What do we do to prevent another Las Vegas?

[Uncle Siggy]

That culture plays a role instead of banning certain guns changing the CULTURE would do much.

Two things that would help with the cultural issues is having a better curriculum in schools and more jobs. Those 2 things would probably go a long way towards solving the gangster culture issue...

 

[Hank77]

What sort of penalties do you suggest?

Criminal charges.

I mean guns do no good locked up

When there is no adult supervision there is no reason for guns to not be locked up.

What do you mean child?

Under 18

 

[Hank77]

Well, either one of two things hunting or maybe they just feel that our rights should not be limited in such a way.

No honest hunter would use a silencer.

 

[Armoured]

I am taking a break from this thread it may last a few hours may last a day or two, but right now I am feeling guilt over my late father ( of almost three years (do not know what is with that), and as such would like to take a break (probably short) from "heavy" threads.

Hope you feel better soon.

 

[Aldebaran]

When toddlers kill 20 people a year, the price is too high.

Perhaps a gun control law will be passed to establish a minimum age to purchase a firearm. Perhaps 18 for long guns, and 21 for handguns. That way toddlers won't be able to buy guns anymore. Would that make you happy?

And the irony is you are not even free, you have the highest incarceration rates of any developed country, and are ruled by plutocrats. The only real freedom Americans have is the freedom to live in constant fear.

It might be easy to say that while living in Australia and watching news stories about America. News stories are almost never about anything good that happens. It's all about the bad. It's that way here about stories relating to other parts of the world as well. Makes it look like we've got it made here while the rest of the world is falling apart.

 

[Obliquinaut]

Argument from emotion.

Well whenever statistics are quoted it doesn't seem to do any good.

I've pointed out numerous times that America has among the highest rates of gun ownership (88.8 guns per 100 people. SOURCE)of any industrialized developed country AND among the highest rates of gun homicides (SOURCE), and that doesn't ever make any difference.

You have a heart that bleed and those who do not agree with your solutions are obviously lacking in a heart.

No, if they can't see that a higher rate of mass shootings is likely linked to our relationship with guns in this society they aren't thinking rationally. They are thinking about their fear and their love of guns.

Everybody hurts. Everybody cries. Everybody has emotions too.
But there is a place for a brain in decision making too. Hearts lack in the gray matter.

Then explain why America's extremely high gun ownership rates and extremely high rate of gun homicides AREN'T a sign that we have too many guns and we need MUCH STRICTER gun regulations (maybe even an outright limitation on the meaning of the 2nd amendment)?

 

[Allandavid]

It's not that guns it is the people behind the gun. Those people may or may not be mentally ill.

Exactly. As with the man in LV, you have no idea of the mental health of many of these people. Restricting gun access seems more sensible.

 

[Aldebaran]

What rights are impeded that Americans feel that you would not want a gunshot heard. I can understand it in certain law enforcement of military situations... But why in a civil situation.

At a shooting range, it's for noise control. Other countries allow silencers for that reason, and it's actually considered to be "bad form" to shoot without one. Just as cars without mufflers aren't exactly liked by people other than the owner of the car who doesn't want to get a muffler.
But in a defense situation where you're probably discharging a gun indoors inside of an enclosed room, it's almost impossible to put on hearing protection when an intruder in your home is trying to kill you. A silencer not only saves your hearing, but keeps you from suffering the concussive effect of a gunshot fired indoors. You don't want to be deafened and stunned by it if you end up missing the intruder you shot at and are now being attacked by him.

 

[Aldebaran]

You think half a thousand people being shot up at a concert is a fair price to pay for your liberty?

Would say that to the families of the victims?

Do you think they would agree their loved one was a fair trade so someone else can have a gun?

Do you think being unarmed and facing a rapist in your home is a fair price to pay for your gun control? Would you say that to the victims who have been raped?

 

[Aldebaran]

20 people killed by infants under 3 years of age is 20 too many. I see no debate in that at all. Why would anyone want to live in a society where some amount of infants killing people is acceptable.

How about 40,000 people killed? Would that be too many? Is that acceptable?
It's the number of people killed in car accidents in 2016.

But that number is accepted. But 20 is not. According to liberals, even one is too many, which means freedom isn't worth much of anything to them.

