Ultimate Blasphemy?

[Oblio]

I see this as false. For We are to test everything with scripture and not a church teaching. We are never directed to rely on the Church. Paul admonishes us to stick to the scripture that is taught. Jesus tells us that Gods word is Truth. We also see when Jesus rose from the dead that He opened the eyes of His followers to understand the scriptures. NOt the church.

Who's version of Scripture, the one believed always, everywhere, and by all in the Pillar and Foundation of Truth, the Body of Christ, The Church; or your personal, individualistic viewpoint ?

 

[Nimrauko]

That's right. The bible could not and does not hold everything that Jesus said or did. John said in his gospel that his testimony was true, but what he does not say is that "oral" traditions are equal to scripture. All "oral" traditions must be compared to scripture to assertain its validity. The Word of God will ALWAYS superceed the traditions of man.

So, and I do not mean this to be rude or snide, you need someone to tell you its raining before you realize the rain drops falling on your head are indeed rain drops? Lets say your grandmother told you its rain. Do you then need to have it in explicit writing telling you its Rain?
I hope that made sense lol. took me a min to word it right. Again I am not trying to be rude. Its a valid question.

 

[Hentenza]

So, and I do not mean this to be rude or snide, you need someone to tell you its raining before you realize the rain drops falling on your head are indeed rain drops? Lets say your grandmother told you its rain. Do you then need to have it in explicit writing telling you its Rain?
I hope that made sense lol. took me a min to word it right. Again I am not trying to be rude. Its a valid question.

I didn't take it as rude, bro. No, I don't need my grandmother to tell me its raining because I can see for myself, however, without sounding rude, I don't rely on "The " church to interpret scripture for me. The Holy Spirit dwells in me and guides me.

 

[IamAdopted]

Who's version of Scripture, the one believed always, everywhere, and by all in the Pillar and Foundation of Truth, the Body of Christ, The Church; or your personal, individualistic viewpoint ?

The foundation is Christ the pillar is the church to uphold the truth of Gods word. We as Gods people are the church. We as Gods people are to uphold His truth. Jesus said that Gods word was truth. The Church are those whom God has called out of darkness into His light. For the Holy Spirit dwells in each one of Gods people. This is how we are connected to the Father is through Christ in us.

 

[repentant]

The foundation is Christ the pillar is the church to uphold the truth of Gods word. We as Gods people are the church. We as Gods people are to uphold His truth. Jesus said that Gods word was truth. The Church are those whom God has called out of darkness into His light. For the Holy Spirit dwells in each one of Gods people. This is how we are connected to the Father is through Christ in us.

So you an the other Protestants who self interpret Scripture are God's people? And the Orthodox Church that has been around since the beginning is what?

Who or what is the Church?

 

[repentant]

I didn't take it as rude, bro. No, I don't need my grandmother to tell me its raining because I can see for myself, however, without sounding rude, I don't rely on "The " church to interpret scripture for me. The Holy Spirit dwells in me and guides me.

Does the Holy Spirit only dwell in you and guide you?

 

[IamAdopted]

So you an the other Protestants who self interpret Scripture are God's people? And the Orthodox Church that has been around since the beginning is what?

Who or what is the Church?

It is each individual person with the Spirit of Christ in them that make the Church. For the Church is Christs Body made up of individual people . IT is not an institution but a body of believers. THis says it much better.

The church is the Body of Christ. Ephesians 1:22-23 says, "And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and gave Him as head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all." The Body of Christ is made up of all believers from the time of Pentecost until the Rapture. The Body of Christ is comprised of two aspects:
(1) The universal church is the church that consists of all those who have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. 1 Corinthians 12:13 says, "For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many." We see that anyone who believes is part of the body of Christ. The true church of God is not any particular church building or denomination. The universal church of God is all those who have received salvation through faith in Jesus Christ.
(2) The local church is described in Galatians 1:1-2, "Paul, an apostle…and all the brethren who are with me, to the churches of Galatia." Here we see that in the province of Galatia there were many churches - what we call a local church. A Baptist church, Lutheran church, Catholic church, etc. is not THE church, as in the universal church – but rather is a local church. The universal church is comprised of those who have trusted in Christ for salvation. These members of the universal church should seek fellowship and edification in a local church.

