What is biblical truth when there is no consensus?

[Saint Steven]

By definition, Tares only pretend to be Christians so they might undermine Christianity. They are wolves in sheep's clothing.
It is often hard to tell the difference between them and real Christians who "just have not gotten the memo, yet."

That's interesting. I hadn't given much thought to the malicious aspect of the tares. He you seen these folks in the church? If so, how do they work? Is there an agenda?

 

[Sabertooth]

He you seen these folks in the church? If so, how do they work? Is there an agenda?

We cannot always be sure, but there is no point in getting paranoid about them. Jesus just gave us a heads-up that they would successfully infiltrate the physical places of our churches (in the Last Days).

Their agenda is to either encourage apostasy or, at least, retard the process of sanctification as they are able; to take people's eyes off of Jesus; to water down the Gospel & Redemption; to indirectly quench the Holy Spirit, if possible.

Satan has already lost the war, but he still can win subsequent battles & do varied amounts of collateral damage before that happens.

 

[Aaron112]

What is biblical truth when there is no consensus?

Truth has not changed. God made all things simple. Man came up with many devices/deceptions.

For a time, whether months or years, I could not see anyone truthfully trustworthy, not even
to dare to trust them. This included all known priests, pastors, teachers, religious schools or groups, churches and so on.

I was not anyone in particular in man's eyes (except in some ways not to disclose yet - things that were good in man's view; even highly respected and/or esteemed). Yet now I counted everything as nought.

I prayed fervently and desperately that 'God, I think you're there - if you want me to know YOU, YOU will have to show me. There's no one I can find to believe; no one telling the truth, or trustworthy' .....



.... .... .... ....

 

[Carl Emerson]

That's interesting. I hadn't given much thought to the malicious aspect of the tares. He you seen these folks in the church? If so, how do they work? Is there an agenda?

Judas was a tare...

That might give some insight into what their agenda might be.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Steve,

The elect are in truth together otherwise they would be in deception and this wont happen according to Scripture.

But actually 'consensus' is the wrong word - the critical word is unity.

Consensus just indicates a common understanding of others beliefs in peace, and is not unity or unanimity.

My experience has been that there is a unity in the Spirit with a variety of believers from different denominations and groups. Being in Truth is an individual thing, not a gathering at this stage.

With persecution to come the face of the church will change and may go underground. Then the elect will be gathered.

It is up to each believer to maintain unity with other believers whether in the fellowships that gather today or not. If your fellowship is not in unity, that does not mean you don't need to be.

I have a small group of believers I trust and seek out when times get tough and most are not in my church.

This does not mean I am not in submission in the church I attend.

 

[Jerry N.]

Steve,

The elect are in truth together otherwise they would be in deception and this wont happen according to Scripture.

But actually 'consensus' is the wrong word - the critical word is unity.

Consensus just indicates a common understanding of others beliefs in peace, and is not unity or unanimity.

My experience has been that there is a unity in the Spirit with a variety of believers from different denominations and groups. Being in Truth is an individual thing, not a gathering at this stage.

With persecution to come the face of the church will change and may go underground. Then the elect will be gathered.

It is up to each believer to maintain unity with other believers whether in the fellowships that gather today or not. If your fellowship is not in unity, that does not mean you don't need to be.

I have a small group of believers I trust and seek out when times get tough and most are not in my church.

This does not mean I am not in submission in the church I attend.

I have had the pleasure of being able to intensely study the Bible under great teachers and on my own. I used to think that the knowledge was infinite and it would improve me accordingly. However, I find it no easier to live my life according to the simple facts of the Bible that 99% of Christians agree. The parts that lack consensus among Christians have become less important but remain interesting.

 

[jonojim1337]

Some present their views as if they themselves are an authority on biblical interpretation.

Worst case, they attempt to end the discussion by claiming your argument is not with them.
Basically, playing the "God card".

Do we leave no room for the interpretations brought by others? Showing intolerance.

What is biblical truth when there is no consensus?

Well, I don't have any Coins, to give to Kaiser, who's been hiding, since he lost the war. Guess that means, I'll just be rolling my thumbs, until he comes, and Christ leads me to a fish, with a coin in it? Lmao.

 

[Clare73]

Thanks for your reply.

Your post made me ask myself...
Does truth come from what we agree on, or when it works in peoples lives?

Neither. . .

It comes from Scripture understood in the light of all Scripture.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Neither. . .

It comes from Scripture understood in the light of all Scripture.

With the help of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

Some present their views as if they themselves are an authority on biblical interpretation.

