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Featured What are the commandments now that we are supposed to keep...?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Neogaia777, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Not sure whether you read the N.T. in the context it is written in. For example, Jesus was sent only to the Jews implies that much of what Jesus said. Was directed at the Jews rather than the Gentiles.

    I see clearly in the N.T the separation between what was required of the Jew, and what was required of the Gentile. Which the N.T. (Acts 15) so clearly demonstrates, the Gentiles were never seen as being under the law.
     
  2. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Context is all about the Gospel of the Kingdom.

    Luke 4:43 And he said unto them, I must preach the kingdom of God to other cities also: for therefore am I sent.

    Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14 And this GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come

    Mark 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, 15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

    Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom...

    etc:
     
  3. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    The kingdom is within!
     
  4. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    “Jesus replied, “‘You must love the LORD your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. A second is equally important: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ The entire law and all the demands of the prophets are based on these two commandments.””
    ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭22:37-40‬ ‭
     
  5. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Yes and Jesus taught we had a choice to chose it, thus the will of God. Or stick with the will of man as our default allegiance.
     
  6. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    We were created through Jesus and for Jesus.

    So is it a case of choosing so much as accepting the inevitable rule of the Lord of heaven and earth. This what we were created for after all.

    It could be choose you this day, it could also be that we were predestined to submit. Either way everyone will be forced to bow when Jesus returns.
     
  7. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Now brother Dan these are your words and not God's Word and do not respond to God's WORD shared with you in love to correct your errors in your last post.

    You use your words to try justify breaking God's 4th commandment which is one of God's ETERNAL LAWS (10 commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN AND RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. Your words are not God's WORD brother so your argument is with God not me. God's 4th commandment is one of God's 10 commandments that gives us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *ROMANS 3:20. God's WORD says if we KNOWINGLY break ANY ONE of God's commandments we stand guilty before God of SIN *JAMES 2:10-11. All who continue in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.

    God's people are in every church *JOHN 10:16 and He knows that many break this commandment out of IGNORANCE because what they have been taught in the Churches they may be in. JESUS says that the hour is coming and NOW is that he will call his people out from following the teachings and tradtions of men to worship God in Spirit and in truth according to his WORD *JOHN 4:23-24

    Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9) There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

    Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God? In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).
     
  8. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for sharing. The couterfiet Gospel indeed tries to separate God's LAW (10 commandments) the cross and from God's GRACE. How is God's LAW the schoolmaster that leads us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25? They that be whole need not a Physicial but they that are sick how do you learn what this means *MATTHEW 9:12-13. If you have no LAW then you have no KNOWLEDGE of SIN; If you have no KNOWLEDGE of SIN you have no need of a Saviour; If you have no need of a Savior you have no salvation because you are still in your sins. Jesus said to them, If you were blind, you should have no sin: but now you say, We see; therefore your sin remains *JOHN 9:41.

    You can't have GRACE without LAW dear brother. God's ETERNAL LAWS (10 commandments) give us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4. It is God's WORD that says if we break ANY ONE of God's commandments we stand guilty before God of SIN *JAMES 2:10-11. God's 4th commandment is one of God's 10 Commandments *EXODUS 20:8-11. All who continue in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.


    So brother in your view it seems...

    1. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that it is lawful to do GOOD on the Sabbath? (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)

    2. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that God's Sabbath was made for mankind and not man for the Sabbath rebuking the tradtions of the Jew in regards to their traditions and interpretation around Sabbath keeping? (Mark 2:27-28; Matthew 12:8)

    3. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that he was the maker and creator of the Sabbath and the God of creation? (Hebrews 1:2; John 1:1-3; 14; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:16-17; Mark 2:27)

    4. Jesus IS NOT OUR EXAMPLE who kept the Sabbath as well as all those who followed him (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matt 16:24; Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10)

    5. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that if break God's Commandments and teach others to do so will not enter God's Kingdom? (Matt 5:19)

    6. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that not a jot or tittle will pass from God's LAW until heaven and earth pass away? (Matthew 5:18)

