WHAT IS THE REAL GOSPEL?

[Leaf473]

Thanks for sharing your view Leaf. Do you believe that the bible is the Word of God?

Yes, although the way I like to say it is that the Bible contains the word of God.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yes, although the way I like to say it is that the Bible contains the word of God.

So you do not believe all the bible is God's Word?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Salvation is from God and we need it because without it we die.

So, do we produce the fruit of that Salvation, or does God produce the fruit through us?

Hello Nathan, your question is answered in the very post you were quoting from. Did you read it?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Sorry, but SDA is like other denominations that have their 'own' beliefs, some which do not hold to Scripture. Put your trust in God and His Word, and not in man.

Really? And what would that be let's test your claims with scripture. I think John 3:19-21 is the applicable test here. Let's talk scripture.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Let's continue with the questions in the OP...

Q4. WHAT IS GOD'S GRACE FOR?

Grace is linked to mercy and peace from God the farther and from JESUS in love and truth.

2 JOHN 1:3
[3] Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.

ROMANS 1:5 [5], By whom we have received GRACE and apostleship, FOR OBEDIENCE TO THE FAITH among all nations, for his name.

We are to grow in God's GRACE and the KNOWLEDGE of our LORD JESUS CHRSIT.

2 PETER 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen. *2 PETER 1:2

We do this by seeking JESUS to be our teacher and continuing in God's WORD.

JOHN 14:26 [26], But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.

JOHN 8:31-36
[31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
[32], And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
[33], They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how say you, You shall be made free?
[34], Jesus answered them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Whoever commits sin is the servant of sin.
[35], And the servant stays not in the house for ever: but the Son stays ever.
[36], If the Son therefore shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.

TITUS 2:11-12 [11], FOR THE GRACE OF GOD HAS APPEARED BRINGING SALVATION TO ALL MEN, [12], TEACHING US, THAT, DENYING UNGODLINESS AND WORLDLY JUSTS, WE SHOULD LIVE SOBERLY, RIGHTOUESLY AND GODLY IN THIS PRESENT WORLD

ROMANS 6:1-2, [1] What shall we say then? SHALL WE SIN [break any one of God's 10 commandments], THAT GRACE MAY ABOUND? God forbid. [2], How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Romans 6:15-17 What then? SHALL WE SIN BECAUSE WE ARE NOT UNDER LAW BUT UNDER GRACE? GOD FORBID! [16] Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of SIN RESULTING IN DEATH, or of OBEDIENCE resulting in righteousness?

God's GRACE is given to us because all of us have sinned and are sinners (broken God's 10 Commandments) and the wages of SIN is death *ROMANS 3:23; ROMANS 5:12; ROMANS 6:23.

ROMANS 8:3-4 [3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTOUESNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.

...................

WORD MEANINGS OF GRACE

GRACE GREEK WORD
χάρις; charis khar'-ece From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy).

GRACE HEBREW WORD
חן; chên khane From H2603; graciousness, that is, subjectively kindness, favor or objectively (beauty): - favour, grace (-ious), pleasant, precious, [well-] favoured.

.....................

CONCLUSION: Grace is unmerited favour leading to a change of behaviour. God's GRACE IS FOR OBEDIENCE to GOD'S WORD in those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW it to save us from our sins and their penalty and sinful nature through our LORD JESUS CHRIST!

Hope this helps.

 

[Nathan@work]

CONCLUSION: Grace is unmerited favour leading to a change of behaviour. God's GRACE IS FOR OBEDIENCE to GOD'S WORD in those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW it to save us from our sins and their penalty and sinful nature through our LORD JESUS CHRIST!

Hope this helps.

God has saved us from our sins. It is not because we do anything, but because He has done everything.

Following does not save us, we follow because we are saved.

Grace allows us to focus on the Spirit, not the law - definitely not sin.

Before grace, man focuses on the law, which in turn always points to his sinful nature. Under grace, His forgiveness is our focus(Gospel) and it allows us to follow Him not based on our own determination of right and wrong.

 

[Davy]

Thanks Davy for sharing your view on false prophets and Christs but I think I will leave it as I think the scriptures already shared with you in post # 19 linked, post # 20 linked stand alone as a light to what is true and have already addressed your new posts here so I do not feel the need to respond to them. That does not mean I disagree with everything you have posted on the subject but on the whole I do not agree because of the scriptures, context and Greek applications I have shared with you already so we will agree to disagree.

Well, you can disagree all you want, but you really haven't addressed all the Scripture evidence I posted about a singular coming Antichrist for the end of this world.

