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Featured What is a born again christian and can I be one?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Chgz, Mar 9, 2016.

  1. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    No. God's Word tells us that we are to be like the Bereans who after they heard the word of God preached on the pulpit, went back and check in the BIble if these things were true. They were highly commended for this practice.
     
  2. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    This is a misunderstanding of what the Bereans did and who they were:

    Not By Scripture Alone

    Furthermore, the Bereans were not checking the Scriptures to argue with the Apostles as Protestants constantly do among themselves. They didn't read the Scriptures and come up with novel ideas and then go establish their own "church" in opposition to the teaching of the Apostles.

    And you still have the problem of the fact that thousands and thousands of Protestants pride themselves on being "Bible only" and yet do not agree with each other on doctrines. There is no unity in Protestantism.
     
  3. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Where is the scripture to support this opinion. That the Berean's did not search scripture to see if what they were being told was in the Bible?

    Where are you getting this Bereans did not read scripture to start their own church? No one said that.

    There is unity in Protestism and Christianity on most key doctrine. With 6 Billion Christians, I think you are making a mountain out of something.
     
  4. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Unity in Protestantism? I almost spit my coffee all over my monitor. I've seen two Baptists going at it tooth and nail and condemning each other to hell over a minor point of doctrine. If there is unity, why are there so many churches and so many different doctrines? Why not one church called "We aren't the Catholic Church" and settle it once and for all, based on Scripture. Surely you can agree on a unified church using Scripture, right?

    Or maybe not. Lutherans think that infant baptism is fine. Baptists submitted to being drowned rather than compromise on that issue. Episcopalians are sacramental and liturgical. Try running that form of worship around a Pentecostal.

    Are you getting the picture? There is no unity in the non-Catholic forms of Christianity.
     
  5. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    So you think imperfect people are going to be perfect? You think people with free-will are always going to agree?

    Come on now ;)

    Also, why are you so concerned? Isn't God the only just and righteous judge because only God knows both the heart and actions of man?

    Interesting how much everyone focuses on everyone's spirituality except their own. Gives people something to do so they can avoid looking closely at self. We all do it to some degree.
     
  6. Truly1999

    Truly1999 Newbie

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    Hi, it's great that you're asking this. As a new member you were probably uncertain which forum to post this in - it can be frustrating at times. But in posting in this forum, you will get many replies based on lengthy theological points, when what is needed is a response from the heart and not the head, mainly from members' personal experiences and not so much from the Gospel According to John.

    The Good News I wish to pass onto you is that God speaks to individuals who reach out to their Father in Heaven, as an infant who reaches his arms up to his earthly parent wanting to be picked up and held and comforted.

    Being born again requires us to want to change, to want a new life because we realise that our current life is a total mess and that we cannot do anything by ourselves to have a better life.

    Who knows how these things are supposed to work? There isn't necessarily a sequence of events that is followed everytime in a set order.

    I was born again when I was 15. The only preaching of the gospel I encountered was when I was about 10 and Gideons visited my school and handed out a free pocket New Testament to each of us, back in 1980. I read it, believed and prayed the Sinner's Prayer at the back. Before this point I had been living a terrible life because of things done to me, things I had done and the secrets I kept and so I was open to the gospel.

    I felt a change in myself and started to feel positive about myself. However, I didn't know what to do after that. My parents weren't Church goers and there was no further contact with the Gideons. The opportunity to be born again was lost. Simply believing in Jesus is not enough - even the Devil believes Jesus is the Son of God. I should have given my life to Jesus through Total Immersion Baptism. The problem was that the Church in England at that time generally didn't believe that children could be born again. I don't know if Gideons believed this too or if they were prevented by the schools to follow up on their one-and-only visit.