    7. Jesus DID NOT TEACH that on the two great commandments of LOVE to GOD and MAN hang ALL the LAW and the prophets (Matthew 22:36-40)

    8. Paul DID NOT WARN US that those who do NOT believe and follow GOD do not enter into God's Sabbath rest because of their SINS and UNBELIEF (Hebrews 3-4)

    9. Paul DID NOT KEEP the Sabbath with both Jews and Gentiles (Acts 13:14-15; 42-44; Acts 16:13; Acts 17-1-2; Acts 18:4-5)

    10. Jesus, Paul, James, John and Peter DID NOT KEEP the Sabbath and taught there is 10 Commandments which includes the Sabbath and if you break anyone of God's Commandments you stand guilty before God of breaking all of them (James 2:8-12; Romans 7:7; 3:20; 1 John 3:4).

    Why would Jesus and the Apostles give us further instruction in relation to Sabbath keeping building on the OLD TESTAMENET scriptures if we no longer need to keep it? (Point 1, 2, 3, 6)

    ................

    In fact many years after the death of Jesus we see Paul still keeping the Sabbath with both Jews and Gentiles.

    ACTS 13:14-5 [14], And when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
    [15], And after the reading of the law and the prophets the rulers of the synagogue sent unto them, saying, You men and brethren, if you have any word of exhortation for the people, say on.

    ACTS 13:42-44, [42] And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath. <Why wait till the next Sabbath?>
    [43], Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
    [44], And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

    ACTS 16:13 [13], And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a riverside, where prayer was accustomed to be made; and we sat down, and spoke unto the women who met there.

    ACTS 17:1-2 [1], Now when they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, where there was a synagogue of the Jews:
    [2], And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,

    ACTS 18:4-5 [4]And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks. [5], And when Silas and Timothy were come from Macedonia, Paul was pressed in the word, and testified to the Jews that Jesus was the Christ.

    ................

    What it all comes down to is that SIN is the breaking of any of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

    Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9) There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

    Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God? In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).

    CONCLUSION: Only God's WORD is true and we should believe and FOLLOW it *ROMANS 3:4 HEBREWS 4:9 So then, it remains for the people of God to keep the Sabbath.

    Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.
     
  9. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Indeed so in your view JESUS did not really mean that he God's SABBATH was made for mankind? Not sure about you brother but I choose to BELIEVE JESUS that the SABBATH was made for mankind and that it why it was made. Shouldn't you?

    Does this mean that the SABBATH was not really made for man when JESUS says in his own WORDS that the SABBATH was made for man and he is the LORD of it *MARK 2:27-28?

    So you agree now that JESUS taught it is lawful to do GOOD on the SABBATH *MATTHEW 12:12? So then here is your problem. IF JESUS teaches that the SABBATH was made for mankind, JESUS is teaching that the SABBATH was made BEFORE SIN entered the world. God BLESSED the SEVENTH DAY and made it a HOLY DAY as part of the FINISHED work of creation *GENESIS 2:1-3. JESUS says that the SABBATH was made for mankind (from ADAM AND EVE created on the SIXTH DAY) and He is the LORD of the SABBATH (creator) that commands us to REMEMBER the SEVENTH DAY and KEEP it HOLY. Why would JESUS be TEACHING us how to KEEP the SABBATH DAY HOLY by doing GOOD on the SABBATH if in your view we not longer need to keep it? Kind of puts lot's of holes in your teachings doesn't it brother?

    INDEED :oldthumbsup: Something we can agree on here. The Jews had placed so many restrictions on the Sabbath commandment that it had become a burden to the people and was nearly impossible to keep (Luke 13:14; John 5:10-18; 9:16; etc). Jesus taught us that this was not the purpose of the Sabbath. (1) He taught us that the Sabbath was made for mankind and that mankind was not created for the Sabbath (Mark 2:27). Jesus came to teach us that (2) He is the Lord of the Sabbath and that this is the Lord's Day (Mark 2:28) Jesus came to (3) teach us that it is ok to enjoy the Sabbath and to do good on the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14) (4) Jesus taught and fellow shipped with his people on the Sabbath (Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56). Similar verses can be shown for the apostles after the death of Jesus (Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10). In summary then JESUS was teaching that the SABBATH was made for MANKIND, JESUS is the LORD of the SABBATH (it is His day) and it is lawful to do GOOD on the SABBATH *MATTHEW 12:12.

