Lust - What does normal look like?

[RG2009]

What does normal look like for experience and life long christians? i am new and recovering from 20 years of pornography not realizing it was a problem. im a full believer in god and jesus christ, learning and believing more every day. i grew up in a secular home, more so athiest. parents divorced in 5th grade, dad moved out and only loving me with material, and my mother worked swing shift. so i was basically raised by grandmothers and my friends in public school. in 6th grade is where it all started, and it became like brushing your teeth, just a habit. im married now with 2 kids and want to be the parents i never had, and God is helping me with that. but since my community and family has tainted my developmental years where a kid grows, i have no idea what is normal.

What i believe as of now, Masturbation is bad, and so is lust. However the lust is confusing me. i understand that if i look at a woman for more than just a couple seconds and/or have sexual thoughts like "thats nice" or "id like to..." i feel like that is obiously lust. But is it bad to notice that a woman is attractive? is it bad to have lustful thoughts with my wife? i was attracted to her for both her looks and her foundational beliefs. is it bad for me to desire my wife sexually? some of this just seems so contradictory in this area and vague. I love my wife and sex is gods gift, and i have changed and am still changing and i love those intimate private moments with her, but i almost feel wrong for desiring her, and i dont know if that is a misunderstanding or not.

i just have no examples to work off of and no one to talk to about this. i go to celebrate recovery, and that is great and all. but i cant ask them what is normal because they have my same problem, so something went wrong at some point.

Any input is appreciated.

 

[RDKirk]

The Greek word word translated as “lust” in English can refer to strong desire or longing, and not necessarily something sexual. The Greek word behind this is most often ἐπιθυμία (epithymia), which can mean either positive or negative desire depending on the context.

Jesus' desire to eat the Passover (Last Supper) in Luke 22:15 and Paul's desire to see the Thessalonians again in 1 Thessalonians 2:17 are examples where epithymia is used positively in scripture.

There are three other examples in the New Testament:

Philippians 1:23 –- Desire to be with Christ

Hebrews 6:11 –- Desire for diligence

Luke 16:21 –- Hunger (Lazarus)

In biblical terms, a lust (epithymia) becomes a sin when the object of the desire is forbidden or the desire overpowers self-control or proper priorities, even if the object is good.

An example of sinful lust is Romans 7:7,8:

“...Thou shalt not covet. But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence [epithymia]…”

And again in Galatians 5:16–17:

“...ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.”

Lust becomes sinful when it violates God’s boundaries or becomes a god in itself. The issue is not that we desire and sometimes not what we desire, but always how we act on that desire.

Paul says in Romans 6 that "your master is the one you obey." When you "obey your thirst," you have turned your lust into your god.

So, can your desire for sex with your wife be sinful? Yes, if you let that lust control your decisions and actions. No, when you keep it in its rightful place among your life priorities.

 

[.Mikha'el.]

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[linux.poet]

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[Richard T]

The Greek word word translated as “lust” in English can refer to strong desire or longing, and not necessarily something sexual. The Greek word behind this is most often ἐπιθυμία (epithymia), which can mean either positive or negative desire depending on the context.

Jesus' desire to eat the Passover (Last Supper) in Jesus' desire to eat the Passover (Last Supper) in Luke 22:15 and Paul's desire to see the Thessalonians again in 1 Thessalonians 2:17 are examples where epithymia is used positively in scripture.

There are three other examples in the New Testament:

Philippians 1:23 –- Desire to be with Christ

Hebrews 6:11 –- Desire for diligence

Luke 16:21 –- Hunger (Lazarus)

In biblical terms, a lust (epithymia) becomes a sin when the object of the desire is forbidden or the desire overpowers self-control or proper priorities, even if the object is good.

An example of sinful lust is Romans 7:7,8:

“...Thou shalt not covet. But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence [epithymia]…”

And again in Galatians 5:16–17:

“...ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.”

Lust becomes sinful when it violates God’s boundaries or becomes a god in itself. The issue is not that we desire and sometimes not what we desire, but always how we act on that desire.

Paul says in Romans 6 that "your master is the one you obey." When you "obey your thirst," you have turned your lust into your god.

So, can your desire for sex with your wife be sinful? Yes, if you let that lust control your decisions and actions. No, when you keep it in its rightful place among your life priorities.

