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understanding Daniel & Rvelation.

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Prophecy Countdown, Oct 30, 2002.

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  1. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    Prophecy Countdown , I would love to hear more on this particular subject you have mentioned - The word Bride is used when referring to Israel or Jerusalem
    (which becomes the harlot.)

    Thank you .
     
  2. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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     Revelation 11: 1. And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

    The Mosque will come down and a knew Temple will be built because the two Witnesses are told to measure it.

    2But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
    3 ½ years.

    3And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

    That’s about 3 ½ years.
    26But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. 27And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

    28Hitherto is the end of the matter. As for me Daniel, my cogitations much troubled me, and my countenance changed in me: but I kept the matter in my heart.


    Well I have had to leave a lot out, because of space but I will cover the eschatological apocalyptic story from many angles.
    I hope and pray that this has been a help to you 66Books.

    Maranatha.

    Prophecy Countdown.
     
  3. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    Thank you very much Prophecy Countdown , I also believe that jerusalem is the harlot woman and you have put forward bible verses even I did not know .
    Thanks again .
     
  4. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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     The symbols used in Daniel 8. are different but as you will see it is the same story as in Daniel 7. Only this time we are given geographical locations pointing to the powers positions and moods at the time of the end. This is done so that we can recognise them.

    This vision is a cause and effect situation.
    First, a religious Cause, It slowly appears, in the form of terrorism, then will be reacted against, then more and more fanatical causes, with quickening rapidity! The result is counter reactions one after another these are the Birth pangs until THE END OF TIME Which is different from the " time of the end."


    Remember what Jesus said about the nations and about the time of sorrows?
    This is it 66Books we are living through the opening pages of DANIEL’S visions.
    Matt 24: 6. And ye shall hear of WARS and RUMOURS of WARS: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the END is not yet. 7For NATION shall rise against NATION, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and PESTILENCES, and earthquakes, in divers places. 8All these are the beginning of SORROWS.

    Fanatics never admit to being fanatical!
    They think they are doing the will of God!

    Daniel chapter 8.
    Some two years had passed by since Daniel’s last dream. The translation from Greek in verse 1 Does not mean after in time, that is a poor rendering of it. It means after in kind.
    The second vision is the same, in kind, or likeness as the first.


    Daniel Chapter 8:1. In the third year of the reign of king Belshazzar a vision appeared unto me, even unto me Daniel, AFTER THAT WHICH APPEARED UNTO ME AT THE FIRST.

    At what time? "The time of the end"
    What powers? Those powers associated with Israel either positively or negatively.
    Where are these powers located? Locations are given clearly, in the Book.
    Are they named? Yes absolutely.

    The Bible is a Jewish Book.
    When we read it it’s about them, when they read. it’s about themselves. We Gentiles impose our Western thinking on this Jewish Book called the Bible.
    The only reason Gentile empires are mentioned, past or future is because they were or will be associated with Israel, for or against.
    The powers at the time of the end, will be if not already, interlocked with Israel and are mentioned as such. It is in that light, that we should be reading the Bible.
    Check it out.
    I see folk getting bogged down with stuff like, could it be this or that power and saying that Daniel and Revelation are symbolic and is a spiritual war only or that it all happened back then, Preterists.
    Some are still looking for the powers in the North or South!
    Man o man! Why do we do this stuff?

    This is the brilliance of this prophecy.

    The answer is? Read what the Bible says.
    I hope and pray that you can see how clearly the Angel Gabriel is talking to us through Daniel chapter 8.

    Daniel sees himself standing at Shushan in the Palace. SHUSHAN was in the extreme South Western part of PERSIA now called IRAN. Now understanding that this vision is at "THE TIME OF THE END" we now have the location of this prophecy in Iran and therefore Iran must be the country concerned.

    In the next verse we are told by Daniel, "I was by the river ULAI, the modern name for this river is KARUN. The KARUN river is of course in IRAN.