 

[Danthemailman]

God has saved us from our sins. It is not because we do anything, but because He has done everything.

Following does not save us, we follow because we are saved.

Grace allows us to focus on the Spirit, not the law - definitely not sin.

Before grace, man focuses on the law, which in turn always points to his sinful nature. Under grace, His forgiveness is our focus(Gospel) and it allows us to follow Him not based on our own determination of right and wrong.

Yes, we follow Christ because we are saved and not in order to save ourselves based on performance/works. Following Christ is not forced or legalistic for those who are born of God. (1 John 3:7-10) Salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works is ANOTHER gospel. (Galatians 1:6-9)

 

[Davy]

Hi Davy, some comments below for your consideration.

Your response here...

Sorry Davy, I do not understand what your trying to say here. Can you expound on what your trying to say here so I do not have any misunderstandings? As far as I know I have only shared scripture here which is God's Word not mine from both the old and new testament which is God's Word not my words because He must increase and we must decrease.

Once again you will have to forgive me as I do not understand what your trying to say here in relation to what you are quoting from. Can you explain what you mean here a little further?


Actually, Davy the Hebrew word râtsach means both to kill a person or to murder a person. Here is the Hebrew if your interested..

Gesenius Hebrew And Chaldee Lexicon
H7523 - GES7475
רָצַח
(1) to break, or dash in pieces. (Arab. رضح and رضخ.) See Piel No. 1, and the noun רֵצַח.
(2) to kill, with an acc. Num 35:6, seqq.; more fully רָצַח פּ׳ נֶפֶשׁ Deut 22:26, compare הִכָּה פ׳ נֶפֶשׁ under the word הִכָּה No. 2, c.
Niphal, pass. of Kal No. 2, Judg 20:4.
Piel-
(1) to dash in pieces, Psa 62:4.
(2) i.q. Kal No. 2, but iteratively (like קַטֵּל), to kill many, to act the homicide, 2Kin 6:32, Isa 1:21, Hosea 6:9.

Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong
רָצַח (râtsach | H7523) meaning: properly, to dash in pieces, i.e. kill (a human being), especially to murder

Combined Word Definitions, BDB & Thayer
Original: רצח
Transliteration: Ratsach
Phonetic: raw-tsakh’
Definition:
1. to murder, slay, kill
a. (Qal) to murder, slay
1. premeditated
2. accidental
3. as avenger
4. slayer (intentional) (participle)
b. (Niphal) to be slain
c. (Piel)
1. to murder, assassinate
2. murderer, assassin (participle)(subst)
d. (Pual) to be killed
Origin: a primitive root
Part of speech: Verb

For me I believe the application is to murder and killing our fellow man.

Here I would disagree but let me explain why. According to the new testament scriptures God's ISRAEL are no longer those in the flesh but those in the Spirit who believe and follow God's Word. For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. - Romans 2:28-29.

Romans 9:6-8 [6], Not as though the word of God has taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: [7], Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall your seed be called. [8] That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

God's ISRAEL today according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow Gods' Word. All are one in Christ * Galatians 3:28-29. If we are not a part of Gods' ISRAEL then we have no part in God's new covenant promise *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Gentile believers are now grafted in with Jewish believers *Romans 11:13-27 and unbelieving Jews have been cut out.

God bless

No sense in arguing, but I will never agree with how you treat Scripture, which is per man's dogma.

Matt 19:17-18
17 And He said unto him, "Why callest thou Me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

18 He saith unto him, "Which?" Jesus said, "Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,"
KJV

Lord Jesus was plain enough that He was speaking of 'murder' in Exodus 20 and not just killing. Killing and murder are two different acts. Man doesn't murder chickens for food, unless of course you follow a man-made religion that is against eating meat, like some eastern religions.

 

[Davy]

Page 2 of this same thread, I said, "The SDA view of scripture is simply that scripture is the truth", and "Truth has no denomination"... which in a roundabout way would make SDA a church of truth, but since I did say truth has no denomination, I think it's clear that I am not claiming SDA as a one true church.

People of all denominations and no denomination at all will be saved, because of the truth. Truth isn't mutually exclusive, as per my quote.

But you sure spend time here to push SDA's views which are often different than written Scripture. You may want to hide that fact, but I won't. So are you sure you want to continue this?

 

[Leaf473]

So you do not believe all the bible is God's Word?

No.

Although, for particular definitions of "Bible" and "word of God", I would answer yes.