    But God didn't wait for the Church in England to wake up to the fact that children could have a personal relationship with Jesus independent of their parents. In my hour of need, age 15 in 1985, God reached down and sent an angel who scooped me up in his arms - literally. I felt the angel's arms around me and he comforted me. He stopped my crying by filling me with an overwhelming peace. In a light from Heaven, the angel spoke to me in a soft voice - he told me to follow Jesus.

    Revival came to my local Church of England Church. Already, when I arrived that Sunday morning, Jesus had been at work, reviving individual disciples there. I arrived unannounced - invited by God and welcomed by the person on the door. But it was an 'ordinary' Holy Communion Service, not a Seeker Service or an Evangelism meeting. All eyes were on me - the church wasn't used to strangers just turning up, especially not unaccompanied children. I sat down in a pew at the back, without fuss. The church building was familiar to me since my junior school attended Harvest Festival and Christmas services. Each of us were given an Order of Service book and in recent years Holy Communion Service in the Church of England had been simplified which meant anyone could follow it, even a new person.

    I followed the service in the book, sang the Nicene Creed to God for the first time and sang hymns and songs. I went to accept the blessing from the priest at the altar. At this point I felt a weight being lifted off my shoulders and wept as I felt transformed. I had accepted Jesus as my Lord and Saviour, and made a public declaration through the service and when the priest laid his hand on my head, he confirmed my faith, allowing for the Holy Spirit to enter me. I had been born again. But the Church wanted the Bishop to confirm my faith.

    It wasn't until 8 years later that I was baptised through Total Immersion. But it didn't happen in any orderly manner. And I was born again long before I was baptised as an adult.

    At 15, I knew I was a Born-Again Christian and I knew that, except for one or two people there, the church members were not Born-Again. However, through the South Yorkshire Crusade Choir, I was able to meet a few Born-Again Christians.

    But not everyone who claims to be Born-Again is Born-Again and - despite what Pentecostal Christians say - speaking in tongues is not necessary to be Born Again. I have never spoken in tongues and it's not something I desperately seek and I don't feel terrible for not being able to speak in tongues.

    I hope this helps you a little.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2016
  7. ScottA

    ScottA Author: Walking Like Einstein Supporter

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    You should read Jesus' explanation: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+3&version=NKJV

    To be born "again", means, in addition to being born of the flesh, to also be born of the spirit of God. This is how one receives eternal life and lives forever. Otherwise when our body dies, it's over. Both lives are a gift, but life in the flesh is short lived.

    To be born again, ask: Ask God (in the name of Jesus, to whom He has given the power of eternal life) to send His Holy Spirit, that you may be born again of Him and live forever.

    God bless!
     
  8. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Of course people are not perfect. That's why we were given the Church to be the "pillar and ground of truth." (I Tim. 3:15). The problem, which you still cannot see and refused to acknowledge, is that people read the Bible without knowledge of the original Greek, without knowing principles of the Covenant of God, and with the idea (prideful) that the Holy Spirit speaks especially to them instead of through the Church. When they find something that they can't understand, instead of trusting in the Church to speak the truth, they decide the Church is wrong and go off and start their own congregation.

    Why am I so concerned? Because the division in Christianity weakens the testimony of Christ and presents untruth to people. Jesus said that if the Church was all one, it would be a testimony that the Father had sent Him. So what does this disunity say?
     
  9. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Well, what they should be doing is double-checking that everything they are taught is true, per God's Word, as the Berean's did.

    It is indeed sad that people do not know the Bible, nor do they read it. I agree.

    However, I do not agree that people should trust the church to speak the truth. You yourself said different churches teach different things, so one has to check.

    Also, not that it is my business, but as a Catholic don't you follow tradition after tradition of men and think the Pope get's revelation from Christ Himself?
     
  10. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    No. That is not correct at all.

    The pope does not get revelation from Christ Himself and you will find no such teaching the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

    There is only one Church. There are many denominations, but there is only one Church. The Church is the congregation of God. It has specific leadership which was first given to the Apostles by Christ Himself. That leadership has been passed down through the centuries by the laying on of hands, which was spoken of by Paul when he wrote to Timothy.

