Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
That is not following Christ's teaching. If you believe that is ok then the gates of hell have prevailed. Jesus taught martyrdom. For those not strong enough in faith yet war.But war is inherently sinful.yes, but then you have guys like Sts Alexander Nevsky and David the Restorer who went to war to defend their Orthodox homeland from non Orthodox invaders.
Lets contrast this with Christianity..
38 You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth. 39 But I tell you, dont resist him who is evil; but whoever strikes you on your right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40 If anyone sues you to take away your coat, let him have your cloak also. 41 Whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. 42 Give to him who asks you, and dont turn away him who desires to borrow from you. 43 You have heard that it was said, You shall love your neighbor, and hate your enemy. 44 But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Dont even the tax collectors do the same? 47 If you only greet your friends, what more do you do than others? Dont even the tax collectors do the same? 48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
Christianity is not a pacifist religion. There's elements that is pacifist, such as monasticm. When christians are a minority then they remain pacifist. When the society and culture are Orthodox then we pray in the liturgy for the defeat of the nations enemies. This petition is omitted in non-Orthodox nations.
Groups like the Amish, Hutterites, and Jehovahs witnesses are pacifist, they segregate themselves off from the established culture around them. They do not partake in politics and set themselves apart from the majority. There is no religion that is completely pacifist.
I I understand war if you do not yet value Christ's teachings above life. You can confess afterward. But to promote it by saying we should hate our enemies that is heresy.
That is not following Christ's teaching. If you believe that is ok then the gates of hell have prevailed. Jesus taught martyrdom. For those not strong enough in faith yet war.But war is inherently sinful.
If genocide is considered holy then God truly dose not exist and power and greed is the true god of this world
for one, neither of those guys that I mentioned is genocidal. for two, I find it funny that you will quote our priests and ignore the lives of our saints. for three, I never said war is a good thing. I said in our fallen (ie sinful) state, it is necessary, but it is never good.
@SeventhValley
Orthodox Answer To a Question About War, Military Service - Answer #46 - and good addition in this answer:
"erhaps the most remarkable and culturally relevant illustration of the Orthodox attitude towards war is contained in the history of the life of St. Sergius of Radonezh, who blessed Prince Dmitry Donskoy to engage the enemy...nd only when the prince confirmed that he had taken all possible measures so as to conciliate this warlike and yet inexorable Khan did St. Sergius give his blessing"
conclusion by default: no way out - so fight.
Moreover, St.Sergius blessed two monks to help Dmitry Donskoy. That battle with tartars is legendary for Russia.
Modern image of these events:
blessening -
peace version of monk:
military version of monk:
I learned from Orthodox web sites that just because a Saint did something dose not mean it is blessed by the church.
I said nothing about hating our enemies, I spoke about prayers for the defeat of our enemies. There's also a prayer for pacifying the nations and forgiveness.
A (lingering) hatred of the enemy in terms of geopolitics usually arises from a national humiliation. Unfortunately This is what NATO has been manufacturing through psyops and manipulation. Whether through "balkanization" or the demonizing of a specific group of people so their adversary can go running to the bosom of NATO to be protected from the bogeyman..
This goes both ways. Putin and the hardliners in Russia portray NATO as the boogeyman and the United States as this nasty villain. With state-run media controlling ONE voice, Putin's, he can pummel people's minds with propaganda with impunity. You can blast the CIA as interfering meddlers, and I can give you the same on a platter with the exact analogous interference, intrigue, and corrupt power-mongering---the KGB and later FSB.
Bottom line is Russia is Orthodox. So are we. It's a really big oversimplification to think that since Putin and the Russians are Orthodox that they are in the right, and the evil West is in the wrong.
I think this passionate patriotism for foreign Orthodox countries and a self-hatred toward our own mother land is not only unhealthy, but it perpetuates the stereotypes of non-Orthodox about us that we're ethnically-centered and that some of us have more loyalties to enemy nations than our own.
I am sharply critical of the CIA like you are. I think every American president has had his hands soiled in some major coup or "intervention" or cheesy war to further the military-industrial complex, but I also am not going to throw my country under the bus completely. This country has done great things for its people, for the world, and we've offered more aid and help as well as support for most of the world than Russia has ever thought of offering. We've done great harm in bad foreign policy, but we've also saved lives, fought for freedom for so many, and have in many ways made the world a better place as well. We're a mixed bag.
At some point, I must say, it sounds like some posts in TAW are rooting for Russia's victory, and the West's demise. And for people looking into Orthodoxy, inquiring, that might produce some scary reactions.
Orthodoxy is a faith, not a nation. It's right teaching and holy sacraments, not a politburo or a congress or an army or black ops. It's a spiritual refuge in an ugly world, not a flag or a manifesto of seculars. Orthodoxy should know no borders or exclusivities of language or color, dress or cuisine. It's a faith created by Christ Jesus Himself, not a patriotic allegiance. I can't speak for everyone, but if you look at me, I'm American born and raised. Proud to be one. I don't wish for its demise. Then there is Tapi, from Finland, proud of his country, Orthodox like me, and yet scared of Russian incursion. Then there is Jesus Madrid from Spain, Orthodox, Spaniard. There are folks in here from all walks of life and nations. We don't all look to Russia for hope and her victories or failures don't further Orthodoxy or affect me. Just as I don't trust Putin and raise an eyebrow at his intrigues, I do the same with Obama and his pro-sodomy agenda and socially decaying principles.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?