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Trinity: Biblical teaching or Pagan doctrine?

Discussion in 'Paterology, Christology & Pneumatology' started by franklin, May 23, 2002.

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  1. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

    +62
    Christian
    Married
    US-Libertarian
    "Instead of mocking me Louis Booth, why don't you take the time out to go and seek the references I listed and learn about how "God" came about for yourself. Your problem Louis, is you don't care to know the truth, you just want to mock it.
    "

    My appologies then. I was poking fun only because I have heard this before and did check it out. :)
     
  2. wannabe

    wannabe Member

    88
    +0
    Yahshua's name was written in hebrew with the hebrew letters
    [ YAHWSHA ] the scholars vowel pointed the "u' sound and the "W" is silent. as it is written the hebrew manuscrpits. You falsely spell it "Yeshua" which is a big error because it takes away the Father's name "YAH", in which Yahshua means: YAHWEH is rescue (salvation)

    The dead sea scrolls reveal evidence of the New testament in hebrew .

    Arabic manuscriptswhich include the Hebrew scrolls

    Look for the Encyclopedia Brittanica 11th edition pg 596 under "inqusition"

    Dr Ed Bullinger Companion Bible app 94

    the list goes on and on but you have to understand more history of what happened also, Im falling asleep at my computer, so I say to you have a good night and until the next time...shalom (peace)
     
  3. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

    +62
    Christian
    Married
    US-Libertarian
    "The dead sea scrolls reveal evidence of the New testament in hebrew .
    "

    Cite please. All current and formost NT scholars I know of claim it is a prevailent greek work.

    "Encyclopedia Brittanica 11th edition pg 596 under "inqusition" "

    Do I need to explain to you why this isn't a very reliable source? Ask any college proff..they usually 90% + or - don't allow you to use these as sources.

    Goodnight. I still don't see it.
     
  4. Ioustinos

    Ioustinos Veteran

    +157
    Eastern Orthodox
    Private
    US-Libertarian
    :scratch: Uh......I made a quick search about the Dead Sea Scrolls and yes the majority of them are Hebrew and Aramaic, but the scrolls are literature pertaining to Old Testament times! Not the scriptures of the New Testament!

    But if there is proof of such a"Dead Sea Scroll New Testement" then I would be willing to look at the information you provide and the source that I may view such scrolls.


    The only information I can find concerning the Dead Sea Scrolls to the New Testament are some documentation of early church traditions and practices, not a translation of the Gospels and Epistles in Hebrew.

     
  5. A Sheep

    A Sheep Stop the suffering in Iraq

    +1
    Biblical teaching. Just read the OT and the NT. Thanks.
     
  6. Caedmon

    Caedmon kawaii Supporter

    +538
    Catholic
    US-Others
    wannabe, I have really tried to stay with your logic, I have, but I'm sorry. Why would God care how you say his name?! God knows His own. That's just all there is to it.

    I'm not attempting to offend you, but really, wannabe, this is getting out of hand. I can't believe you put this much emphasis on something so insignificant in the eyes of God. You agonize over the wrong issues. It's not about whether or not I pronounce His name absolutely accurately. It's about whether or not I serve Him on a daily basis through my actions. If you want to agonize over this so terribly, that's fine, I respect your right. But honestly, I just can't see any sense in it. None of the disciples encouraged a "correct" pronunciation of God's name to any extent. It does not edify.
     
  7. wannabe

    wannabe Member

    88
    +0
    Iam sorry to say Humble Joe, YAHWEH's name is everything in the scriptures, The reason why you are having trouble seeing it is because of the titles used by translators that removed His name. Louis, Jesaiah, I will have to go back to the library and do my research again for more information on the "New Testament" because what I have learned I should have copied my resources but I failed to do so. You have both written good information.

    shalom
     
  8. SnuP

    SnuP A son of the Most High

    +9
    Non-Denom
    2Hereby know ye the Spirit of God:  Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:  3And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God:  and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 1 John 4:2,3

    15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. 1 John 4:15

    Therefore if I say that Yahshua is the massiah come in the flesh, and if i confess that Yahshua is the Son of Yahweh, but I say that Yahweh is God, have I blasphemed the Most High and shown that Yahweh dwells within me and that I am of the Spirit of Yahweh.

    A tree can not bearforth both good and evil fruit.

    Nor can I blaspheme and glorify Yahweh in the same breath.  God is a legitimate name for Yahweh.
     