    Daniel 8:2 And I saw in a vision; and it came to pass, when I saw, that I was at Shushan in the palace, which is in the province of Elam; and I saw in a vision, and I was by the river of ULAI.


    Daniel looked up and saw the RAM, before the river ULAI or Karun.
    As you know The Medes and Persians were rolled up into one Empire, that put an end to King Belshazzar and his Babylonian empire. . Now Shushan under Cyrus was the first capital of the Medo- Persian empire.
    The Persian side that is, which is modern Iran.
     
  5. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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     The Medes were conquered in 558 BC by Cyrus and the two countries blended into one. The modern names of these countries is Iran and Iraq. We should note that Afghanistan was part of Iraq at that time.
    ELAM where the Elamites lived (highlands) This province lay South of Assyria and East of Persia proper.
    The ULAI river (modern name Karun) is in IRAN it originates in the highlands and becomes part of the Tigress & Euphrates river system known as Perath in Hebrew.

    Now I need your attention! there is a message in this.
    Daniel goes into great detail as to where he is and where the ram and goat meet in combat. So, we have a geographical. location
    He is also told when this vision is to take place. "At the time of the end."

    The Little horn IRAQ comes up first then the larger IRAN last. IRAQ has come up causing trouble, however IRAN may help IRAQ as the vision implies with the two standing together as the RAM by the river Karun. The smaller horn, Iran came up first against Israel with missiles.
    Iran the larger horn on the ram is coming up second, both pushing but mot yet as one on the ram.



    Daniel 8: 3.Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: and the two horns were high; but one was higher than the other, and the higher came up last.

    In verse 4. Daniel says the ram is pushing. Where is the ram power pushing?
    Westward, Northward, and Southward.
    He is not pushing East!
    The ram "BECOMES GREAT." No other beast or power can do a thing about the power of the ram and what he grasps he keeps. No one can stop him doing what he likes.

    Now you know and I know that the Moslem religion is a push religion. To spread they need to push in the directions mentioned and they are pushing it.
    I have never seen so many Mosques in so many places.

    They have started to push and when the Americans find out, if they haven’t already, that it is Iran, that is in the thick of this then, look out!
    When we start to look at Israel, Jerusalem, Look out!

    The President of America, the most powerful nation the earth has ever known, does not state that the axis of evil involves IRAN, IRAQ and North Korea for nothing, the President knows something.

    Daniel 8:4. I saw the ram pushing westward, and northward, and southward; so that no beasts might stand before him, neither was there any that could deliver out of his hand; but he did according to his will, and became GREAT.

    Cause and effect
    Cause, The RAM is pushing North, South and West. Knocking off and subduing other nations around him. He did as he liked a local bully and became GREAT!!

    Effect! He pushes too far. He does something to push the Goat, America to counter his belligerence.
    America has had some dealings with Iran and she is concerned about Israel’s safety.
    What makes America so angry? The Goat does not touch the FACE OF THE WHOLE EARTH traveling fast from the west.
    That means ships and aircraft, missiles!
    He is one , He has one HORN, He is so angry, no hesitation this time, he goes straight in.

    Daniel 8: 5. And as I was considering, behold, an he GOAT came from the WEST on the face of the WHOLE EARTH, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.
     
  6. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    Please feel free to continue .    :cool:
     
  7. cenimo

    cenimo Jesus Had A 12 Man A-Team

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    There are volumes written about this, both preterist and pre-trib, mid-trib, post-trib etc...
    the more my wife and I study it (attempt to - and Brain Damage, well, you might get a chuckle out of what I'm about to say :) ) the more convinced we are that there are some people in psychiatirc care facilities in wards named The Ezekiel Ward, The Daniel Ward, and The Revelation Ward, to name just a few. (the wards being named after the books that put them there, you see)

    Prophecy Countdown, you've obviously researched this also, and extensively...what is your take on the 1200 days, 1300 days, etc...(figures not exact, I think it's Daniel 11)
     
