What About Progressive Sanctification?

[RickReads]

So, I just sit here and do nothing - and If I don't feel lead to - too bad, that's the Holy Spirit's job?

"I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing."

 

[RickReads]

I got the sense there was a subconscious argument against a salvation requirement since in your theology there is no difference between justification and sanctification.

That`s it? LOL! If I contrive a way to add sanctification to the verse you would feel better? I was expecting something more dramatic than that. I`m disappointed.

In every verse that uses the words sanctify or sanctification, it is a work of God. Doctrine in which man sanctifies himself or helps God to sanctify the man, isn`t Biblical. Sorry if that offends your Baptist indoctrination.

 

[RickReads]

Romans 12
1 ¶ I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

That we would not be provided instructions like the above if we didn't have to do anything.

You don`t seem to want to accept the fact that the Holy Spirit will lead you to do all these things and to do them as a type of worship and because you want to.

The renewing of your mind is the renewing of the Holy Spirit within you.

For the Spirit led Christian it`s want to do not have to do. Maybe you are the one with subconscious slip eh?

Jesus said this;
"Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works." John 14

He doeth the works. I am just a vessel for His Spirit.

 

[RBPerry]

I have a dear friend that is a Nazarene Pastor, and the sanctification issue is a big one with him. We have many discussion on the subject. Reality is sanctification is a brought about by how willing we are to submit every aspect of our lives to the leadership of the Holy Spirit. I believe if one reaches a point where they are fully committed to living as the Holy Spirit leads, they are then sanctified, but that isn't an easy process for most.

 

[Silly Uncle Wayne]

What About Progressive Sanctification?

I don`t really believe in it.

Tell me why you do.

Well I definitely believe that I've never heard of it. What is it all about?

 

[RickReads]

Now that we have defined terms, I know what you're talking about. 1 Cor. indicates that Christ is our sanctification. It is from our union with Christ that sanctification flows from. Just like justification, sanctification flows from Christ.

Romans 6:1-14 indicates that sanctification is progressive in our lives. We don't simply wake up one morning free from all of our sins. In fact, I find that once believers think they're free from sin God will reveal something in their hearts that is sinful. Beyond that the scope of the law is vast and expansive. Anyone who views the 10 commandments as a check list of 10 things not to do is deluding themselves about their sinful nature.

Point being sanctification is progressive in our lives as we become more holy and knowledgeable in the faith. We will never be perfect, we may backslide. But over time our works will be seen.

In all of these verses believers are sanctified in the perfect tense, Acts 20:32; Acts 26:18; 1 Cor. 1:2; Heb. 2:11; Heb. 10:10; Jude 1:1

Perfect tense describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.

If sanctification were a present or ongoing process the New Testament would not have used the perfect tense in these verses or at least would have used the imperfect tense to express that a durative process had taken place.

These verses do not teach that believers “are slowly being sanctified” in a on-going life-long process, but that they have been definitely sanctified completely in the past. It speaks of the believers sanctification as something that has come to completion.

PS, I confess I did cheat with this post. My info comes from an outside source. You all give good opposition an I needed a little help. LOL!

 

[RickReads]

Well I definitely believe that I've never heard of it. What is it all about?

That`s awesome! Welcome aboard.

 

[RickReads]

I have a dear friend that is a Nazarene Pastor, and the sanctification issue is a big one with him. We have many discussion on the subject. Reality is sanctification is a brought about by how willing we are to submit every aspect of our lives to the leadership of the Holy Spirit. I believe if one reaches a point where they are fully committed to living as the Holy Spirit leads, they are then sanctified, but that isn't an easy process for most.

Agreed, and I wouldn`t want to fuss much with someone having issues with this topic.

 

[RickReads]

Well I definitely believe that I've never heard of it. What is it all about?

Near as I can tell, a lot of issues that a Holy Roller like me would consider to be issues with being Spirit-Led are called Progressive Sanctification by Baptists, Calvinist, etc.

To be critical it seems like a doctrine that mixes works in with the ministry of the Holy Ghost. Which is why thus far I don't have a favorable view of it.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

The following scripture shows our part in the salvation journey.