By Bible, are we referring to a particular set of books, and particular manuscripts of those books?

And by "word" in word of God, do we mean parts of speech that we use to build sentences?

In Luke, I think, it says that the word of God came to John the baptist. Did the entire book we call Matthew come to him, word for word? did he know those details of the story of his own imprisonment and death?

 

[Freth]

But you sure spend time here to push SDA's views which are often different than written Scripture. You may want to hide that fact, but I won't. So are you sure you want to continue this?

You're still missing the point.

Scripture is my primary concern, SDA or not (as I've said many times over). If you haven't noticed, I post scripture to back everything I say (for the most part). If you can refute scripture, you're more than welcome to do so. I'm not here to champion SDA causes, I'm here to champion truth in scripture, which is especially important in these end times. The Bible makes it clear, as per my many posts, that commandment keeping is required for the end time Christian, as is keeping the seventh day Sabbath.

As I've posted before... Revelation 14:6-12....

6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,​

Worship God as He declared from creation and on Mt. Sinai.

7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters [the seventh Day Sabbath, the Seal of God; Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Exodus 31:13].​

Babylon is false worship; the mark.

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.​

God's warning of unbridled wrath.

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.​

A reiteration of commandment keeping.

12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.​

The seventh day Sabbath is God's sign and Seal—the final test for Christianity in the last days. Revelation 14:6-12 is an urgent, sobering message to the world.

SDA is beside the point, it's written in black and white in the Bible. This is what we're called to and this is why I adamantly post about the Sabbath and why I adamantly post about commandment keeping.

 

[Davy]

You're still missing the point.

Scripture is my primary concern, SDA or not (as I've said many times over). If you haven't noticed, I post scripture to back everything I say (for the most part). If you can refute scripture, you're more than welcome to do so.

You see, right there is one of your problems. You 'claim' to follow Scripture, but then you turn away from the simplicity in those Scriptures I showed you, and instead slide into what SDA teaches instead. And above you claim Scripture is your primary concern, yet you make the false assumption that your view is irrefutable 'like' Scripture. Well friend, your view of Scripture is definitely not... irrefutable, as I have already shown with the Matthew 19 example of our Lord Jesus quoting about "murder" from the Old Testament.

And let me tell you, SDA's interpretation on that idea of killing being the same thing of murder, which is what your interpretation is, creates all sorts of inconsistencies with Scripture, because in Deuteronomy 20 God told the children of Israel when entering Canaan to literally wipe out (kill) the peoples of certain nations He named there, to leave alive nothing that breaths! So was that God telling them to 'murder', or was it how He passed judgment upon those specific nations for doing iniquity? (430 years before when He spoke to Abraham, He said the iniquity of the Amorites was not yet full - Genesis 15:16).

And what about police who defend others when they have to use deadly force against a criminal who intends to murder? Is that policeman a murderer because of using self-defense? To say he is, is exactly what Satan's servants want, so as to create chaos and mayhem.

 

[Freth]

You see, right there is one of your problems. You 'claim' to follow Scripture, but then you turn away from the simplicity in those Scriptures I showed you, and instead slide into what SDA teaches instead. And above you claim Scripture is your primary concern, yet you make the false assumption that your view is irrefutable 'like' Scripture. Well friend, your view of Scripture is definitely not... irrefutable, as I have already shown with the Matthew 19 example of our Lord Jesus quoting about "murder" from the Old Testament.

And let me tell you, SDA's interpretation on that idea of killing being the same thing of murder, which is what your interpretation is, creates all sorts of inconsistencies with Scripture, because in Deuteronomy 20 God told the children of Israel when entering Canaan to literally wipe out (kill) the peoples of certain nations He named there, to leave alive nothing that breaths! So was that God telling them to 'murder', or was it how He passed judgment upon those specific nations for doing iniquity? (430 years before when He spoke to Abraham, He said the iniquity of the Amorites was not yet full - Genesis 15:16).

And what about police who defend others when they have to use deadly force against a criminal who intends to murder? Is that policeman a murderer because of using self-defense? To say he is, is exactly what Satan's servants want, so as to create chaos and mayhem.

Kill vs Murder:

Old Testament - Exodus 20:18 Thou shalt not kill.

Strong's H7523
The KJV translates Strong's H7523 in the following manner: slayer (16x), murderer (14x), kill (5x), murder (3x), slain (3x), manslayer (2x), killing (1x), slayer (with H310) (1x), slayeth (1x), death (1x).