    The Church has always determined the mind of God and the truth of the Scriptures by meeting in council. This began in Acts 15 when the first ever Church council met in Jerusalem to address the issue of whether or not Gentiles coming into the Church had to be circumcised. Later councils determined the books which compose the canon of Scripture and also defended the deity of Christ against the heretic, Arias. No one man determines "truth" in the Church. Truth always comes as the Holy Spirit speaks to the Church as a unified body.

    The "traditions of men" have no place in the Church. Holy Tradition, however, is that which the Church has always believed. It was Holy Tradition which the Church referred to at the Council of Nicea when the heretic Arias was denying the divinity of Christ and using "sola scriptura" to do so. The Church also referred to Scripture, but showed that the Holy Tradition of the past three centuries was that all Christians from the beginning believed and taught the Jesus was God in the flesh. There was no tradition of men believing otherwise until Arias came along and began to teach that heresy. That is what is meant by Tradition.

    In the same manner, it has been the Holy Tradition of the Church since the beginning to understand that the Eucharist is the very Body and Blood of our Lord, despite any sophistries and intellectual disputations from Scripture of those who do not accept this. 2,000 years of belief trumps any new ideas which Eucharist deniers can bring forth. That is Tradition.
     
  11. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Ok. That's why I asked.
     
  12. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Repartee Animal: Quipping the Saints! Supporter

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  13. alexsonofmatthew

    alexsonofmatthew Active Member

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    All Christians are born again at their baptism
     
  14. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Will you please address post 63

    I have been waiting to hear your response. Thanks
     
  15. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    Jesus says that being born again is to be born of water and the Spirit. Not "in addition to being born of the flesh, to also be born of the spirit of God" Jesus doesn't say this, He says that the new birth is of "water and the Spirit". Nowhere does Jesus talk about natural birth in John 3 in reference to the new birth.

    "Born of water and the Spirit" is a single birth, not two separate births.

    So the appropriate thing we should ask is what does "born of water and the Spirit" refer to? The entire Christian Church, from the very beginning until the present has agreed as to what Jesus is talking about here, perhaps we'd do well not to ignore the unanimous position that every Christian had on this subject until the last couple hundred years in favor of merely our own private opinions.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  16. ScottA

    ScottA Author: Walking Like Einstein Supporter

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    You lost something translation. Born "again"...does not mean being born just once...but "again."
     
  17. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    I'm fully aware, and being born again is "born of water and the Spirit". Jesus isn't telling Nicodemus how to exit his mother's womb, but what new birth is. This new birth is "of water and the Spirit".

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  18. AlexDTX

    AlexDTX Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Unity of the Church has never been in opinion. It is by the Spirit. But to borrow the old analogy of 5 blind men touch different parts of the elephant, no one person or group has the whole truth of God, yet all may speak a part of the truth from their limited perspective.

    On the other hand I am in agreement that most of the schisms in the body of Christ are based in opinions that often have personal motives and agendas. And ironically these schisms are created by people who claim to have the whole truth and no one else does.

    Post Script
    Discipleship to maturation has its seasons. I think the variety of denominations are used by God for each season of their Christian journey. Does that mean everyone goes through each denomination? Of course not. But they all offer something that meets the needs of different people as they go through their seasons of maturation.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2016
  19. AlexDTX

    AlexDTX Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I think water refers to the physical world, not water baptism, and the Spirit is the transformation of our created spirits joined to the eternal Spirit. The world was created by water (Gen. 1:2) and babies are born after a mother's water breaks.
     
  20. ScottA

    ScottA Author: Walking Like Einstein Supporter

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    Again...you have misunderstood. He did not say that being born again was of both water and spirit, but that one must [also] be born of the Spirit. "And" refers to being born a second time [again]..."born of the Spirit":

    5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
     
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