What do you guys think of Putin's moves this week?

[All4Christ]

Trump said he has never asked forgiveness from God.

All of the denominations and sects, the crazy views and cults, I didn't realize until that statement, this was is the very fundamental definition of Christian.

Out of curiosity- When did he say this? Was it recent? Source?

We can judge whether a person's actions are Christian or not, but judgment of salvation lies with God alone.

 

[Wunderlust]

Out of curiosity- When did he say this? Was it recent? Source?

We can judge whether a person's actions are Christian or not, but judgment of salvation lies with God alone.

2015

 

[Wunderlust]

That video should be deeply disturbing for any Christian.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Does he act like a Christian?

as one Father said, while you might be able to see someone's sins, you can never see their repentance. only God can judge his heart. so I am saying I don't know.

 

[ArmyMatt]

By their fruits...

and how exactly can one know one's fruits without actually knowing the person?

 

[All4Christ]

2015

I see your point, but I maintain that judgment of salvation lies with God alone. (Plus, God accepts us even to the 11th hour. If he wasn't a Christian then, he may be now. I honestly don't know.) I guess the most important thing for all of us Christians to do is to pray for him (and all or governing authorities), for the governing of our country, and for all the people.

 

[Anhelyna]

All4Christ said

I guess the most important thing for all of us Christians to do is to pray for him (and all or governing authorities), for the governing of our country, and for all the people.

As , depending on the translation we use , we say in various Ektenia in the Divine Liturgy

"For our nation under God, for our government, and for all the military, let us pray to the Lord.
За Бо́гом бере́жений наро́д наш, за правлі́ння і за все ві́йсько, Го́споду помолі́мся."

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

People need to think once in a while about Russia's situation as compared to ours. Look at the Monroe Doctrine. We don't like having enemies in our backyard. The entirety of the Americas are considered our backyard---Mexico, Canada, Cuba, South America, the Caribbean, etc. Do we see the Russians playing around there? Yet look at Eastern Europe, once staunch Warsaw Pact territory sympathetic to Mother Russia now is laden with deadly nukes aimed right at Russia. The Americans play in Eastern Europe, and we've dabbled plenty in Ukraine. We like to poke the Russian bear. They don't poke us.

Yet we get up in arms that Trump is going to hand Europe to Putin because they're buds. Since when is friendliness toward Russia and wanting to build alliances a BAD thing? I'm confused. We have so many mutual interests, that we don't need a Cold War. It seems like the "peace-loving" far left detests Russia and wants less thawing and more freezing on the old Cold War era. Some in the Right Wing are equally naive. I hope Trump can get Russia as an ally and we can be more transparent and helpful to each other. Isn't that what Christians should want?

 

[chandraclaws]

and how exactly can one know one's fruits without actually knowing the person?

Well, haven't you been listening to what he says and watching what he does? I think that's a big clue.

 

[All4Christ]

Well, haven't you been listening to what he says and watching what he does? I think that's a big clue.

What benefit is there to judge someone's salvation? Certainly holding people accountable is important - especially those you know. Witnessing and strengthening each other is critical. Even recognizing sin is important and necessary among us as believers. We should know whose behavior is worth emulating - someone who is emulating Christ. But judging salvation? What possible benefit is there of assuming we know what God will do with other people's salvation? Why not focus on ourselves first, and encourage others to do the same?

If you think the president is the spiritual leader of the country, then you are right to make sure the president is a good example of a Christian. He's not though, and as much as we want to ensure he is a good example, there isn't much we can do at this point. Sure, it'd be great to make sure we have an excellent moral example as our leader, but our other choices didn't match that this year either, imho.

 

[rusmeister]

Putin is obsessed with power and ownership. I don't think he will stop invading countries. I'm afraid the US is now going to be helping him do it.

Hi, and welcome to TAW!
This shows a knowledge of Putin's heart that even I don't possess.
I guess I would ask how well you understand Russia and Russians. Not looking for a fight, but unwarranted fear of Russians is something I am committed to combatting.
I'm an American that emigrated to Russia, for the record, so I might know a little of what I am talking about.

 

[chandraclaws]

What benefit is there to judge someone's salvation? Certainly holding people accountable is important - especially those you know. Witnessing and strengthening each other is critical. Even recognizing sin is important and necessary among us as believers. We should know whose behavior is worth emulating - someone who is emulating Christ. But judging salvation? What possible benefit is there of assuming we know what God will do with other people's salvation? Why not focus on ourselves first, and encourage others to do the same?

If you think the president is the spiritual leader of the country, then you are right to make sure the president is a good example of a Christian. He's not though, and as much as we want to ensure he is a good example, there isn't much we can do at this point. Sure, it'd be great to make sure we have an excellent moral example as our leader, but our other choices didn't match that this year either, imho.

I agree, but why does this non-judgmental attitude only seem to apply to Republican leaders? Not a lot of mercy for anyone on the left.

 

[All4Christ]

I agree, but why does this non-judgmental attitude only seem to apply to Republican leaders? Not a lot of mercy for anyone on the left.

In this forum (The Ancient Way), have you seen that happening? Personally, I fall more into the independent category. Many of us here don't fit into a single party.

A clarification: I'm not saying we can't evaluate character or shouldn't evaluate it, but salvation is way beyond what we should be judging.

Also, evaluating character in politics should primarily be for the purpose of helping decide who should or shouldn't be in office (one component of our decision), and what we need to watch out for when a person is in office. If it doesn't impact their role in office...then it is no concern of ours. I hate the constant gossip in the media, on both sides.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Well, haven't you been listening to what he says and watching what he does? I think that's a big clue.

sure have, and it may be a big clue. but the only side of him that we can see is the side in the media. the real man might be very different. not saying that he is, just saying it is not my place to make that kind of judgment.

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

Trump said he has never asked forgiveness from God.

All of the denominations and sects, the crazy views and cults, I didn't realize until that statement, this was is the very fundamental definition of Christian.

A lot of Protestants these days also seem to take forgiveness as a given, and don't ask for it, they just say "God forgives us, rejoice!" Seldom do they say, "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner!" And the few who might, seldom do it regularly enough to cultivate high levels of contrition.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I agree, but why does this non-judgmental attitude only seem to apply to Republican leaders? Not a lot of mercy for anyone on the left.

funny, because officially, our Church says the opposite. we do not judge someone's faith based on their political affiliation. I am a libertarian leaning conservative politically, and a man I find very inspiring is Fr David Kirk. he was a Greek priest (who converted from being a Uniate) who was a socialist. the work he did through the Emmaus House in Harlem is great.

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

What benefit is there to judge someone's salvation?

None, but there is value not accepting someone to be a follower of Christ just because they say so. Are Mormons and JW's Christians? I don't think so.

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

I agree, but why does this non-judgmental attitude only seem to apply to Republican leaders? Not a lot of mercy for anyone on the left.

People on the left back abortion.

 

[All4Christ]

None, but there is value not accepting someone to be a follower of Christ just because they say so. Are Mormons and JW's Christians? I don't think so.

Agreed. However, their final salvation though is determined by God and God alone. Honestly "Christian" is a different meaning than "saved". It's often considered synonymous, but in reality, it's two separate issues (imho, and also in the teachings of the church, I think).

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

Agreed. However, their final salvation though is determined by God and God alone. Honestly "Christian" is a different meaning than "saved". It's often considered synonymous, but in reality, it's two separate issues (imho, and also in the teachings of the church, I think).

Well, there is no "saved" in the Protestant sense of gaining salvation and being unable to lose it, or "damned" in the Calvinist sense of being pre-destined for damnation and unable to find salvation.