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Featured Trees falling in the forest

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by HTacianas, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Supporter Angels Team

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    BUTT what if the tree lands on a Squirrel and it squeals??? Hmmmm

    [The philosophical hillbilly}
     
  2. Halbhh

    Halbhh The wonder and awe of His Creation! Supporter

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    Hello, welcome to CF! I was thinking as I enjoyed your post that when the homeowner notices the tree is a danger, and cuts it down, they have change the day it will fall (while I'd like to talk about whether that day was definite even in just physics before our free will actions because of quantum uncertainty, that's beside this point). God gives us the freedom to do that, to alter what would have happened without us. As I see it freedom, and all the good and bad it creates then, was necessary because love as we know of it (such as in 1 Cor 13) doesn't exist it seems except under a condition of freedom to choose. As I think of it, we are best like toddlers (and consider...100 years is such a tiny amount compared to His ages) , and the good thing is to take His hand, and let Him lead the way.
     
  3. PaulCyp1

    PaulCyp1 Active Member Supporter

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    A tree falling in the woods is determined by the force of gravity. It has nothing to do with the will of God. Does God have to "will" every raindrop to fall? No, it just happens as a result of the laws of nature. Same with a tree falling. If it falls on your house, it is the result of the laws of nature and your freely chosen location for the house.
     
  4. FireDragon76

    FireDragon76 Ship of Fools Supporter

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    That has a kernel of truth but neglects to mention that God is intimately involved with what happens in nature. He sustains and energizes all things. Nature is not some autonomous thing that exists completely separate from God.
     
  5. Ing Bee

    Ing Bee Son of Encouragement Supporter

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    What a great opportunity to explore what we mean by "God's will" and how Yahweh has expressed himself in this regard in scripture. Looking at some of the responses below, I'm not at all sure everyone is on the same definitional page.

    I think we can distort the concept of "will" into strange territory?

    For example, is it God's will that everyone uses their free will? For the sake of the example, go along with the idea that 'free will' is really that and that heavenly spiritual beings have it as do humans. Do we then lay at God's feet all the evil perpetuated throughout history by acts of free will (e.g. Stalin, Mao, etc.)?

    This reminds me of Romans 6:1 and Paul's response.

    Other considerations radically effect how we should discuss God's will. To illustrate one: as non-materialists who trust in eternal life and God's ultimate justice, Christians have a different lens for viewing disaster, death, etc. The Crucifixion of our Lord demonstrates that God brings good from evil, and the overwhelming message of the New Testament in regard to suffering and trouble is that they are unavoidable, necessary for disciples, and opportunities to display God's grace and self-giving love.

    Other questions to add to the list in the OP:
    • What is God's will for your response after your house is destroyed?
    • What is God's will for your neighbors, friends or family who have yet to received God's gift of grace as they see you suffering well and responding with gratitude for all the Lord has done for you in Christ?
    • What is God's will for the brothers and sisters in your church family as they rise to your need in self-giving love?
     
  6. Blade

    Blade Veteran Supporter

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    Sin.. the wages of sin is death. This world and man. We did this..we bought a lie and gave what GOD made ..He gave to us.. we/man listen to that lie and gave it up...for now. Like it or not believe it or not Satan has rights. He told Christ.. this was given/handed to me I can give it to whom every I want.

    Sin.. God told Israel.. if you do the same sins as those other nations the land/earth will spit you out also. All this SIN effects the earth. Gods will? One its His word. His will was BEFORE the fall..but ALL of this will work out for HIS glory and we have won.
     
  7. Tropical Wilds

    Tropical Wilds Lord, beer me strength...

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    Only man could think or question if something happening without a person there to witness it happening would be apart from the will of God.

    God’s will is God’s will, regardless of if man witnesses it or not. God is working for all, not just man.
     
  8. Jonaitis

    Jonaitis Well-Known Member

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    Everything happens by the predetermined, purpose, and will of God. Everything is in his sovereign control, even the molecules that float around can do nothing apart from God.
     
