What Would YOU Do If . . .?

[roflcopter101]

it is not debatable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_the_bible
I think it is.

 

[roflcopter101]

I've never even seen where they say it is 100% true that homosexuality is genetic.

And I've never seen where they say it is 100% chosen.

 

[angellica]

Wikipedia says that "Clinical psychology includes the scientific study and application of psychology for the purpose of understanding, preventing, and relieving psychologically-based distress or dysfunction and to promote subjective well-being and personal development."
If the vast majority of forced closet-homosexuality has led to psychologically-based distress or dysfunction, why would a psychologist be endorsing such an imposition?

They are not forced to be "closeted homosexuals" if they are seeking help for their problems. They are trying to get away from the sin and get on with their life.

 

[angellica]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_the_bible
I think it is.

I can look up just about anything in Wikipedia on my own, but when it comes to the Bible, that is nowhere near the top of my choices for interpreting it.

 

[angellica]

And I've never seen where they say it is 100% chosen.

Right, but it is a choice to have gay sex and be romantic with your gay partner.

 

[roflcopter101]

They are not forced to be "closeted homosexuals" if they are seeking help for their problems. They are trying to get away from the sin and get on with their life.

By having someone else force them to conform to a lifestyle they may or may not want?

 

[geekgirlkelli]

I was 8 when I told my parents, it was a non issue with my mother and my father tried to kill me.

Wow? Yours too? I showed "girly" tendencies when I was little and my father made sure to shame me right into the closet. My father was also very abusive and the church rescued me from him and the abusive kids at school, in a way. So then the church shamed me into being closeted.

About 30 years later I was finally able to come to terms with myself and came out to my parents. My Mom loves me unconditionally and my father tried to kill me. Of course, I had a bit more to come out about than the average gay person. I came out as IS/TS and bisexual. The first thing my mother said when I came out to them there in their living room was "That explains a lot about your childhood."

Now, I find out that technically I am genetically intersexed with a very odd chromosome oddity, which was probably also responsible for giving me cardiomyopathy, a convex protruding breastbone and a deformed lower spine. My father still hates me.

 

[roflcopter101]

I can look up just about anything in Wikipedia on my own, but when it comes to the Bible, that is nowhere near the top of my choices for interpreting it.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_bibl.htm
http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-walter-wink
Google has more.

Right, but it is a choice to have gay sex and be romantic with your gay partner.

If heterosexual acts was declared a sin in the bible or by god/the pope/the Flying Spaghetti Monster/etc, then it would also be a choice to be romantic or sexual with your heterosexual partner!

 

[roflcopter101]

By the way, Angellica, do you eat shrimp or lobster?

 

[angellica]

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_bibl.htm
http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-walter-wink
Google has more.

They twist the words around to fit their sexual desires.

If heterosexual acts was declared a sin in the bible or by god/the pope/the Flying Spaghetti Monster/etc, then it would also be a choice to be romantic or sexual with your heterosexual partner!

Yes, it would still be a choice.

 

[WatersMoon110]

Right, but it is a choice to have gay sex and be romantic with your gay partner.

But it isn't a choice to be romantically attracted to someone of their own gender.

Can you imagine trying to remain celibate for life? Trying to quash every thought you had about another person being attractive - because you were told that finding that sort of person attractive is wrong? Having to watch everyone around you fall in love and pair off - knowing that if you did the same with anyone you loved you would be acting "sinfully" and your parents would throw you out?

Perhaps I'm just an over-empathetic person, but I cannot imagine ever throwing my own child out of my house, let alone doing so because they were gay. But then, I've never seen how being gay is harmful (and if I can't see that something is harmful I do not believe it could be "sinful") - and so I wouldn't have a problem what-so-ever if I had a gay child.

They twist the words around to fit their sexual desires.

Or maybe they just interpret some verses in the Bible differently than you do. I find it very insulting for anyone to say that their interpretation of a given verse of the Bible is the only correct one.

 

[angellica]

But it isn't a choice to be romantically attracted to someone of their own gender.

Can you imagine trying to remain celibate for life? Trying to quash every thought you had about another person being attractive - because you were told that finding that sort of person attractive is wrong? Having to watch everyone around you fall in love and pair off - knowing that if you did the same with anyone you loved you would be acting "sinfully" and your parents would throw you out?

Perhaps I'm just an over-empathetic person, but I cannot imagine ever throwing my own child out of my house, let alone doing so because they were gay. But then, I've never seen how being gay is harmful (and if I can't see that something is harmful I do not believe it could be "sinful") - and so I wouldn't have a problem what-so-ever if I had a gay child.

Or maybe they just interpret some verses in the Bible differently than you do. I find it very insulting for anyone to say that their interpretation of a given verse of the Bible is the only correct one.

Well, I have watched friends pair off for years now. I don't see the absolute necessity to marry anyway, so what is wrong with not acting on your lustful desires? Just resist the temptation. I know I'm oversimplifying it, but God can help you through it.

 

[WatersMoon110]

Well, I have watched friends pair off for years now. I don't see the absolute necessity to marry anyway, so what is wrong with not acting on your lustful desires? Just resist the temptation. I know I'm oversimplifying it, but God can help you through it.

From my perspective, trying to repress one's natural romantic desires is incredibly mentally unhealthy. Particularly if one believes that one's desires are sinful - I think that this is something that would harm many people if they attempted to do so. It isn't surprising to me, that so many people trying to stop being gay end up in therapy.