    Now brother here is your problem again. If in your view God's 4th commandment is no more, why is JESUS teaching us the correct way on how to keep GOD'S SABBATH?

    Can you see your error here brother?[/QUOTE]
     
  10. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Your digging a bit of a hole for yourself now brother Dan. If the SABBATH was made on the SEVENTH DAY of CREATION *GENESIS 2:1-3 BEFORE SIN; BEFORE ISRAEL EXISTED; and JESUS in his own WORDS says that; THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN, and not man for the sabbath: Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath *MARK 2:27-28; How can JESUS not mean what he says when he says THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN when there was only ADAM and EVE when God created the SABBATH?

    It is interesting if you look at the GREEK word used here in MARK 2:27 for MAN

    STRONGS Greek MAN G444 ἄνθρωπος anthropos (an'-thrō-pos) n.1. (literally) man†-visage (i.e. a man-faced being, a man who has visibly come of age).2. (concretely, in Hebrew) a clay being (a classification of beings made in the image of God, who made them male and female).3. a human being. 4. (indefinitely) a certain man (i.e. someone).[from G435 and ops “the countenance” (from G3700)]KJV: certain, man Root(s): G435, G3700

    So the Sabbath was made for Human beings; clay beings (we are made out of the dust); male and female; mankind

    This agrees with the English word for MAN

    WEBSTERS DICTIONARY
    MAN, n. plu. men. [Heb.species, kind, image, similitude.]
    1. Mankind; the human race; the whole species of human beings; beings distinguished from all other animals by the powers of reason and speech, as well as by their shape and dignified aspect. "Os homini sublime dedit." And God said, Let us make man in our image, , after our likeness, and let them have dominion--Gen 1

    So the answer is YES the Sabbath was given to ALL mankind the scripture is very clear in Mark 2:27.

    Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.
     
  11. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    The ORIGINAL pupose and reason the SABBATH was made as JESUS said was for ALL MANKIND. As shown earlier in MARK 2:27 and GENESIS 2:1-3 which shows that God made the SABBATH on the SEVENTH DAY of the creation week after he made MANKIND (Adam and Eve). JESUS says that the SABBATH that was made in CREATION for MAN *MARK 2:27. The GREEK Word used here for man agreeing with GENESIS 2:1-3 meaning Human beings; mankind; or CLAY beings.

    When mankind turned away from GOD then God always had a people who were faithful to him so it is to these people God gave his LAW (10 commandments) in the spoken WORD and the written WORD of God. BEFORE the written WORD there was the spoken WORD. These have only been aver given to those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD (the Church) in the OLD TESTAMENT as well as the NEW TESTAMENT. Gods ISRAEL in the OLD and NEW COVENANT are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

    In the NEW COVENANT God's ISRAEL (the Church) are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD * EPHESIANS 2:11-13; GALATIANS 3:28-29; ROMANS 9:6-8; ROMANS 2:28-29; COLOSSIANS 3:11. If you are not a part of God's ISRAEL you have no part in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 10:26-27. Gentiles are now grafted in *ROMANS 11:13-27.

    Your trying to make an argument in silence. I can make this same argument back to you by saying nowhere in scriptuere is there any hint that God's people before MOSES did not keep God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH. Can you find me a scripture that says God's people did not keep God's SABBATH before Moses?

    Fact is brother you cannot prove that that God’s SEVENTH DAY Sabbath was not kept or known about by the patrarchs. Yet there is more scriptures confirming that the Patriachs did follow and obey all of God’s laws.

    Let's look at the evidence however from God's WORD and see what we can find, we have touched on this a little already when JESUS says that God's SABBATH was made for mankind before SIN. So if man was made on the SIXTH DAY of creation and the SABBATH was made on the SEVENTH DAY of Creation what makes you think ADAM and EVE did not keep God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH *MARK 2:17; GENESIS 1:26-31; GENESIS 2:1-3?

