What Does the Christian Community say about Near Death Experiences?

[Albion]

I don't see that translation to another place on earth that Phillip experienced really an NDE experience.

But the one Paul spoke of in 2 Corinthians 12, I do. The difference is that Phillip's flesh while alive was 'caught up' and simply moved to another location on earth. But with the one in 2 Cor.12, his spirit was 'caught up' while his flesh was still alive, similar to the experience Clint Walker had.

You cannot very well have a Near Death Experience if there's no apparent physical death. And even if that were present, it wouldn't be an NDE if, while "dead," the person didn't experience anything that can't be explained away.

 

[Albion]

Here's a few:
-a blind girl since birth reported that one of the drs didn't have covers on his shoes and though unconscious reported what went on including which dr used bad language

She wasn't declared or thought to be dead, then? If that is the case, it cannot be an NDE. In addition, there ARE possible explanations for her revelations. She might, for instance, have heard that doctor's steps and, recognizing them as not being muffled, decided that he wasn't wearing the covers as expected.

 

[CMDRExorcist]

Personally, I believe that NDEs are a real thing, but just like an encounter with God, much of what happens post-NDE is up to the individual. They can have a significant positive, negative, or neutral effect on a person's life. I read some books about NDEs a few years ago and was drawn to one story about a guy named Howard Storm, who was a devout atheist who had an NDE. His experience and subsequent side-effects led him into ministry. I was surprised to learn that he was preaching at a church just about an hour from where I lived at the time, so my family and I traveled to his church where we got to hear him speak in person and have lunch with the man. Very down to earth and humble man who obviously loved God and was someone you could tell had obtained some unique insights into how the world worked.

Christians disagree on just about everything, so I don't expect NDEs to be any different. I just know that I don't see anything in scripture that would disprove the existence of such events. Instead, it always brings me back to 1 John 4:1-3 where we're encouraged to test the spirits. Where does the NDE lead you? Because the NDE itself is just that...an event. But what is the message behind it? If it's pulling you from God, then it's not of God and should be resisted at all costs. If it brings you closer to Jesus, then it should be embraced as an opportunity to spread the Gospel and to grow into a deeper connection with Chrirst.

 

[Der Alte]

I first heard about NDE in 1970 before going to Viet Nam on my second tour. An officer claimed that he had a NDE in an operating room in Vietnam after being wounded. I was very skeptical for 39 years.
In 2009 I had surgery for a simple hernia repair. What was supposed to be a 45 minute laparoscopic procedure went wrong. It turned into a 5 hour open surgery during which I had acute kidney failure, afibrillation, ileus [bowel blockage] and sepsis, [major bacterial infection] in the abdominal cavity. Partly due to that I am now 100% disabled.
I seemed to be alright after surgery. Sometime after I returned to my room I had extreme difficulty breathing. I couldn’t reach the call button, between gasps for air I told my roommate to call the nurse. The nurse called respiratory techs. They told me to take deep breaths. Suddenly I was no longer distressed but I was somewhere above looking down on them apparently doing CPR and telling me “Breathe. You have to breathe.” Just as suddenly I was back on the bed struggling to breathe. I no longer have blanket skepticism for NDE.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

NDE's are from people who have been revived from clinical death. That is not the same thing as the departure of the spirit from the body.

 

[Albion]

NDE's are from people who have been revived from clinical death.

Yes.

That is not the same thing as the departure of the spirit from the body.

But if the person, upon being revived, reports having been in the place of events that occurred elsewhere than where his body was located, is that not "out of body?"

 

[TJB]

I really don’t know the answer even though I call myself a Christian. I get the feeling that all of these NDE reports I’ve recently discovered won’t be well received here, falling somewhere under the false prophet category. And I’ll admit that, under my current little crisis of faith, I’m vulnerable to grabbing at anything that will work for me

I think the long-held idea of the Beatific Vision here might be helpful. The immediate knowledge of God which angels and the souls of the just enjoy in Heaven. I think owing a lot to Aquinas - in beholding God face to face the created intelligence finds perfect happiness

It maybe that NDE, which seems to be a phenomenon that is being reported more and studies to are connected to this somehow, the light at the end of the tunnel etc....