How can lust for your wife be wrong as you both are already one? Paul already knew that marriage would distract from ministry. But I think Paul neglects the idea that two are better than one, that a couple can multiply a ministry through God. In some cases singles will not even be hired as a pastor. I would consider that too much lust/love time together could be sinful. This though is only because you do have other responsibilities. God even was aware of that when giving Duet 24:5 for newlyweds.
When a man hath taken a new wife, he shall not go out to war, neither shall he be charged with any business: but he shall be free at home one year, and shall cheer up his wife which he hath taken.

I think too there is room to distinguish between selfish lust and love as secularists even do this. Ai quoted this thought: "Lust is primarily driven by physical attraction and sexual desire, while love encompasses deeper emotional connection, commitment, and care for the other person."

I think a great marriage would have both. Song of Solomon I think encompasses both.

Song of Songs 4:9-14 (KJV)
9 Thou hast ravished my heart, my sister, my spouse; thou hast ravished my heart with one of thine eyes, with one chain of thy neck.
10 How fair is thy love, my sister, my spouse! how much better is thy love than wine! and the smell of thine ointments than all spices!
11 Thy lips, O my spouse, drop as the honeycomb: honey and milk are under thy tongue; and the smell of thy garments is like the smell of Lebanon.
12 A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.
13 Thy plants are an orchard of pomegranates, with pleasant fruits; camphire, with spikenard,
14 Spikenard and saffron; calamus and cinnamon, with all trees of frankincense; myrrh and aloes, with all the chief spices:

So are there any sinful lusts that exist in a married couple? I don't think so as long as the focus is on each other.

 

[Richard T]

What does normal look like for experience and life long christians? i am new and recovering from 20 years of pornography not realizing it was a problem. im a full believer in god and jesus christ, learning and believing more every day. i grew up in a secular home, more so athiest. parents divorced in 5th grade, dad moved out and only loving me with material, and my mother worked swing shift. so i was basically raised by grandmothers and my friends in public school. in 6th grade is where it all started, and it became like brushing your teeth, just a habit. im married now with 2 kids and want to be the parents i never had, and God is helping me with that. but since my community and family has tainted my developmental years where a kid grows, i have no idea what is normal.

What i believe as of now, Masturbation is bad, and so is lust. However the lust is confusing me. i understand that if i look at a woman for more than just a couple seconds and/or have sexual thoughts like "thats nice" or "id like to..." i feel like that is obiously lust. But is it bad to notice that a woman is attractive? is it bad to have lustful thoughts with my wife? i was attracted to her for both her looks and her foundational beliefs. is it bad for me to desire my wife sexually? some of this just seems so contradictory in this area and vague. I love my wife and sex is gods gift, and i have changed and am still changing and i love those intimate private moments with her, but i almost feel wrong for desiring her, and i dont know if that is a misunderstanding or not.

i just have no examples to work off of and no one to talk to about this. i go to celebrate recovery, and that is great and all. but i cant ask them what is normal because they have my same problem, so something went wrong at some point.

Any input is appreciated.

I did not comment on much of what you are seeking but I did give some thoughts about lust inside of marriage in a later response. I will say that in my reading of the subject there are differences of opinions as to what constitutes lust and sexual sin and where the boundaries are drawn. I think some of this is up to an individual conscience, which is kind of difficult when the conscience has been violated from previous life experiences. Hopefully others will offer their take. God bless

 

[RDKirk]

How can lust for your wife be wrong as you both are already one?

I'm "one" with my stomach, but prioritizing my stomach above God would also be a sin.

 

[.Mikha'el.]

Lust absolutely should not be conflated with a normal biological urge for sexual release. The latter is just part of being human, and it is going to happen regardless of being married or not. I disagree completely with the OP with respect to masturbation. It is a very useful tool when sex is not an option so we don't go crazy on account of libido. WIth that said, it should be saved for when there is real physical need, and we shouidn't be doing it on every whim or making excuses to do it.

As far as lust goes, I tend to define it more narrowly. The modern church conflates it with simple sexual appetite, and I think it's totally unbiblical. Lust to me is wanting sex with someone who's off-limits. Married men shouldn't want sex with another women, and so forth. People shouldn't want relations with others of the same sex, etc.

You all are free to agree or disagree.