum.

But the question remains, what causes the attraction? I don't believe that gravity is a fundamental property. I think that a gravity field only comes from a dipole or bonded matter. When a dipole forms, there are several un-equal motions and areas to a dipole configuration. As a matter of fact, the ONLY equal parameter they have in common is the electric field potential. The momentum and energy of the proton is 1800 times more than the electron. The motion of the proton is right handed and the electron is left handed. Even though the electric potential is equal, the positive field is much denser than the negative field......the negative occupies much more area than the proton. And the proton has more mass and inertia.......that means the electron does almost all the displacement. If we assume that gravity's attractive force...is to equalize a parameter......we have several here to track down.

The dynamic of gravity is just the opposite of the dynamic of charge. In the gravity dynamic, the configuration prevents the fall, or counteracts the "IN" direction. The whole function is to counter the attractive force. In the charge dynamic, the configuration prevents the expansion, due to charge self-repulsion.
The whole function is to counter the repulsive "out" force.

Science never teaches or realizes how important the in and out forces are. Or how they act. The reason that light always has the same velocity........is because it is a perpendicular acceleration that results in a constant velocity. Frame Velocity does not affect perpendicularity. Even at c speed, a perpendicular is still a perpendicular.....therefore the same apparent velocity. Don't think of light as having a velocity........think of it as an area acceleration. It's not like the velocity of a marble. The area acceleration is constantly losing density, or "mass" if you prefer. A marble does not.

Perpendiculars are common to all frames at all velocities.
I do not believe that gravity affects in the manner that we think it does. I do not believe that it causes an elliptical orbit of planets. Like the orbits that we have observed and measured for hundreds of years. I believe it to be an illusion and nature has been laughing at us.

I think our orbit is a helix with two rotations at the same time. Two perpendicular rotations. Imagine a clock face, only replace the hours with months, with Dec. at 12:00 o'clock, with the months backwards, and counterclockwise.
Mar. at 9, June at 6 and Sept at 3. This clock has one hand which has a length of 1.5 millions miles. At the end of this hand is the earth. It rotates once around the clock in one year. The earth's axis remains vertical on the clock all year. The center of the clock, and the Mar. and Sept. of the clock always intersect on the sun's equatorial plane. The center of the clock is always at 93 million miles from the suns center. So the sun's radius and the clock's radius each make one rotation in one year. They are perpendicular rotations. This configuration is a one turn closed helix. Any one turn helix shadowed on a screen will appear as a ellipse. Because it removes the depth or 3D component. Vary the small radius, to adjust the flatness of the projected "ellipse". That's how nature does it.....check out the other plants. Subtract the perigee from the apogee....that gives you the clock diameter for that planet.

Elliptical orbits can not be conserved. That's why our solar system is relatively clean of elliptical debris. Many have doubted my premise, but I believe the images of satellite moons orbiting in volcanic/geyser debris have given favor for this idea.

It's a perpendicular interaction of attraction and momentum.

But the question remains, what causes the attraction? I don't believe that gravity is a fundamental property. I think that a gravity field only comes from a dipole or bonded matter. When a dipole forms, there are several un-equal motions and areas to a dipole configuration. As a matter of fact, the ONLY equal parameter they have in common is the electric field potential. The momentum and energy of the proton is 1800 times more than the electron. The motion of the proton is right handed and the electron is left handed. Even though the electric potential is equal, the positive field is much denser than the negative field......the negative occupies much more area than the proton. And the proton has more mass and inertia.......that means the electron does almost all the displacement. If we assume that gravity's attractive force...is to equalize a parameter......we have several here to track down.

The dynamic of gravity is just the opposite of the dynamic of charge. In the gravity dynamic, the configuration prevents the fall, or counteracts the "IN" direction. The whole function is to counter the attractive force. In the charge dynamic, the configuration prevents the expansion, due to charge self-repulsion.
The whole function is to counter the repulsive "out" force.