 

[The Liturgist]

Fr. Seraphim Rose wrote about NDEs in Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future and The Soul After Death. More substantially on the latter, but these are both excellent books by a man who had been a homosexual in San Francisco’s notorious North Beach in the 1960s, before having a conversion experience, upon which he joined the Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia* and founded a monastery near Mount Shasta which is particularly devoid of modern conveniences. He also wrote a brilliant book on the evils of Nihilism, and converted many people, before reposing in the Lord following a battle with cancer in 1980.

His view of the modern popular obsession with and interpretation of NDEs was that they were demonic doctrines “received” if you will by 19th century Spiritualists, in the course of occult activity.

*This represented the most traditional and anti-Communist remnant of the Russian Orthodox Church in the US

 

[The Liturgist]

Yes.


But if the person, upon being revived, reports having been in the place of events that occurred elsewhere than where his body was located, is that not "out of body?"

Fr. Seraphim Rose thought so.

 

[TJB]

I first heard about NDE in 1970 before going to Viet Nam on my second tour. An officer claimed that he had a NDE in an operating room in Vietnam after being wounded. I was very skeptical for 39 years.
In 2009 I had surgery for a simple hernia repair. What was supposed to be a 45 minute laparoscopic procedure went wrong. It turned into a 5 hour open surgery during which I had acute kidney failure, afibrillation, ileus [bowel blockage] and sepsis, [major bacterial infection] in the abdominal cavity. Partly due to that I am now 100% disabled.
I seemed to be alright after surgery. Sometime after I returned to my room I had extreme difficulty breathing. I couldn’t reach the call button, between gasps for air I told my roommate to call the nurse. The nurse called respiratory techs. They told me to take deep breaths. Suddenly I was no longer distressed but I was somewhere above looking down on them apparently doing CPR and telling me “Breathe. You have to breathe.” Just as suddenly I was back on the bed struggling to breathe. I no longer have blanket skepticism for NDE.

Thanks for sharing that - sorry to hear about the struggle

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

But if the person, upon being revived, reports having been in the place of events that occurred elsewhere than where his body was located, is that not "out of body?"

That would imply that God was somehow mistaken in believing that it was the person's time to die, but was overruled by something else which decreed otherwise...

...people report such thing in ordinary dreams too.

 

[Cis.jd]

I really don’t know the answer even though I call myself a Christian. I get the feeling that all of these NDE reports I’ve recently discovered won’t be well received here, falling somewhere under the false prophet category. And I’ll admit that, under my current little crisis of faith, I’m vulnerable to grabbing at anything that will work for me. But I’m finding some hope in these. And there doesn’t seem to be much scientific explanation to dispute the claims, so much so that Doctors and Scientists are actually looking into the phenomenon in search of an answer. There are consistent similarities – about 5 or 6 bullet points- throughout several accounts over a long period of time spanning geography and spiritual beliefs. The stories and bullet points may not dot all of the I’s and cross all the t’s of scripture, but to me, the stories seem to convey the essence of what we believe and hope for in an afterlife. Which, one could say is the perfect formula for scammers to target someone like, well, me, who’s vulnerable and reaching for answers. And while the consistencies/bullet points serve to validate, they also provide a blueprint for scammers. So, no doubt, there has to be at least some stories out there that are completely made up. But again, there are so many accounts that even the skepticism of science is taking notice. So, what’s the consensus here? Legit or are we calling shenanigans?

There is no scientific explanation or religious explanation. Some people are just lucky to escape death. It's a random chance to maybe some factors such as diet, domino effect, or whatever.. the fact is, they almost died and they just got lucky they did not.

 

[BobRyan]

I really don’t know the answer even though I call myself a Christian. I get the feeling that all of these NDE reports I’ve recently discovered won’t be well received here,

No matter how one says he/she got their info from God (near death or not) the test is always the same according to 1 John 4.

1 John 4
Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, 3 and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Gal 1:6-9
8 But even if we (Apostles), or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

No matter "how" the person claims to have been given the information - the Bible says to "test it" against Bible truth

People have revived and people have also been raised from the dead in the Bible in OT and in NT and even modern times. There is the question of whether their story is fake - but even if real - the next question is "what message" were they given, what are they teaching regarding what they witnessed? does it fit the Bible?