    Before the WRITTEN WORD of GOD there was the SPOKEN WORD of GOD * GENESIS 3:1-3; 9; 11-19 8:15; 9:8; 24:7; 31:11 etc).

    If BEFORE the written Word was given at SINIA there was the SPOKEN Word of God what makes you think that God's people did not KNOW about God's LAWS including God's SABBATH? Let's look at some examples that suggest God's LAW was known through the SPOKEN WORD BEFORE the WRITTEN WORD was given to God's ISRAEL.

    When CAIN and ABEL were born it is clear from God’s WORD that there was SIN offerings for remission of sin as shown in GENESIS 4:1-7. We are latter told that ENOCH and NOAH walked with God *GENESIS 5:24; GENESIS 6:8 so were following God’s ways. In NOAHS time the thoughts of men were only evil continually *GENESIS 6:5-7. Jesus says that what defiles a man is an evil heart that breaks God’s commandments *MATTHEW 15:16:19.

    Before the Flood God made his Covenant with NOAH and his decendance *GENESIS 9:1-9. When Abraham was present God spoke to Abraham and made his covenant with him and his descendance *GENESIS 15:18. 17:2-19.

    God said of Abraham that ABRAHAM OBEYED MY VOICE AND KEPT MY CHARGE, MAY COMMANDMENTS, MY STATUTES AND MY LAWS. The HEBREW word used for laws is TORAH. So, it is very clear that the SPOKEN WORD of GOD included God’s TORAH. The TORAH includes all God's LAWS of the OLD COVENANT from God's ETERNAL LAW (10 Commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN AND RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172 and the SHADOW laws for remission of sin (burn't offerings and sin offerings) if God's LAW was broken.

    If they had no law BEFORE the written WORD of GOD then they would have no knowledge of what sin is. If they did not know what sin was there would have been no need of sin offerings. Yet here we also see in GENESIS 22:2-7 that it was a regular practice for Abraham and his family to offer burnt offerings for sin. So before Mt Sinai God’s people had the SPOKEN Word of God after slavery to the Egyptians they received the WRITTEN Word of God but through all this time God’s people had a knowledge of what sin was and what to do if sin was committed.

    Some more examples...

    God said in Genesis 4:7 to Cain when he was angry because he did not worship God in his appointed way that by doing this it was sin. Jesus says the same in Matthew 15:3-9 that if we follow and teachings of men that break the commandments of God we are not following God. Mankind was destroyed by a flood because of sin (Genesis 6:5-7). Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed because of sin (Genesis 18:20).

    Jacob knew about SIN (breaking God's LAW) BEFORE Mt Sinia when he complained to Laben when he left with his daughters (Genesis 31:36).

    When Potiphar’s wife came to Joseph with the aim of committing adultery, Joseph knew it was sin and protested saying how then can I do this great wickedness, and sin against God? (Genesis 39:9).

    As time goes by God detroys mankind for evil and sin with a flood as well as Sodom and Gommorah with fire and the Epyptians with plagues *GENESIS 6:5-13; GENESIS 13:10-13; 18:20-33; 19:24; EXODUS 9:13-14. If there was no knowledge of sin there would be no punishment for it. God’s WORD is very clear that all of God’s Commandments were kept by God’s people before the written WORD through the Spoken WORD of GOD.

    Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.
     
  12. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    INDEED! Thanks for sharing this (Emphasis in red mine). NOTICE what you did not highlight here? So who is God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT?

    GOD'S ISRAEL ARE ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD (The Church)

    There is no such thing as Jew or Greek anymore. All who believe and follow God's Word are one in Christ. Israel in the OLD COVENANT were those from the seed of Abraham. In the NEW COVENANT, if you are in Christ then you are Abrahams seed and heirs according to the promise...

    EPHESIANS 2:11-13 [11], Why remember, that you being in TIME PAST Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

    [12], That AT THAT TIME [in the Past] YOU WERE WITHOUT CHRIST, BEING ALIENS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF ISRAEL, STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANT OF PROMISE, HAVING NO HOPE, AND WITHOUT GOD IN THE WORLD: [13], BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS, YOU WHO WERE FAR OFF ARE MADE NEAR BY THE BLOOD OF CHRIST.