Science never teaches or realizes how important the in and out forces are. Or how they act. The reason that light always has the same velocity........is because it is a perpendicular acceleration that results in a constant velocity. Frame Velocity does not affect perpendicularity. Even at c speed, a perpendicular is still a perpendicular.....therefore the same apparent velocity. Don't think of light as having a velocity........think of it as an area acceleration. It's not like the velocity of a marble. The area acceleration is constantly losing density, or "mass" if you prefer. A marble does not.

Perpendiculars are common to all frames at all velocities.
Creative. Interesting. Now, could you show me the maths?
 
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Mule Train

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There is another aspect about gravity in which I do not agree. This is the "evidence" of gravity bending light.

I can remember in high school of doing experiments with a flash light and a large fish bowl of different solutions. In some solutions there was a sharp density gradient, called a boundary, and the sharp density gradient would bounce or reflect the flash light beam. If the solution had a gradual density gradient, the beam would bend or bow like an arc. Not sure, but I think the solution was sugar water.

The sun also has a gradient, but it's not neutral matter.....it's plasma. A ring of plasma. The light from distant stars only bends, within that ring. If gravity were bending the light, the bending effect would follow the square wave law, with distance from sun. But the bending effect stops at the ring.....no bending occurs outside the ring. Plasma density gradients bend light.

YouTube has many examples of density gradients, only they use lasers now.

As in reference to the sun.....it's called a plasma limb.

We have watched and mapped the "elliptical" orbits of stars around our black hole(~25,000 thousand years ago). We find no distortion in the light from these stars as they rotate around that black hole. This alone is a huge red flag. So......either gravity does not bend light, OR we don't have a black hole. Either one, means, we got to start over with gravity.

It appears that our understanding of reality is discombobulated.

I think we should start over with light.
 
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JackRT

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I've been studying physics now for 10 years and I was running some calculations and realized that if gravity was correct the sun would rip all of us off the planet as its acceleration field is stronger than the earths.

I was running some time dilation calculations when I realized this. The sun produces about 6,000 m/s^2 acceleration while the earth produces about 9.8 m/s^2

Am I thinking about this wrong?

What you term the "acceleration field" is not uniform. Without questioning your calculations I will accept that the acceleration due to gravity is 6000 m/s^2 at the surface of the sun just as it is 9.8 m/s^2 at the surface of the earth. In both cases these acceleration numbers drop off quite rapidly by the inverse square law of gravity. At the distance of the earth from the sun, it is powerful enough to keep our planet in orbit but far too small to pull a person off the surface. If you wish I can do the calculations for you.

JackRT, BSc, MSc, BEd
 
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Mule Train

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That math equation for gravity only works under very strict conditions. One condition is to freeze time. The other condition is no spin on either masses, and no relative motion. No angular momentum and no linear momentum.

A second term is needed for those momentums.
 
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JackRT

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Yes - it's worth noting that when the OPERA experiment detected neutrinos travelling faster than light, the experimenters did multiple checks of their results, then asked for help from the scientific community, to investigate what was going on. They didn't announce that Einstein was wrong, they announced an anomalous result. This is the correct scientific procedure - not only do you attempt to falsify your hypothesis, but if you get an anomalous experimental result, you try to falsify that too - bearing in mind that others in the field will try to do that if you don't.

That is precisely what happened when Fleischman and Pons announced that they had observed cold fusion. It was very quickly disproven by other researchers. If they had announced an anomalous result they would not have lost their reputations.
 
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Ophiolite

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That is precisely what happened when Fleischman and Pons announced that they had observed cold fusion. It was very quickly disproven by other researchers. If they had announced an anomalous result they would not have lost their reputations.
The same example also crossed my mind. Scientists are trained to be sceptical. The greatest scepticism must be directed at their own ideas and findings.

Not quiet the same thing, but in proof reading engineering reports I had written I imagined that I was not the author, but the writer was someone I detested. Every error of fact, every weakness of structure, every vital omission I found could be thrown in their face. It's amazing how many mistakes one can find when properly motivated. :)
 
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