 

[Hentenza]

Does the Holy Spirit only dwell in you and guide you?

That's a bait question. What do you think.

 

[IamAdopted]

So you an the other Protestants who self interpret Scripture are God's people? And the Orthodox Church that has been around since the beginning is what?

Who or what is the Church?

ya know you have been told over and over how we learn scripture.

1Co 2:10 For to us God revealed them through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, even the depths of God.
1Co 2:11 For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God,
1Co 2:13 which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.
1Co 2:14 But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
1Co 2:15 But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one.
1Co 2:16 For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE WILL INSTRUCT HIM? But we have the mind of Christ.

This says it pretty clear here.

 

[repentant]

It is each individual person with the Spirit of Christ in them that make the Church. For the Church is Christs Body made up of individual people . IT is not an institution but a body of believers. THis says it much better.

Sorry, as soon as I saw the word "rapture" the entire credibility of the source of the quote went down the drain...not that it had any to begin with..

 

[repentant]

That's a bait question. What do you think.

No it's not. You claimed no need for a Church because the Holy Spirit guides and teaches you. So if you diasgree with the billions of Christians in the last 2000 years, then were they not guided...but you are?

 

[repentant]

ya know you have been told over and over how we learn scripture. This says it pretty clear here.

yea it is pretty clear..

30And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?

31And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

 

[IamAdopted]

yea it is pretty clear..

30And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?

31And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

Was this man a Christian? Or did He get saved after Phillip explained him the scripture?

 

[Kristos]

A. PHILIP IS SENT TO THE EUNUCH - Ac 8:26-29
1. An angel of the Lord tells Philip to go toward Gaza - Ac 8:26
2. On the way there is a man sitting in his chariot - Ac 8:27-28
a. A eunuch of Ethiopia, in charge of the treasury of Queen
Candace
b. Returning home from having gone to worship in Jerusalem
c. Reading from the prophet Isaiah
3. The Spirit tells Philip to overtake the chariot - Ac 8:29

B. PHILIP PREACHES JESUS TO HIM - Ac 8:30-35
1. Hearing the eunuch reading Isaiah, Philip asks if he
understands - Ac 8:30
2. The eunuch asks Philip to help him - Ac 8:31-34
a. He expresses a need for someone to guide him, and invites
Philip to sit with him
b. The scripture under consideration is Isa 53:7-8
1) Which speaks of one led as a sheep to the slaughter
2) Which describes one whose life is taken from the earth
c. The eunuch asks if Isaiah was speaking of himself, or of
someone else
3. Beginning with that Scripture, Philip preaches Jesus to him
- Ac 8:35

C. THE EUNUCH IS BAPTIZED - Ac 8:36-40
1. The eunuch expresses a desire to be baptized - Ac 8:36-37
a. Seeing some water along the way, he wonders what would
hinder him from being baptized
b. Philip replies that if he believes with all his heart, he
may
c. The eunuch confesses his faith in Jesus as the Son of God
2. Philip baptizes the eunuch - Ac 8:38-40
a. Stopping the chariot, both Philip and the eunuch go down
into the water
b. Philip then baptizes him
c. When they come up out of the water, the Spirit catches
Philip away
d. Though seeing Philip no more, the eunuch goes on his way
rejoicing
e. Philip is found at Azotus, and continues preaching in the
cities until he arrives at Caesarea

 

[Hentenza]

No it's not. You claimed no need for a Church because the Holy Spirit guides and teaches you. So if you diasgree with the billions of Christians in the last 2000 years, then were they not guided...but you are?

The Holy Spirit has guiden millions through the ages, but "The" church stronged armed millions in the past 2000 years. I don't think the HS was guiding the church when it was either join the church, obey, and believe blindly or be labeled a heretic or anathema and be treated like a second class citizen or worst be killed. The 2000 years that you so embrace is riddled with injustices performed by "The" church.

 

[Epiphanygirl]

The Holy Spirit has guiden millions through the ages, but "The" church stronged armed millions in the past 2000 years. I don't think the HS was guiding the church when it was either join the church, obey, and believe blindly or be labeled a heretic or anathema and be treated like a second class citizen or worst be killed. The 2000 years that you so embrace is riddled with injustices performed by "The" church.