רָצַח râtsach, raw-tsakh'; a primitive root; properly, to dash in pieces, i.e. kill (a human being), especially to murder:—put to death, kill, (man-) slay(-er), murder(-er).

1. to murder, slay, kill
   1. (Qal) to murder, slay
      1. premeditated
      2. accidental
      3. as avenger
      4. slayer (intentional) (participle)
   2. (Niphal) to be slain
   3. (Piel)
      1. to murder, assassinate
      2. murderer, assassin (participle)(subst)
   4. (Pual) to be killed

---

New Testament: Matthew 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness.

Strong's G5407
The KJV translates Strong's G5407 in the following manner: kill (10x), do murder (1x), slay (1x).

φονεύω; future φονεύσω; 1 aorist ἐφόνευσα; (φονεύς); from (Pindar, Aeschylus), Herodotus down; the Sept. mostly for רָצֵח, also for הָרַג, הִכָּה, etc.; to kill, slay, murder; absolutely, to commit murder (A. V. kill): Matthew 5:21; James 4:2; οὐ (which see 6) φονεύσεις, Matthew 5:21; Matthew 19:18; Romans 13:9 (Exodus 20:15); μή φονεύσῃς, Mark 10:19; Luke 18:20; James 2:11. τινα: Matthew 23:31, 35; James 5:6.

1. to kill, slay, murder
2. to commit murder

---

Every SDA pastor I've ever heard in my lifetime calls it murder. Even the head of Amazing Facts (SDA evangelism), pastor Doug Batchelor, calls it murder. And yes, personally, I believe it to mean murder. I don't think we're in disagreement here.

 

[Nathan@work]

The seventh day Sabbath is God's sign and Seal—the final test for Christianity in the last days. Revelation 14:6-12 is an urgent, sobering message to the world.

SDA is beside the point, it's written in black and white in the Bible. This is what we're called to and this is why I adamantly post about the Sabbath and why I adamantly post about commandment keeping.

It is impossible for the Sabbath to be the sign and seal in Revelation.

The sign and seal in Revelation, for the faithful, is a mark placed on the person.

If the sign and seal was the Sabbath, that would mean the person is placing the mark on themselves.

[Rev 7:3 ESV] saying, "Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads."

 

[Freth]

You see, right there is one of your problems. You 'claim' to follow Scripture, but then you turn away from the simplicity in those Scriptures I showed you, and instead slide into what SDA teaches instead. And above you claim Scripture is your primary concern, yet you make the false assumption that your view is irrefutable 'like' Scripture.

Well, you can disagree all you want, but you really haven't addressed all the Scripture evidence I posted about a singular coming Antichrist for the end of this world.

I must have missed your post about a coming antichrist. Let's have a look.

Singular coming antichrist:

Jesus makes it clear, there will be many antichrists. There have been many throughout history, since Jesus spoke these words.

Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
​

Strictly speaking, the antichrist is any person who claims to be Christ or impersonates Christ. There is also an antichrist spirit.

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
​

If you're speaking of the book of Revelation, there are two beasts that will be in play in the last days.

The prophecies of Daniel and Revelation give us past, present and future events. It is because of history that...

• We can know what kingdoms the attributes of the image in Daniel 2 represent.
  
• We can know what kingdoms beasts of Daniel 7 represent.
  
• We can know what kingdoms beasts of Daniel 8 represent.
  
• We can know what civil-religious power the little horn represents.
• We can know where we are in the prophetic timeline.
• We can know that the above points forward.
• We can know the identities of the beast of the sea and the beast of the earth.

In play during the last days will be the counterfeit trinity...

• The beast of the sea ("the beast") is given its power by the dragon (Revelation 13:1-2).
• The beast of the earth ("the false prophet") will cause all of the earth to worship the beast of the sea (Revelation 13:11-12).
• Satan ("the dragon" will most likely impersonate Christ on earth, as everything he does is a cheap counterfeit of God (2 Corinthians 11:14, Revelation 20:10).

False worship will eventually be enforced, which is why it's important to recognize the ground-work Satan has been laying to bring it to fruition.

This is a heavy subject, which requires much more space (and a different thread), to tie everything together. From the mark of the beast to the Sabbath being the Seal of God, all of it is connected in scripture; thus the picture is much bigger than "the antichrist".

I will attempt to look back through the thread and find the post you're referencing. I will respond to it when I find it.

 

[Freth]

It is impossible for the Sabbath to be the sign and seal in Revelation.

The sign and seal in Revelation, for the faithful, is a mark placed on the person.