  8. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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     Just put your finger on an atlas sphere, spin it anti-clockwise and see where your finger travels pointing from Iran-Iraq West. If they keep pushing North West and South then the country from the West is going to whack them good because America can’t be pushed around.
    This is a cause and effect.
    He doesn’t touch the ground!
    Aircraft and ships and plenty of them, covering the "WHOLE EARTH."
    Only a few years ago (until 1985) we could not have realised this vision because we had two super powers. Now we only have ONE. The U S of A. With eagles wings with the lion?
    There is only one horn on that Goat which denotes America may go it alone. "You are either for us or against us." Said U S President George Bush.

    Now the Ram is still pushing. Which makes the goat from the West very angry!
    The powerful goat goes straight into the ram’s backyard, Iran and Iraq.
    What ever Iran, the larger horn and his lesser horn partner Iraq, do to America?
    I don’t know.

    But it is going to make America so very, very angry the goat is going to hammer both Iraqis and the Iranians something chronic. "Fury" or Furious is the word the Bible uses.


    Daniel 8: 6. And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.

    As the Goat, the USA gets closer to Iran, the Ram, he is moved with choler, which is an old English word meaning anger, the goat moves with such rage against the Ram that he annihilates him.
    Puts him down permanently. No power on earth will be able to stop the U S A. "Either you are with us or against us."

    Daniel 8: 7. And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand
    The two horns are broke Iraq and Iran are fixed to the ground.
    Now the Ram "became great." But the Goat became VERY GREAT, There’s only one world power that can come from the West and do this to the RAM Iraq and Iran. That power is America and we all know it!

    Will America survive this?

    Daniel 8: 8.Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

    Something divides the one very great horn into four notable ones. A division. A vacuum is created for another world leader.

    Now you know that America buys favours with millions of dollars Afghanistan has cost the U S lots of moolah. How does the greatest nation on earth that becomes "VERY GREAT" suddenly lose its power? Turn off the oil?
    A world recession?
    A world disaster, like planet X?
    What ever it is, America can’t use the carrot approach, all she has is the big stick.

    Rev 13: 17. And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    Will America survive? This war with the goat will be won by America no doubt about it the Ram gets done in.
    If however this causes an economic collapse it will be a pyrrhic victory!
    A vacuum is created and nature does not like a vacuum, there needs to be a replacement to fill the gap. Out of one of these horns comes up a Little horn. He’s not GREAT (ram) He’s not VERY GREAT (USA), he’s EXCEEDINGLY GREAT!

    Now there is a message in this!

    Daniel 8: 9. And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
    Which way is he pushing? He is pushing SOUTH and EAST and toward the "PLEASANT LAND." Israel.

    Why does this fellow want to get into Israel? He wants to sit where he ought not!

    Where is it that he wants to sit?
    Isaiah 14: 12. How art thou fallen from heaven, O LUCIFER, SON OF THE MORNING! how art thou cut down to the GROUND, which didst WEAKEN THE NATIONS!
     
  9. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    bump
     
  10. Evee

    Evee Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Prophecy Countdown. Evee
     
  11. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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     It is this angel of the morning, meaning first created that weakens us on earth.

    Isaiah 14: 13.For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the MOUNT OF THE CONGREGATION, in the SIDES OF THE NORTH:

    The MOUNT IN THE SIDES OF THE NORTH of the CONGREGATION.
    That is The TEMPLE MOUNT of the CONGREGATION.
    In Jerusalem.


    Daniel 8: 10. And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.


    Satan, which means accuser waxes great, grows, increases swells, becomes a big shot even to the host, the man of the house. He casts down some of the host and the stars from heaven. He has caused Angels, the host Jesus, the Holy Spirit, even evil angels to come down to earth. Even some of the host and stamped on them.