  9. wannabe

    wannabe Member

    88
    +0
    God is not a name Snup, if you read some of my previous postings you will see where "God" came from and YAHWEH condemns people worshiping this "deity of fortune" you call "God" in Hebrew "Gad" call it what you will it is one and the same no matter how "attached" people have become to this title. I will list two verses from the THE NEW JERUSALEM BIBLE with an accurate translation of Hebrew words and names and I want you to read them slowly to understand what YAHWEH is going to do to people who worship God (Gad) and then you will understand in Revelation why YAHWEH speaks of "only a few men left" because the majority of the world is calling on this false deity "God"
    HERE THEY ARE:

    Isaiah 65:11,12 "But as for those of you who abandon YAHWEH, who forget my holy mountain, who lay the table for Gad, who fill cups of mixed wine for meni, you I shall destine to the sword and all of you will stoop to be slaughtered, because I called and you would not answer, I spoke and you would not listen; you have done what I consider evil, you chose to do what displeases me.

    *Take note "God" is a transliteration from "Gad"

    now carefully read these verses:
    Malachi 1:6-9 "The son honours his father, the slave stands in awe of his master. But if I am indeed Father, where is the honour due to me? And if I am indeed master, where is the awe due to me? says YAHWEH Sabaoth to you priests who despise my name. You ask, " How have we despised your name?" By putting polluted food on my alter. You ask, "How have we polluted you?" By saying, "The table of YAHWEH deserves no respect." When you bring blind animals for sacrafice, is this not wrong? When you bring the lame and the diseased, is this not wrong? If you offer them to your governor, see if he is pleased with them or recieves you graciously, says YAHWEH Sabaoth. IN THAT CASE, TRY PLEADING WITH GOD TO TAKE PITY ON US( THAT IS WHAT YOU HAVE DONE), AND WILL HE TAKE ANY NOTICE? says YAHWEH Sabaoth. Why does one of you not close the doors and stop the pointless lighting of fires on my alter? I am not pleased with you, says YAHWEH Sabaoth.

    *note how YAHWEH referred to the people pleading with God.

    *note "meni" in Isaiah 65:11 is "God" of fate. The hebrew G_D vowel pointed"a" "Gad" is none other than a deity of fortune that was very popular witht the "apostate jews" "and the "Teutonic peoples" that has been transliterated in English as "God" and has spread world wide. and you have just read what YAHWEH is going to do to these people.

    shalom
     
  10. SnuP

    SnuP A son of the Most High

    +9
    Non-Denom
    Dude, you missed the whole point.  You focased only on one phrased and missed the intire messege.

    Answer the question.

    Therefore if I say that Yahshua is the massiah come in the flesh, and if i confess that Yahshua is the Son of Yahweh, but I say that Yahweh is God, have I blasphemed the Most High and shown that Yahweh dwells within me and that I am of the Spirit of Yahweh?

    if you only want to agrue about simantics and not the Word of God then just say so.

    :scratch: " How have we despised your name?" By putting polluted food on my alter.

     Notice also that in you quote, they despised His name by an action, not by words.


    You have proved nothing.
     
  11. closer

    closer New Member

    38
    +0
    I must ask a simple question. When did we learn how to pronounce the name Yahweh again? The fact that it was missing for more than 2000 years makes it very difficult for anyone to call upon it. The very fact that the rabbi had lost the pronounciation leads one to think that we may still have the wrong name (remember Jehovah). I believe that that personal covenant name is important. I feel it is the greatest revelation of God outside of Jesus we could have. Do I believe that it is the only name we can call God? No. It is not even Biblical to do such. The apostles did not even do such. Sorry this idea violates Christian history from the beginning, but it also violates Jewish history as well.
     
  12. closer

    closer New Member

    38
    +0
     
     
  13. OldShepherd

    OldShepherd Zaqunraah

    +172
    Baptist
    Married
    US-Others
    And what is your point? 

    This is a false statement. Quote the verse, if you can, in which this name allegedly appears. 
     
  14. wannabe

    wannabe Member

    88
    +0
    Our Savior was HEBREW not Greek and Had a HEBREW name. which was the tradition of the traditon of carrying the Fathers' name for the purpose of meaning and distinction. "Iesous Christos" is GREEK. Any reliable source (and I'm sure you can find one) will tell you that The Greek name "Iesous Christos" is the original "Jesus Christ" It went from the Greco/Latin man made "Iesous Christos" to Latin "Iesus Christos" to English "Jesus Christ".

    people think the Greek term "Christos" is a proper translation of the HEBREW term "Mashiyah", think again...
    "Christos" means to "smear" or"rub" with oil.

    "Mashiyah" means the annointed or the appointed (to pour with oil).

    The Greeks and Ashurians held "rituals" in mythology that invloved "smearing" and rubbing" of oil. BIG DIFERENCE in meaning folks.

    "Ieso" from"Iesous" was a Greek healing God/Goddess and was the son/ daughter of "Ascpelous"

    This is a BIG chunk to chew Old Shepard, none the less "history" is now being revealed and it is ugly.