If the sign and seal was the Sabbath, that would mean the person is placing the mark on themselves.

[Rev 7:3 ESV] saying, "Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads."

Exodus 31:13 calls the Sabbath God's sign. The word sign in this verse is Strong's H226.

The KJV translates Strong's H226 in the following manner: sign(s) (60x), token(s) (14x), ensign(s) (2x), miracles (2x), mark (1x).

אוֹת ʼôwth, oth; probably from H225 (in the sense of appearing); a signal (literally or figuratively), as a flag, beacon, monument, omen, prodigy, evidence, etc.:—mark, miracle, (en-) sign, token.

1. sign, signal
   1. a distinguishing mark
   2. banner
   3. remembrance
   4. miraculous sign
   5. omen
   6. warning
2. token, ensign, standard, miracle, proof

The central issue that decides whether you receive the mark of the beast or the Seal of God is worship. We can see this repeatedly in Revelation.

Knowing this, detail is important. Are we worshiping God as He specified? This is the key issue of the end time that determines whether we receive the mark of the beast or the Seal of God.

Notice that the mark of the beast can be received in the forehead or in the hand.

• Worship by choice (conscientious thought).
• Worship by action (going along with it, even if you don't believe it).

By contrast, the Seal of God can only be received in the forehead.

• Worship by choice (conscientious thought).
• Notice that you can't "go along" with Christianity. Scripture makes that clear.
  • Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
    
  • Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
  • John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
    
  • Revelation 3:15-16 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
  • Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

And you can't separate the Sabbath from the end time, nor the new heaven and new earth. Notice: Not "rest in Jesus", not Sunday, but God's seventh day Sabbath.

• Matthew 24:20-21 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
• Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

It makes no sense that, if the Sabbath is still a binding commandment during the great tribulation and if the Sabbath is observed in the afterlife, that somehow the Sabbath is irrelevant in-between. Jesus made it a point to mention the Sabbath and link His Seal (God, the creator, who made the heaven and the earth) in the verses of Revelation 14:7, Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11. It is quite deliberate that the same phrase shows up in all of these verses, pointing to creation; it's giving emphasis to the Sabbath.

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
​

Just what is the broad way and what is the narrow way? Is it a worship issue as Revelation says? I think so. Just what worship issue is narrow? Could it be the Sabbath? Could Sunday be the broad way that Jesus was speaking of?

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High [Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus], and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.​

 

[LoveGodsWord]

No sense in arguing, but I will never agree with how you treat Scripture, which is per man's dogma.

Matt 19:17-18
17 And He said unto him, "Why callest thou Me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

18 He saith unto him, "Which?" Jesus said, "Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,"
KJV

Lord Jesus was plain enough that He was speaking of 'murder' in Exodus 20 and not just killing. Killing and murder are two different acts. Man doesn't murder chickens for food, unless of course you follow a man-made religion that is against eating meat, like some eastern religions.

Hello Davey, I am not sure why you think I am arguing with you here. My last post (post # 157) only shows that Exodus 20:13 in the Hebrew word for kill/murder between the translations can be translated as kill or murder because the Hebrew word means both kill and murdering people. Killing with intent is murder which I believe is the meaning of the scripture here.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yes, we follow Christ because we are saved and not in order to save ourselves based on performance/works. Following Christ is not forced or legalistic for those who are born of God. (1 John 3:7-10) Salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works is ANOTHER gospel. (Galatians 1:6-9)

Let's get things straight here. No one is teaching that we are saved by faith and works of the law. According to the scriptures we are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast *Ephesians 2:8-9 but Gods grace is so we can be obedient to the faith *Romans 1:5. Obedience to God's Law is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of faith of the one that is already been given Gods promise of salvation and the fruit of God's work in us *Philippians 2:13 as we believe and follow his word *John 10:26-27. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50; Hebrews 10:26-27. Therefore we do not abolish God's law through faith like some people teach but God's law is established in the heart by faith that works by love *Romans 3:31; 1 John 5:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures, sin (breaking God' commandments and not believing and following God's Word) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14.

Hope this is helpful

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Well, you can disagree all you want, but you really haven't addressed all the Scripture evidence I posted about a singular coming Antichrist for the end of this world.

Sorry Davey, I respectfully disagree as you have been provided both scripture, context, and the Greek word applications showing why Antichrists are plural application in post # 19 linked, post # 20 linked which stand alone as a light to what is true and what is not true so we will agree to disagree as you have not addressed these post but simply repeated what you said the first time in your earlier claims.