For some it is just that they survived and they were brought back ... for others they were also given some sort of message, info etc.

 

[BobRyan]

You cannot very well have a Near Death Experience if there's no apparent physical death. And even if that were present, it wouldn't be an NDE if, while "dead," the person didn't experience anything that can't be explained away.

Excluding the fakes for the sake of discussion... then

Technically near death ... is not death, merely close to it and then revived.

But in many of the stories it is told almost like the story of Lazarus where he dies and then later is brought back to life... more of a "resurrection" experience than "near death".

 

[BobRyan]

Yes.


But if the person, upon being revived, reports having been in the place of events that occurred elsewhere than where his body was located, is that not "out of body?"

Technically yes - it could be both near death and out of body. (assuming it is a legit report for the sake of discussion).

The question from 1 John 4 is still about what message they bring if any and is that message in line with the Truth that we have in the Word of God.

 

[Albion]

Excluding the fakes for the sake of discussion... then

Technically near death ... is not death, merely close to it and then revived.

That is what many people say about it. So is the person really dead, but then revived? Or is the person close to death but never was dead? I don't know, but it's not about them being in a coma or asleep or something like that. The NDEs that anyone bothers to examine concern people who were pronounced dead.

But in many of the stories it is told almost like the story of Lazarus where he dies and then later is brought back to life... more of a "resurrection" experience than "near death".

That event is explained as a miracle worked at the hands of Christ himself, however. And what did Lazarus report about his experiences while dead that we cannot explain?

It really doesn't bear upon the subject of NDEs except that it is about someone who was indeed dead but was raised from the dead by God.

 

[BobRyan]

That is what many people say about it. So is the person really dead, but then revived? Or is the person close to death but never was dead? I don't know, but it's not about them being in a coma or asleep or something like that. The NDEs that anyone bothers to examine concern people who were pronounced dead.


That event is explained as a miracle worked at the hands of Christ himself, however. And what did Lazarus report about his experiences while dead that we cannot explain?

It really doesn't bear upon the subject of NDEs except that it is about someone who was indeed dead but was raised from the dead by God.

If they would phrase it as "experiences, conversations, exploits had while dead" it might be more helpful in conveying what they really mean then. As you point out Lazarus gives no report of "experiences had while dead" in the Bible.

In 2 Cor 12 Paul does describe something -- but does not claim to have been dead or even near dead.

Boasting is necessary, though it is not beneficial; but I will go on to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I know a man in Christ, who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a man was caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I know how such a man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows— 4 was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which a man is not permitted to speak. 5 In behalf of such a man I will boast; but in my own behalf I will not boast, except regarding my weaknesses. 6 For if I do wish to boast I will not be foolish, for I will be speaking the truth; but I refrain from this, so that no one will credit me with more than he sees in me or hears from me.

==========================

By contrast Lazarus was actually dead and reported nothing.

 

[Hawkins]

Basically NDE is not dead. Death has no turning back unless one is resurrected.

NDE can be anything. It may also be related to some out of body experience. Some may "communicate" with the outside realm, and get what has been manifested to them as visions. Some may well be delusions.

That said. I myself had an NDE. I don't feel that it's an NDE though. I feel it more about death and being resurrected. It's nothing like the thousands of NDE cases I ever read anyway.

 

[Albion]

If they would phrase it as "experiences, conversations, exploits had while dead" it might be more helpful in conveying what they really mean then. As you point out Lazarus gives no report of "experiences had while dead" in the Bible.

That's probably right. The term, "Near Death Experience," does seem to have led to many misunderstandings about what this is all about.

 

[East of Eden]

Most here at CF would not approve of them, as the vast majority of near death experiences have positive outcomes and this goes against the belief that most people are on the road to Hell.

Exactly. Satan would love people to have a false sense of security by thinking they're going to heaven. This is what Rod Dreher calls 'Moralistic Therapeutic Deism', the general belief that God exists, and wants nothing more from us than to be nice and to be happy.