  9. david shelby

    david shelby New Member

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    Ecclesiastes 11:3 New International Version (NIV)
    3 If clouds are full of water,
    they pour rain on the earth.
    Whether a tree falls to the south or to the north,
    in the place where it falls, there it will lie.
     
  10. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

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    We do not pray "may your will be done on earth as it is in heaven" for nothing.
     
  11. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member Supporter

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  12. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    This just means it Gods will that trees grow produce seed ...die..fall and repeat.

    If it falls on your house maybe you should not have put your house under it.
    God did not put your house there, you did.
    Its not Gods will that any perish
    Yet many perish.

    Im not sure why people think God is a controller . he is quite the opposite .but he is also faithful to his word
     
  13. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    its Gods will that trees grow produce seed ...die..fall and repeat. He told them to.

    If it falls on your house maybe you should not have put your house under it.
    God did not put your house there, you did.
    Its not Gods will that any perish
    Yet many perish.

    Im not sure why people think God is a controller . he is quite the opposite .but he is also faithful to his word
     
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  14. DamianWarS

    DamianWarS Follower of Isa Al Masih Supporter

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    The Bible reveals to us God creating light and separating the light from the darkness. It, however, does not show us, God creating darkness, nor does God declare darkness as good. The creation account, where this comes from, to me has far deeper abstract notes to it then it does concrete and in it implicitly shows us that God is the author of all that is good but is not of all that is evil as well as show us that these concepts of good and evil are distinct from each other.

    if we fully zoom out God must be in control of all things but we don't really have the capacity to play at this level so we must rely on what God tells us. He tells us he is the architect of that which is good, not evil, that he is for restoration, not destruction, healing, not sickness, life not death, salvation not abandonment and light, not darkness. These are strong biblical themes and just can't be dismissed but rather need to be used to determine the focus of God's action. So in childhood cancer and tsunamis somehow God is there, but in a capacity of light overpowering darkness regardless the outcome we perceive.
     
  15. Mark Quayle

    Mark Quayle Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Reformed say, "....God ordains all things whatsoever shall come to pass." I go with that, not because they say it, but because in the end, it is the only thing that makes sense to me along those lines. And because the Bible says much that sounds the same to me.

    I'm guessing you wish to go farther with your question. Yes, it could be said, in a sense, that he caused sin, but be careful, going there. There is much that makes me feel foolish when I think that way. God does not tempt. He has nothing to do with sin. But yes, our sin, and Satan's is part of his plan.
     
  16. Tone

    Tone Star Fish Radiant

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    Would trees fall in the forest...if we didn't fall first, in the garden?
     
  17. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    God plans and executes his plans for the motion of each electron in the Cosmos.
    And He has answered your prayers as well. Even the future ones.

    Colossians 1:17
    And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

    1 Corinthians 8:6
    Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

    Ephesians 4:6
    One God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019 at 6:53 AM
  18. RaymondG

    RaymondG Well-Known Member

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    But what if we have been asking God for a new house for a while, and God found the house for you, but you are too timid to step out and go into this new house. The tree falling would then force you to step out and then your latter living situation in greater than the past.

    Would you view the tree falling as a good or bad thing in this case? Was not God still in the plan?

    WE perish for lack of knowledge and lack of belief. you believe that you grow produce seed and dies.....so you do.

    "And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

    God is omnipresent. He is in all and through all.....He is One Lord and besides Him there is no other. He is the only one that does anything......
     
  19. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    ..actually people perish because they refuse the salvation of God in JESUS.
    AND. If you go do his will. Houses will not be oc great concern to you
     
  20. RaymondG

    RaymondG Well-Known Member

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    What knowledge did you think I was referring to? Christ is the Truth.....and the Truth sets free.

    "3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
    4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
    5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;"

    "Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full"

    Who are we to tell others what they should take joy in, and what they should ask their Father?

    If you have children, would you like for others to tell them what not to ask you for?
     
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