    The two Witnesses Elijah and Moses, are caused to be cast down and the are stamped on by the beast. The Gentiles will move on Jerusalem.
    Revelation 11: 1. And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the TEMPLE OF GOD, and the ALTAR, and them that worship therein. 2But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is GIVEN UNTO THE GENTILES: and the holy city shall they TREAD UNDER FOOT FORTY AND TWO MONTHS. The fact that John is told to measure the Temple proves it is to be rebuilt.

    The two Witnesses are going to preach for 3 ½ years they are murdered by the beast. In the midst of the week 3 ½ days later in the same week they are raised.
    Revelation 11: 7.And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and KILL THEM. 8And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, WHERE ALSO OUR LORD WAS CRUCIFIED where also our Lord was crucified.
    The city is Jerusalem.

    Rev 11: 9. And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies THREE DAYS and an HALF, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves. Rev 11: 10. And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two PROPHETS tormented them that dwelt on the earth. 11And after THREE DAYS and an HALF the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

    Daniel 8: 11. Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily (sacrifice) was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

    THE PRINCE of the host is Jesus.
    The Daily was taken away.
    The place of the daily was taken away the word sacrifice was added by the translators thinking Daniel had been doing some short hand, forgetting Rev 20;18,19, about not adding words or taking them away from the prophecies in the Book.



    Daniel 8: 12. And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

    A host (man of ceremonies) is given against the place of the daily by reason of transgression. ( violating a rule or law)
    "Sacrifice" and "him" were added and mislead.

    Daniel 8: 13. Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

    In plain English one Angel asks. How long will he get away with it?



     
  12. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    PC , why do you keep editing your posts ?
    You shouldn't worry about what other people think .
    Very few would be willing to put their beliefs on the line as you have done...for fear of being laughed at .
    I personly believe you are doing a very good job and a possible service to others .
    Keep up the good work .
     
  13. Faithful1

    Faithful1 Member

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    yes, what a wonderful and enlightening thread!:D
     
  14. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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    Dear Brain Damage and Faithful I will post again Daniel 11 and 12. I was simply fed up spending hours behind my computer and getting personal insults. But for you two and Cinimo I will post all the things of Daniel that I removed but I refuse to have anything to do with Ephriam. Dear Brain Damage my son 66Books has been in touch with you so I understand, you live right next door to me!! Small world Eh?
    Marantha,
    Prophecy Countdown.
    The Posts I promised will come very soon.
     
  15. Brain Damage

    Brain Damage Generally Medicated

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    Hi PC .  There is a young lady called "Evee" who is also interested .

    You say you live next door to me , please PM me on this . ( small world indeed )

    Thanks PC.
     
  16. Evee

    Evee Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Brain Damage,

     I am very interested.

     Prophecy I understand what you are saying.

      I am anxious to have you back I do appreciate your effort.

           Evee
     
  17. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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    Dear Sister Evee, Faithful and Brain Damage. thank you for your kind words.

    I am very grateful that you have taken the time to read my posts.

    I feel there is so much to tell you and it is not easy because time is running short.

    I will post Daniel 11, then follow with Daniel 12 just completed.

    Maranatha

    Prophecy Countdown.

    ps Brain Damage I will be in touch and like my dear son 66Books will help you with tapes that he may not have. We send as many out as we can free to many and family. My vcr is not working but it will be soon. May God bless you.


     
     
  18. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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    Daniel 8:14. And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

    Now the proper translation is 2300 evening and morning. It could be six and a bit years or 2300 evening and morning as it is rendered from Greek meaning 1150 evening and 1150 evening equals three and a bit years. The Angel Palmini is only doing his job.
    Now the Angel that gives these numbers is the Angel Palmini.
    Which means, Wonderful Numberer, or Angel of SECRET numbers
    Look for a Bible with a marginal help, to find the Angel Palmini.