    GALATIANS 3:28-29 [28], THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YOU ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAM'S SEED FOR YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS [29], and IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN ARE YOU ABRAHAM'S SEED, AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE.

    God's true ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT are not by name only but all those in Christ. Those of the FLESH (sinful human nature) are not Abrahams seed but those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God in Christ are God's ISRAEL...

    ROMANS 9:6-8 [6], FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: [7], NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> [8], That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED.

    God's ISRAEL are all those in CHRIST that have been given a NEW HEART according to the NEW COVENANT promise...

    ROMANS 2:28-29 [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    In the NEW COVENANT all those in Christ are are God's ISRAEL...

    COLOSSIANS 3:11 [11], WHERE THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: BUT CHRIST IS ALL IN ALL.

    ROMANS 10:11-13 [11], For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. [12], FOR THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN JEW OR GREEK: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. [13], FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED.

    The New Covenant is for God's Israel...

    EZEKIEL 36:26-27 [26], A NEW HEART WILL I GIVE YOU, AND A NEW SPIRIT WILL I PUT WITHIN YOU; AND I WILL TAKE AWAY THE STONY HEART OUT OF YOUR FLESH, AND GIVE YOU A HEART OF FLESH. [27], AND I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT WITHIN YOU, AND CAUSE YOU TO WALK IN MY STATUTES AND YOU SHALL KEEP MY JUDGEMENTS AND DO THEM.

    and again...

    JEREMIAH 31:33-34 [33], BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS,AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. [34], And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

    Paul proclaims it here...

    HEBREWS 8:10-12 [10], BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS, AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [11], And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [12], For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

    The NEW COVENANT is for GOD'S ISRAEL which represent those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God’s WORD.

    If you are not part of GOD'S ISRAEL then you are not a part of the NEW COVENANT (Hebrews 8:10-12).

    ............

    CONCLUSION: According to the scriptures in the NEW COVENANT God's ISRAEL (the Church) are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD * EPHESIANS 2:11-13; GALATIANS 3:28-29; ROMANS 9:6-8; ROMANS 2:28-29; COLOSSIANS 3:11. If you are not a part of God's ISRAEL you have no part in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 10:26-27. Gentiles are now grafted in *ROMANS 11:13-27. So the Sabbath being a sign FOREVER to God's people continues to be so foever just as it is written. (need more scripture?)

    Sorry my friend, God's WORD disagrees with you.
     
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  13. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    This has already been shown to be a false argument. As the SABBATH was made for ALL MANKIND *MARK 2:17 BEFORE SIN and BEFORE ISRAEL existed at creation *GENESIS 2:1-3. Before the written WORD there was the SPOKEN WORD of GOD.

    You are confused as your WORDS are not God's WORD. The CONTEXT that you ignore here is HEBREWS 4:1-5 which is discussing GOD'S REST the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH with reference back to GENENSIS 2:1-3. That is the REST we are to enter into. Those that did not enter into GOD'S REST (SEVENTH DAY SABBATH) did not enter into God's REST because of SIN and UNBELIEF in the gosple of God's WORD.

    We should bring everything to the light of God's WORD and test it's claims with the scriptures. The GREEK or HEBREW is good to understand as we study the scriptures. However, GREEK and HEBREW definitions in isolation of the CONTEXT and of the scriptures and chapter can lead to an incorrect interpretation of the scriptures especially if the GREEK or HEBREW words have more than one specific meaning. Let's examine the word used in HEBREWS 4:9 in detail starting with the word meaning than it's application and CONTEXT and application within HEBREWS chapter 4.

    I will not use Vines dictionary interpretation of Sabbatismos as I have read from some scholars that it is in error and others do not agree with his interpretation (e.g. some independent sources for this claim linked here click me 1, 2, 3).

    So for HEBREWS 4:9's use of the word Sabbatismos we will use the STRONGS CONCORDENCE and Greek LEXICON.