Worst case, they attempt to end the discussion by claiming your argument is not with them.
Basically, playing the "God card".

Do we leave no room for the interpretations brought by others? Showing intolerance.

What is biblical truth when there is no consensus?

I think the problem with lack of consensus is because God is infinite and we are finite. This sets up a problem for us because when talking about God we can only think and talk in finite terms our minds cannot comprehend infinite and that’s all we have to work with. This doesn’t bother me that much because I am in the Christian Universal Redemption camp and I know that in the end God will be all in all and we are still in that process, I don’t believe creation is not done till God is all in all and we are all on the New Heaven and Earth, then creation will be done, till then we are in the process of God refining all of us till his end is complete. That is why God , when he gave us scripture didn’t worry about boiling everything down so that every word was so precise that there would be no chance of misunderstanding or errors. For example when God says things like “ abomination of desecration “ he has left that up to us to figure it out and that’s why there is little consensus because we are all trying to figure things out but much of the time we don’t know what God meant till we look back and see and we say things like “ that’s what God was meaning “ again we are finite and we have limits.

 

[ARBITER01]

Neither. . .

It comes from Scripture understood in the light of all Scripture.

If I may elaborate,..... Truth comes from what The Holy Spirit reveals to us. Only GOD is true, and only He knows all the understandings of His word.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I think the problem with lack of consensus is because God is infinite and we are finite. This sets up a problem for us because when talking about God we can only think and talk in finite terms our minds cannot comprehend infinite and that’s all we have to work with. This doesn’t bother me that much because I am in the Christian Universal Redemption camp and I know that in the end God will be all in all and we are still in that process, I don’t believe creation is not done till God is all in all and we are all on the New Heaven and Earth, then creation will be done, till then we are in the process of God refining all of us till his end is complete. That is why God , when he gave us scripture didn’t worry about boiling everything down so that every word was so precise that there would be no chance of misunderstanding or errors. For example when God says things like “ abomination of desecration “ he has left that up to us to figure it out and that’s why there is little consensus because we are all trying to figure things out but much of the time we don’t know what God meant till we look back and see and we say things like “ that’s what God was meaning “ again we are finite and we have limits.

Sounds like your position implies that we cant really know anything perfectly but remain subject to relative truth.

Scripture does not support this position because we read that "you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free..."

The anointing within bears witness to the Truth by the gift of revelation.

 

[Clare73]

If I may elaborate,..... Truth comes from what The Holy Spirit reveals to us. Only GOD is true, and only He knows all the understandings of His word.

And the first test of whether our revelation is from the Holy Spirit is that revelation's agreement with the NT understood in the light of all Scripture.

 

[Jipsah]

The Bible does and will interpret itself …on the things that God wants to reveal to us…. which is most everything.

And amazingly enough, the Bible almost always interprets itself to agree with my doctrine. Amazing, innit?

God never asks us to interpret the Word …just rightly divide it…..which to me…. is seeing how it fits in the verse, context, and throughout the entire Bible w/o contradiction.

And of course, I "rightly divide", but those who disagree with me "interpret".

 

[Jipsah]

The indwelling Holy Spirit knows the correct Biblical truth, we should get from the passage, you cannot expect the Spirit to help you if you're trying to sell more commentaries, have more invitations to speak, are trying to win an argument, just to know something or make yourself look good.

So those who disagree with me are just those last 4 kinds of folks. I've always suspected that.

 

[Jipsah]

"Tolerance" is not a Biblical virtue.

So I needn't tolerate those who hold false beliefs, I.e., those who disagree with me.

 

[Jerry N.]

Outside of belief in the death and resurrection of Christ and salvation by grace, I suspect that we all believe things from the Bible that we misunderstand or are based on false doctrine. One only has to study the various disagreements in the history of Christianity to see it is not easy to get things right. However, faith and grace covers all, and we strive to improve. God knows the heart.

 

[Jipsah]

Well, I think people understand that the authors of scripture did not leave them open for any interpretation,

"Take, eat, this is My Body..."

 

[ARBITER01]

And the first test of whether our revelation is from the Holy Spirit is that revelation's agreement with the NT understood in the light of all Scripture.

So,.... you place your bible in between GOD and you and force Him to speak through it?

I don't think you really do.

The Holy Spirit is involved in every aspect of our lives, so revelation can certainly be outside of scripture. We are to be guided by Him, not our bibles.

 

[Jonaitis]

"Take, eat, this is My Body..."

Explain.