2Ti 2:19-22 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work. Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Yes we are saved by the finished work of the cross, but Chirst also has us on the path of "departing from iniquity", and "purging ourselves from sin".

 

[RickReads]

The following scripture shows our part in the salvation journey.

2Ti 2:19-22 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work. Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Yes we are saved by the finished work of the cross, but Chirst also has us on the path of "departing from iniquity", and "purging ourselves from sin".

I agree with all that but are you sanctified by these works or did you do the works because you were sanctified?

To me, it`s the salvation issue all over again.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

I agree with all that but are you sanctified by these works or did you do the works because you were sanctified?

To me, it`s the salvation issue all over again.

The works come as a result of two things, 1) The grace of God to save me, and 2) the fear of the LORD. I am grateful to God for what He has done, but I respect His authority and fear to sin against Him.

 

[RickReads]

I couldn`t find the post but someone disputed the way this verse is translated.

Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Convenient, but if you believe this is a translation error then please explain why.

 

[RickReads]

The works come as a result of two things, 1) The grace of God to save me, and 2) the fear of the LORD. I am grateful to God for what He has done, but I respect His authority and fear to sin against Him.

I can`t disagree with that. God Bless.

 

[Albion]

Well then I, and just about every protestant I knew, must have been the exception (I am assuming by "protestant" we mean "all Christians who are not Catholic or Orthodox"). Although we wouldn't have used words like theosis and deification... but we had the same idea. We also wouldn't have believed that deification was possible in this life.

Well, I don't know your friends or which church you attended back then, but 'progressive sanctification' is not the majority POV among Protestants.

That doesn't mean that I'm horrified by it or that I'm saying that virtually no Protestants believe that way, but what I wrote initially I stand by.

 

[RickReads]

Well, I don't know your friends or which church you attended back then, but 'progressive sanctification' is not the majority POV among Protestants.

That doesn't mean that I'm horrified by it or that I'm saying that virtually no Protestants believe that way, but what I wrote initially I stand by.

I`ve only rarely encountered it as well. Do you know how prelevant it is?

 

[Albion]

I`ve only rarely encountered it as well. Do you know how prelevant it is?

It's mainly associated with Methodism...and therefore also with denominations that stemmed off from Wesleyan Methodism--the "Holiness churches, for instance.

So that's not an insignificant group, but neither do they represent the mainstream of the Protestant churches which date back to the Reformation era (unlike the Methodists who came along later and under very different circumstances).

 

[Redwingfan9]

If this helps, this is what I believe happens to someone after they believe.

Eph 1:13 "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,"

Ok, he heard the gospel, he believed, after that he is sealed with the Holy Spirit. The washing away of sin and the sealing of the Holy Spirit sanctifies him permanently until the first resurrection.

Eph 1:14 "Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory."

He has been led by the Spirit,

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

He has been testified to by the Spirit,

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

He has been taught by the Spirit,

John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you."

And he has been given the power to become a son of God

John 1:12 "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name"

I believe the sanctification stays the same, neither increasing or decreasing.

I think we can look at the lives of believers and clearly see when sanctification is increasing. When a drunk gives up alcohol, for example, how can we not say sanctification is increasing?

 

[RickReads]

It's mainly associated with Methodism...and therefore also with denominations that stemmed off from Wesleyan Methodism--the "Holiness churches, for instance.

So that's not an insignificant group, but neither do they represent the mainstream of the Protestant churches which date back to the Reformation era (unlike the Methodists who came along later and under very different circumstances).

Ok, thx for the info. Given the level of opposition I`ve encountered on this thread, I felt like a major minority.

 

[RickReads]

I think we can look at the lives of believers and clearly see when sanctification is increasing. When a drunk gives up alcohol, for example, how can we not say sanctification is increasing?

Sanctification isn`t really based on human effort. Like salvation, sanctification will produce human effort but it isn`t established by human efforts. You can`t get more saved than saved, same thing with sanctification.

There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. Proverbs 14