    GREEK INTERLINEAR
    HEBREWS 4:9 άρα (Then) απολείπεται (there is left) σαββατισμός (a Sabbath rest) τω (to the) λαώ (people) του θεού (of God)

    STRONGS LEXICON
    So ἄρα (ara) Conjunction Strong's Greek 686: Then, therefore, since. Probably from airo; a particle denoting an inference more or less decisive.
    there remains ἀπολείπεται (apoleipetai) Verb - Present Indicative Middle or Passive - 3rd Person Singular Strong's Greek 620: From apo and leipo; to leave behind; by implication, to forsake.
    a Sabbath rest σαββατισμὸς (sabbatismos) Noun - Nominative Masculine Singular
    Strong's Greek 4520: A keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest. From a derivative of sabbaton; a 'sabbatism', i.e. the repose of Christianity.
    for the τῷ () Article - Dative Masculine Singular Strong's Greek 3588: The, the definite article. Including the feminine he, and the neuter to in all their inflections; the definite article; the.
    people λαῷ (laō) Noun - Dative Masculine Singular Strong's Greek 2992: Apparently a primary word; a people.
    of God. Θεοῦ (Theou) Noun - Genitive Masculine Singular Strong's Greek 2316: A deity, especially the supreme Divinity; figuratively, a magistrate; by Hebraism, very.

    STRONGS CONCORDENCE
    sabbatismos
    : a sabbath rest Definition: a sabbath rest Usage: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

    ENGLISHMAN'S CONCORDANCE
    Hebrews 4:9 N-NMS GRK: ἄρα ἀπολείπεται σαββατισμὸς τῷ λαῷ NAS: there remains a Sabbath rest for the people KJV: therefore a rest to the people INT: Then remains a sabbath rest to the people

    As can be seen in the above definitions, no where does the GREEK word definitions say that sabbatismos is not referring to God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH. In fact the definition of the Greek Word sabbatismos is a keeping of the Sabbath rest. This is why the majority of bible translations translate the word REST (sabbatismos) in Hebrews 4:9 as SABBATH rest or a keeping of the Sabbath...

    Understanding the HEBREW or GREEK words is one part but this is not enough to understand a meaning of a scripture passage without God's Spirit and without understaning of within scripture and chapter CONTEXT that the words are applied to. This is because sometimes the word meanings can be multiple and depend on the CONTEXT in which they are used. This is the CONTEXT you leave out of your interpretation to try and explain away HEBREWS 4:9

    ADDING THE CONTEXT; WHAT SABBATH REST ARE WE TALKING ABOUT?

    HEBREWS 4:1-11
    [1], Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
    [2], For to us was the gospel preached, as well as to them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
    [3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
    [4], For he spoke in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
    [5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

    NOTE
    : CONTEXT is God's REST from the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST OF CREATION (v4-5) and those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD's WORD enter into God's SABBATH REST as GOD did on the SEVENTH DAY of the week. CONTEXT is GOD's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST and those who believe or do not believe God's WORD and enter into that rest.

    [6], Seeing therefore it remains that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
    [7], Again, he limits a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if you will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
    [8], For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
    [9], So then, it remains for the people of God to keep the Sabbath.

    Now notice Hebrews 4, verse 9: “There remains therefore a SABBATH rest to the people of God.” In verses 1, 3, 4 and 8, the Greek word for “rest” is katapausin. It means “rest.” But in verse 9, the Greek word for “rest” is sabbatismos, which is a Hebrew word—Sabbat, which means “the Sabbath”—combined with a Greek suffix—ismos, which means “a keeping of” or “a doing of.” Put together, sabbatismo means “a keeping of the Sabbath.” When correctly translated, Hebrews 4:9 should read, “There remains therefore a keeping of the Sabbath to the people of God.”

    [10], For he that is entered into his rest (v9 SABBATH REST), he also has ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
    [11], Let us labor therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief (Heb 3).

    .................