    Please do not get the following statement by our Lord also in Hebrews 8:8. Confused with what the abomination causing desolation does to the Temple ( yet to be built because the witnesses are told to measure it in Rev 11: 1.
    Jeremiah 31: 31. Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

    We are told that Satan shall seek to change laws and times Daniel 7: 25. And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change TIMES AND LAWS: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
    That is about 3 ½ years when the two Witnesses are prophesying.

    They are caught up in Jerusalem for 3 ½ years and can’t leave until raised 3 ½ days after being killed by the beast.

    Jesus does not cause the following to happen. HE puts an end to it as the Lamb at the second coming.
    Satan mimics Jesus he looked like a lamb but spoke like a dragon.

    Satan seeks to change the laws and times, he has to beat the fullness of time set by the Father, so he comes early!
    Daniel 9: 27. 27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
     
  19. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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    Lets go back to Revelation 11: 13.to read the same end of this vision of Daniel 8.

    The fake covenant is signed in the midst of the week, as a result the two witnesses are killed by the beast.

    I know it’s in the midst of the week because Daniel was told by Gabriel. It is within this same week, the middle that they are murdered and guess what, 3 ½ days later at the end of that week they are raised.

    At Trumpet 7, resurrection and woe number 3 kicks in Armageddon starts and lasts for 15 months as we have already studied.
    Revelation 11: 11. Revelation 11: 11. And after THREE days and an HALF the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and GREAT FEAR fell upon THEM which saw them.



    Rev 11: 12 .And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their ENEMIES beheld them. 13And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
    Rev 11:14. The second woe is past; and, behold, the THIRD WOE COMETH QUICKLY.

    Daniel 8:14. And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

    When Jesus kicks out the lodger Lucifer, "the abomination that causes desolation," out of the Temple mount at the sides of the North of the congregation, Then and only then will the Sanctuary be cleansed.


    Dan 8; 15. And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.
    Daniel like us all wanted to know the meaning of the VISION not just part of it, all of it. The Book does say "vision."








    Dan 8; 16And I heard a man’s voice between the banks of ULAI, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.
    I n plain English. GABRIEL!! Explain the vision to this man Daniel.

    Now the Angel Gabriel is a big Angel and Daniel doesn’t realise how big until he comes kind of really close.
    The size and magnitude of this mighty Angel is so overwhelming he scares the living daylights out of Daniel, who by the now is quite elderly.

    17So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

    ___________________________________________________________
     
  20. Prophecy Countdown

    Prophecy Countdown Senior Member

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    The CLEAR UNMASTAKABLE message is this.

    UNDERSTAND, O son of man: FOR AT THE TIME OF THE END shall be THE VISION.


    18Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright. 19And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in THE LAST END OF THE INDIGNATION: FOR AT THE TIME APPOINTED THE END shall be.
    For the Life of me 66Books, I can’t understand Preterists or Seventh Day Adventist teaching on this Vision being fulfilled


    20The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

    Bingo! Hit the nail on its head, Iraq and Iran, at the time of the end.



    21And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

    Greeks was a term used for non-Jewish peoples. courtesy of, "THE EVERYDAY BIBLE DICTIONARY."
    A Westerner would fit the description.

    22Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.

    Sadly America is going to be split. Four kingdoms will emerge
    "But not in his power." Not under his control. Not under a President but four leaders.

    Remember the little horn comes up out of one of the four that come up after the big horn is broken.
    23And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.
    Satan turns up a fierce King Remember he’s like a lamb but speaks like a dragon.


    24And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

    This is the fake Armageddon The lamb that speaks like a dragon will be very persuasive.


    25And through his policy also he shall cause CRAFT to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

    Craft is an old English word for witchcraft, magic.
    "By peace shall destroy many." The Greek translation reads,
    By his prosperity he shall destroy many.
    He goes to Jerusalem. You can’t buy or sell unless you receive the mark of the beast 666. If you receive the mark you have had it. This is why when she is punished, in one hour all the trading ships stand off and watch.
    Revelation 18: 17. For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,

     
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