    The GREEK word "Christian" even came from the GREEK base word "Chrio", so what do you think "christians are even worshiping?

    shalom
     
  15. SnuP

    SnuP A son of the Most High

    +9
    Non-Denom
    Here is my take on the trinity, this is just a theory.

    If you take human and saperate him into his three distict parts, spirit soul and body, then you have a simplified version of the trinity. 

    Now if you take each part and multiply it by itself out to infinity.  Or untill each part develope their own spirit soul and body.  Then you have the God head. 

    Just as my flesh has the ability to touch hold and shape out side things.  So also, Jesus, being God manifested in the flesh, has this ability, but magnified, to touch all things at the same time, to uphold all things by the word of His power.  He can interact with the very molicules and even change their chemical composition. 

    Just as my soul can precieve things, make dicissions, and formulate plans.  So also, the Father has the ability, but magnified, to precieve all things, and formulate plans that affect all of mankind, and at the same time to talk to me and help me with my problems.  This would explain why Jesus said that He didn't know when His return would be, but only the Father who is in Heaven.  And why He said that He could do nothing untill He saw the Father do it.Just as my flesh doesn't know what I plan on doing, untill I do it.

    Just as my spirit has the ability to give life to the rest of my body, and impower (and lead) me to do the will of God.  So also, the Holy Spirit has the ability, but magnified, to give God's life to all and support that life in all that accept it.  To lead everyone into God's truth, and to impower them to do the will of God.  Manifesting God's power on the earth,  to glorify God by showing the signs of Jesus still manifesting on the earth.

    Just as I am incomplete without all parts so is God incomplete with out all parts.  Each part of God is not complete in itself, for each part relies on the other parts to do whatever God has desired.  This is why He is but one God.

    Again this is just a theory, but it can answer some questions.

    I thank God, that though He be so great, He has fashioned me after Himself and takes time to love me as my 'father'. :bow:   Blessed be God, the creator of Heaven and earth, and blessed be God, the big 'huggable teddy bear', that I call papa (abba father). :D
     
  16. lared

    lared Active Member

    936
    +12
    If we are made in the image of God......then has anyone seen the old movie.......The Three Faces Of Eve?

    Is that why some of you have split personalities?
     
  17. SnuP

    SnuP A son of the Most High

    +9
    Non-Denom
    I kind of thought that your post was funny.  I don't know if you meant it to be, but here's the answer to your question.

    The split personality of these people are actually demons masquerading as personas.  These poor individuals have been so tramatized by a horrific avent that their lives became filled with fear.  The fear is the open door that alows demons access.  You can cast the demons out, but as long as the fear remains they have legal ground there and will come back after you leave and will bring some buddies with them.  The proper way of dealing delivering these people is to allow Jesus to take them back to the original place of pain in their mind and work healing and love there untill all of the pain is removed.  No more pain equals no more fear.  At that point God can restore their soul to its original state.  These people can be healed, I have seen it, it is marvolous.
     
  18. lared

    lared Active Member

    936
    +12
    So it there is a trinity god......then when Jesus is praying.....he really is just talking to another aspect of himself?

    Oh.....I get it now.

    Thanks for explaining. It is so clear.
     
  19. SnuP

    SnuP A son of the Most High

    +9
    Non-Denom
    So it there is a trinity god......then when Jesus is praying.....he really is just talking to another aspect of himself?

    Oh.....I get it now.

    Thanks for explaining. It is so clear.


    Are you being sarcastic or sinciere?

    I honestly can't tell.
     
  20. wannabe

    wannabe Member

    88
    +0
    My "opinion" is he is being sarcastic. Snup, if you only knew how rediculious the trinity doctrine "foundation" began. I am not being sarcastic but really would like for your eyes to "see" the Greek corruption.
    "Christian" came from the the Greek base word "Chrio" and "Christianity" is only about 5 to 600 years old. You are NOT worshiping "Jesus Christ" Why? because this is just a "transliteration" from the GREEK name "Iesous Christos" in which whom christians are worshiping is none other than a GREEK god from the GREEK healer "Ieso'us" (Ieso)

    Christians are mislead (by the Greeks) to believe "Eve" was the first female.

    "Eve" was a Greek "Goddess" that came down to be "worshiped" in the "EVEning".

    Our first female was "Hawwah" Yes, It has always been "Adam" and "Hawwah"


    *note the Greeks also have their own bible that carries the deity "Iasus"
    "Iesus" was theGreco/Latin name of "Iesous" before it later on in time went to the English "Jesus" sounds pretty close doesn't it? "Iasus" "Iesus"
    shalom
     
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