    CONCLUSION: HEBREWS 4 is talking about the Gospel rest of BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD; v29 Learn of me; v30 my burden (doing) is light. This agrees with Hebrews 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. HEBREWS 4:9 is in reference to God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST which is the CONTEXT shown in HEBREWS 4:1-5. HEBREWS 4 therefore with context added is saying that no one enter God's Sabbath rest if they do not BELIEVE God's WORD or follow it.

    Sorry MMD, looks like God's WORD disagress with you again.

    Hope this helps.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
  14. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    What I find ironic is that everything you post on the Sabbath is a cut and paste repeating the same things you always do word for word without addressing any of the posts and scriptures that disagree with you. I cut and past scripture. My posts are from my own personal prayerful time in God's WORD and not from word of website.

    Only God's WORD is true and we should believe and FOLLOW it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God. JESUS says those who follow the teachings and traditions of men are not following God *MATTHEW 15:3-9. Who should we BELIEVE and FOLLOW, GOD or man? I know who I believe how about you? :)

    God's Sheep hear his Voice (the Word).
     
  15. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Are you looking for an excuse to put off the choice? God right from the beginning of the Bible has given man the choice of will of man or will of God. Which we follow will be shown by our fruits but we don't get to put the choice off once we understand the opposing wills and which serves who and which is the ruination of man while the other is the saviour.
     
  16. Danthemailman

    Danthemailman Well-Known Member

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    More of the same Scripture twisting, deception, rhetoric and strawman arguments. By the way, are you a lawyer by profession? I know who I BELEVE and FOLLOW and it’s not Ellen G White or the gospel according to Ellen G White.

    Getting back to Hebrews 4:9, since the seventh day Sabbath is simply a shadow of the true spiritual rest that believers have in Christ, the writer of Hebrews would have no logical reason to stress the keeping of the weekly Sabbath under the law in Hebrews 4:9. As with the Promised Land, the Sabbath day was a mere shadow that prefigured the coming reality, the spiritual rest of the Believer/Christian in Christ.

    The spiritual rest of salvation which God’s people are entering is "sabbatismos" a "sabbath keeping" in the sense that it is a participation in God’s own "rest," which we enter by faith. (Hebrews 4:3) Anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from His. (Genesis 4:10). The "sabbatismos" rest of God described in Hebrews 4:9 refers to the salvation "rest" into which all Christians have entered. As W.E Vine points out - Because this Sabbath rest is the rest of God Himself, its full fruition is yet future, though believers now enter into it. :oldthumbsup:

    The weekly Old Testament Sabbath is a shadow the spiritual "rest" Christians have in Christ (Colossians 2:16-17). This may explain why the writer of Hebrews coined the word "sabbatismos," making a play off the word for the Sabbath day "sabbaton."

    The original plan was to rest in God every day, as there was no command to specifically keep the seventh day holy prior to Exodus 16:23, which was a command for Israel. (Exodus 16:23; 31:16-17; 35:1-3; Deuteronomy 5:15; Nehemiah 9:13 etc..) God intended for humanity to live resting in Him. Hebrews 4 restored the original plan for those who are in Christ. Praise the Lord Jesus Christ and to Him all the glory! :)
     

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    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
  17. LightLoveHope

    LightLoveHope Jesus leads us to life

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    Every part of the law that reflects how we love God and how we love our neighbour.
    Jesus fulfilled the temple and ceremonial law, sabbath keeping and celebrations.
    Jesus made the people of God His kingdom rather than just Israel, and removed the need to belong to the civil judicial system of Israel.

    And we walk in love because it is Jesus flowing from us as Holy temples of the Holy Spirit.
     
  18. Gracia Singh

    Gracia Singh Newbie Supporter

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    The entirety of the New Testament.

    With God's help, we can keep His commandments.

    You always ask good questions, Neo! Thank you, and keep them coming!
     
  19. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Rejection of the will of man for the will of God.
     
  20. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Hello LGW.

    How do you understand the following verse?

    1 Corinthians 14:37-38
    If anyone thinks he is a prophet or spiritual, let him recognize that the things which I write to you are the Lord’s commandment. But if anyone does not recognize this, he is not recognized.
     
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