 

[Hank77]

Actually, there are laws forbidding several groups of people from having LEGAL access to guns (including the mentally ill, by the way. ( assuming of course that it is known and documented).

Here are some facts about how buyers, that are criminals, buy guns through private, legal sales. Federal law does not address this issue and many states don't either, even though statistics are showing that universal background checks do make a difference.
Universal Background Checks | Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence

 

[Aldebaran]

You seem to think that the choices are to bean all guns or ban none. This hasn't been true in the US since the 30's at least. And, it's not going to happen now. The question is what regulations we should have.

I don't think that. I posted that video to show who does think that.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Do you think being unarmed and facing a rapist in your home is a fair price to pay for your gun control? Would you say that to the victims who have been raped?

I asked you first.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Here are some facts about how buyers, that are criminals, buy guns through private, legal sales. Federal law does not address this issue and many states don't either, even though statistics are showing that universal background checks do make a difference.
Universal Background Checks | Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence

I know for a fact that if a convicted felon is caught with a weapon that in and of itself is also a felony.

 

[Aldebaran]

I asked you first.

Yes.
Yes.
I have no idea what they'd think. They're all individuals.
Your turn.

 

[dogs4thewin]

How about 40,000 people killed? Would that be too many? Is that acceptable?
It's the number of people killed in car accidents in 2016.

But that number is accepted. But 20 is not. According to liberals, even one is too many, which means freedom isn't worth much of anything to them.

Yet, we have plenty of laws concerning cars and driving.

 

[Hank77]

Yeah, this. Most burglaries don't actually occur at night - they happen during the day, when people aren't home. Most burglars want to avoid physical conflict, if at all possible.

And there are many, many that don't.
Home Invasions | Gun Violence Archive

 

[SolomonVII]

Well whenever statistics are quoted it doesn't seem to do any good.

It would be worthwhile for you to take a look at some of the statistics that Ben Shapiro refers to.
Ben Shapiro on Twitter

I've pointed out numerous times that America has among the highest rates of gun ownership (88.8 guns per 100 people. SOURCE)of any industrialized developed country AND among the highest rates of gun homicides (SOURCE), and that doesn't ever make any difference.



No, if they can't see that a higher rate of mass shootings is likely linked to our relationship with guns in this society they aren't thinking rationally. They are thinking about their fear and their love of guns.

Keeping the comparisons within America, as gun ownership is rising, the homicide rate is going down. 56 % rise in gun ownership vs a 49 % decrease in homicides in the same time period. Clearly there is more than guns involved. Moreover, the drop in homicide rate in America is roughly the same as Australia's has been after Australia's big buy back program took so many guns off the street.
Further, most American communities are very safe, with similar rates of murder as in other Western industrialized countries. The differences in overall homicide rate are concentrated in a few select counties, with high gang involvement, and high levels of criminals in general.
That is to say, cultural factors and social conditions play a much larger role in homicide and crime than gun ownership. and all the rules in the world is not going to take guns out of the hands of criminals who do not follow the rules.

Then explain why America's extremely high gun ownership rates and extremely high rate of gun homicides AREN'T a sign that we have too many guns and we need MUCH STRICTER gun regulations (maybe even an outright limitation on the meaning of the 2nd amendment)?

Okay, I think the chart referred to above does explain that.
As far as the second amendment, unlike the right to abortion for example, regardless of how genocidal the rate of abortion may be to(does anybody even care?), gun rights are written into the very constitution. It does not just involve changing the make-up of the SCOTUS to bring in a different interpretation of the law. It is an entirely different process to scrap chunks of the constitution.
How are you going to put a bell on that cat?
It is not even a practical solution. Rationality ought to have some deference to what is possible in the real world, otherwise it is all just a pipe dream.


7 Facts On Gun Crime That Show Gun Control Doesn't Work


https://www.researchgate.net/public...Rates_A_Methodological_Review_of_the_Evidence

 

[Armoured]

And there are many, many that don't.
Home Invasions | Gun Violence Archive

Even so, people who break into houses are looking for stuff to steal, it's very rare that they're there to intentionally harm a stranger.

 

[Hank77]

I know for a fact that if a convicted felon is caught with a weapon that in and of itself is also a felony.

Did I say something different?