But I guess we just have a different opinion on which is worse to do - be gay or trying to stop being gay.

I am desperately in love with my husband. He is the light of my life, my best friend, and my perfect compliment. He is my better half. I cannot imagine how I would feel if I was constantly told by my family that it was "sinful" for me to love him, and that I should just try to stop any romantic feelings I retain for him.

I suppose I am looking at this more from a perspective of someone already in love though - rather than from someone being single and trying to remain celibate. Though, for males especially, touching yourself is sort of important (for prostate health and mental health). So that could become a problem, I suppose.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

Wow? Yours too? I showed "girly" tendencies when I was little and my father made sure to shame me right into the closet. My father was also very abusive and the church rescued me from him and the abusive kids at school, in a way. So then the church shamed me into being closeted.

About 30 years later I was finally able to come to terms with myself and came out to my parents. My Mom loves me unconditionally and my father tried to kill me. Of course, I had a bit more to come out about than the average gay person. I came out as IS/TS and bisexual. The first thing my mother said when I came out to them there in their living room was "That explains a lot about your childhood."

Now, I find out that technically I am genetically intersexed with a very odd chromosome oddity, which was probably also responsible for giving me cardiomyopathy, a convex protruding breastbone and a deformed lower spine. My father still hates me.

Telling my father I did not believe in god was akin to saying I was a commy.

 

[angellica]

From my perspective, trying to repress one's natural romantic desires is incredibly mentally unhealthy. Particularly if one believes that one's desires are sinful - I think that this is something that would harm many people if they attempted to do so. It isn't surprising to me, that so many people trying to stop being gay end up in therapy.

But I guess we just have a different opinion on which is worse to do - be gay or trying to stop being gay.

I am desperately in love with my husband. He is the light of my life, my best friend, and my perfect compliment. He is my better half. I cannot imagine how I would feel if I was constantly told by my family that it was "sinful" for me to love him, and that I should just try to stop any romantic feelings I retain for him.

I suppose I am looking at this more from a perspective of someone already in love though - rather than from someone being single and trying to remain celibate. Though, for males especially, touching yourself is sort of important (for prostate health and mental health). So that could become a problem, I suppose.

It is easier, I suppose, if you recognized being gay as a sin beforehand and didn't give in to your sexual or romantic desires at all, rather than getting in a relationship and then trying to give it up.

 

[WatersMoon110]

It is easier, I suppose, if you recognized being gay as a sin beforehand and didn't give in to your sexual or romantic desires at all, rather than getting in a relationship and then trying to give it up.

I imagine it would be easier - though I still would recommend that gay people learn to love themselves for who they are; rather than attempt to repress their desires and their love.

I guess I can't understand how homosexuality/homosexual desires can be "sinful". I suppose it is being I've know many gay people and gay couples (even gay Christians), and all of them were happy with themselves, and their relationships were loving. If I cannot see how something is harmful, then I cannot consider it to be "sinful".

I suppose the main difference between the two of us is that when the Bible disagrees with my view of reality, I figure that it is the Bible that must be incorrect. I love and worship Jesus, the Christ - but I believe in my heart that the Bible is just a book written by men who wanted to know what God did or didn't want, but didn't know.

 

[angellica]

I imagine it would be easier - though I still would recommend that gay people learn to love themselves for who they are; rather than attempt to repress their desires and their love.

I guess I can't understand how homosexuality/homosexual desires can be "sinful". I suppose it is being I've know many gay people and gay couples (even gay Christians), and all of them were happy with themselves, and their relationships were loving. If I cannot see how something is harmful, then I cannot consider it to be "sinful".

I suppose the main difference between the two of us is that when the Bible disagrees with my view of reality, I figure that it is the Bible that must be incorrect. I love and worship Jesus, the Christ - but I believe in my heart that the Bible is just a book written by men who wanted to know what God did or didn't want, but didn't know.

I have never had a reason to think the Bible was incorrect. I would trust it over what the secular world wants it to mean.

 

[corvus_corax]

I would trust it over what the secular world wants it to mean.

More accurately, you trust your personal interpretation of the Bible over the personal interpretations of other Christians.

It is that simple.

 

[angellica]

More accurately, you trust your personal interpretation of the Bible over the personal interpretations of other Christians.

It is that simple.

No, I trust what the Bible says and what Christianity is over what the secular non-Christian world personally feels.

 

[angellica]

I imagine it would be easier - though I still would recommend that gay people learn to love themselves for who they are; rather than attempt to repress their desires and their love.

I guess I can't understand how homosexuality/homosexual desires can be "sinful". I suppose it is being I've know many gay people and gay couples (even gay Christians), and all of them were happy with themselves, and their relationships were loving. If I cannot see how something is harmful, then I cannot consider it to be "sinful".

I suppose the main difference between the two of us is that when the Bible disagrees with my view of reality, I figure that it is the Bible that must be incorrect. I love and worship Jesus, the Christ - but I believe in my heart that the Bible is just a book written by men who wanted to know what God did or didn't want, but didn't know.

Also, the Bible tells us that we have to be a part of the world but not OF the world. We are to reject their sinful lifestyles while not hating them as people. We shouldn't assume the Bible is incorrect when it disagrees with our view of reality.