Can't stop you from believing what you will, but if thats the case...........then the Protestant churches are in big doo doo.....they started off with strong arming and murder...oy vey

http://hoodathunk.blogspot.com/2005/04/inquisition-not-necessary-catholic.html

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/madden200406181026.asp


http://www.davidmacd.com/catholic/inquisition.htm

 

[Nimrauko]

The Holy Spirit has guiden millions through the ages, but "The" church stronged armed millions in the past 2000 years. I don't think the HS was guiding the church when it was either join the church, obey, and believe blindly or be labeled a heretic or anathema and be treated like a second class citizen or worst be killed. The 2000 years that you so embrace is riddled with injustices performed by "The" church.

As I recall werent the protestants guilty of the same? Need I remind you all of the Salem witch trials?

 

[Rowan]

Is this going to be one of those threads? Looking at history, a good amount of blood lays on all of our hands in one way or another.

The Holy Spirit has guiden millions through the ages, but "The" church stronged armed millions in the past 2000 years. I don't think the HS was guiding the church when it was either join the church, obey, and believe blindly or be labeled a heretic or anathema and be treated like a second class citizen or worst be killed. The 2000 years that you so embrace is riddled with injustices performed by "The" church.

Let's not be like the world and believe its one-sided, revisionist history about our faith. These are misconceptions perpetrated by people who seek to bring us down. We shouldn't be using it to turn the sword on each other.

 

[IamAdopted]

A. PHILIP IS SENT TO THE EUNUCH - Ac 8:26-29
1. An angel of the Lord tells Philip to go toward Gaza - Ac 8:26
2. On the way there is a man sitting in his chariot - Ac 8:27-28
a. A eunuch of Ethiopia, in charge of the treasury of Queen
Candace
b. Returning home from having gone to worship in Jerusalem
c. Reading from the prophet Isaiah
3. The Spirit tells Philip to overtake the chariot - Ac 8:29

B. PHILIP PREACHES JESUS TO HIM - Ac 8:30-35
1. Hearing the eunuch reading Isaiah, Philip asks if he
understands - Ac 8:30
2. The eunuch asks Philip to help him - Ac 8:31-34
a. He expresses a need for someone to guide him, and invites
Philip to sit with him
b. The scripture under consideration is Isa 53:7-8
1) Which speaks of one led as a sheep to the slaughter
2) Which describes one whose life is taken from the earth
c. The eunuch asks if Isaiah was speaking of himself, or of
someone else
3. Beginning with that Scripture, Philip preaches Jesus to him
- Ac 8:35

C. THE EUNUCH IS BAPTIZED - Ac 8:36-40
1. The eunuch expresses a desire to be baptized - Ac 8:36-37
a. Seeing some water along the way, he wonders what would
hinder him from being baptized
b. Philip replies that if he believes with all his heart, he
may
c. The eunuch confesses his faith in Jesus as the Son of God
2. Philip baptizes the eunuch - Ac 8:38-40
a. Stopping the chariot, both Philip and the eunuch go down
into the water
b. Philip then baptizes him
c. When they come up out of the water, the Spirit catches
Philip away
d. Though seeing Philip no more, the eunuch goes on his way
rejoicing
e. Philip is found at Azotus, and continues preaching in the
cities until he arrives at Caesarea

Just as I thought. He didn't understhand the scripture because He was not at that time a Christian. When He confesses Christ we see Phillip leave and the iunuch go on his way praising the Lord. For now His eyes and ears have been opened to the scriptures for He was born again.

 

[Nimrauko]

Just as I thought. He didn't understhand the scripture because He was not at that time a Christian. When He confesses Christ we see Phillip leave and the iunuch go on his way praising the Lord. For now His eyes and ears have been opened to the scriptures for He was born again.

I didnt think that at time that the term christian was used. And even if it was, just because you are a christian doesnt mean you throw out 2000 + years of Tradition and Church Theology, merely because you dont like how it is. I could go into why the other denominations came into being, but this is not the time nor the place.

I feel like this whole thing has turned from the original post, and has become an "Bash The Catholic" thread. Sad really.