tithe or not

[DoveEyes]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

 

[stormdancer0]

It all belongs to God. 10% given back is not too much to ask. We survive better on 90% than we ever did before we began to tithe. And we live off of my husband's disability - a family of six. I always advise that people tithe. God provides, but you have to trust Him. The more we give - money, yes, but also time, talent, etc. as well - the more He gives back. Not money necessarily, but my blessing may consist of one of my sons coming to salvation, or a healing in the family.

The question isn't "Should we tithe?" but "How much do we trust God?"

 

[Mathetes the kerux]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

Absolutely biblical . . . part and parcel of understood covenant.

 

[r035198x]

If a church decides that people should tithe then the members should try to honour that. If one is not comfortable in a tithing church and believe it to be wrong and a burden then it may be better for them to attend where they are comfortable.

Personally, I try to make sure my monthly contributions are always at least 10% of my income. They are usually more than that. This is not neccessarily out of biblical adherence because biblical tithing is much different from how people 'tithe' today. Salvation is not decided on tithing.

 

[BereanTodd]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

First off God never promises to bless us financially, we are not promised or guaranteed to be wealthy. Heck, when we open our eyes to the wider world around us we realize that in reality the poorest of us here in America is reach beyond the dreams of the majority of the world.

Now that being said, I do not believe that tithing is for the church today, but I do believe that we are called to give, to give sacrificailly, and that 10% is a good place to START. Just because I believe that tithing was a part of the covenant with Israel and is nowhere confirmed or commended for the church, does not mean that we are not called to both give and give sacrificially.

 

[Wolvrin704]

I believe tithing is absolutely biblical. God will honor our sacrificial giving, not necessarily financially but certainly in many other ways. Once my family began tithing faithfully God really began to work in our lives and favor us in so many ways.

Also its a matter of supporting your local church, staff members and ministry. The church and staff must live and operate by our donations, if we do not give the church cannot pay bills or operate and the staff must find other jobs. But most importantly without our donations ministry is much harder to accomplish without funds.

 

[stormdancer0]

<quote edited>

I am a pastor, and I do teach tithing. I am neither ignorant of the Word, nor a liar. I pay Biblical tithe every month, and we expect our church members to do so. It is not something mentioned every week, or even monthly. But it is something I teach, because the church needs to be supported by all it's members.

Unfortunately, the same ones who claim tithing as no longer valid are the very ones complaining that the pastor doesn't visit, the church isn't clean enough, and we don't have enough programs. Why is our landscaping so poor? Why are the eaves falling? Why don't the pastor get that fixed?

Well, maybe if you'd pay tithes. . . .

Our head pastor has to work an outside job as well as pastoring. He always has. But still, there are people who complain that he does not drop everything and run when someone gets sick. He works his tail off, running from his job to this one's house and that one's hospital room. But when it comes time to teach on tithing, all you hear is whining about it.

If you don't want to tithe, don't. But don't expect the pastor to drop everything and run if you need him - he'll be busy at work.

(Sorry - sore spot)

 

[lilmissmontana]

Mr. Arnold ... welcome to the forum

I thought perhaps since you're new to the forum you weren't aware of the rules of the forum ... that it would be the neighborly thing to do to point you to them. They're in the stickies at the top of the page. Non-Pentecostals may only fellowship and worship and ask questions ... this isn't a debate forum. Only Pentecostals may lightly debate and teach.

God bless
lilmiss

 

[LinkH]

<quote edited>

I am a pastor, and I do teach tithing. I am neither ignorant of the Word, nor a liar. I pay Biblical tithe every month, and we expect our church members to do so. It is not something mentioned every week, or even monthly. But it is something I teach, because the church needs to be supported by all it's members.

Do you take 10% of your crops, sell them, go to Jerusalem, and use the proceeds to buy food, wine, and strong drink-- whatever your soul lusts for, and eat them before the Lord?

Do you pay 10% of your crops and heards to support Hebrew priests and Levites?

Do you take 10% of your crops and give them to the Levites, widows, fatherless, and foreigners in the cities of Jerusalem?

Do you pay 10%, occassionally, from the spoils of war that you take from the villages and towns you attack?

This is what I see as examples of tithing in the Bible. I can't find 10% of cash income given to the local church.

Not that I am against giving that much, or more. It is good to have disciplined giving, and 10% of cash income may be a good number for a lot of people to start with. But I do not agree with twisting and allegoricalizing Old Testament laws about paying crops and herds from the land of Israel to Levites to fill up a certain fund in one's church, and telling people they are under the curse of the law if they do not do so, like many preachers have done. Pentecostals don't stand for that kind of allegorical interpretation when it comes to eschatology or other issues, but a lot sure do allegoricalize scripture when it comes to tithing.

 

[Big Drew]

I believe we should support our local church financially...not necessarily in a tithe though...since tithing is not mentioned in the New Covenant scriptures. We usually give 10 + % however...on the envelope I always check the little box that says "offering"...I guess I see this differently than many of my Pentecostal brothers and sisters...but it's just my opinion...

What I've found interesting is that it's been my experience that churches that don't mention tithing, and don't pass a plate seem to bring in more than those that do...I don't know whether or not this is the norm...just something I've noticed in the churches I've been a member in or visited frequently.

 

[stormdancer0]

Do you take 10% of your crops, sell them, go to Jerusalem, and use the proceeds to buy food, wine, and strong drink-- whatever your soul lusts for, and eat them before the Lord?

Do you pay 10% of your crops and heards to support Hebrew priests and Levites?

Do you take 10% of your crops and give them to the Levites, widows, fatherless, and foreigners in the cities of Jerusalem?

Do you pay 10%, occassionally, from the spoils of war that you take from the villages and towns you attack?

This is what I see as examples of tithing in the Bible. I can't find 10% of cash income given to the local church.

Not that I am against giving that much, or more. It is good to have disciplined giving, and 10% of cash income may be a good number for a lot of people to start with. But I do not agree with twisting and allegoricalizing Old Testament laws about paying crops and herds from the land of Israel to Levites to fill up a certain fund in one's church, and telling people they are under the curse of the law if they do not do so, like many preachers have done. Pentecostals don't stand for that kind of allegorical interpretation when it comes to eschatology or other issues, but a lot sure do allegoricalize scripture when it comes to tithing.

There is no curse for not tithing in this, the day of grace. But there are blessings coming to those who give.

Our church doesn't actually teach tithing very much. As ministers, we are expected to tithe every month, but the congregation, while encouraged to tithe, are not required to. That is between God and them.

But Yes, I do see a connection between the old system of tithing and the church today. Tithing was instated in order to offer support to the priests, who did not plant and harvest, or raise animals. They served God in the Tabernacle, and God commanded the other tribes to tithe in order to support them.

In the same way, we should tithe in order to support our pastors, and to pay the bills of the local church - electricity, heat, a/c, etc. Of course there was no cash mentioned in the OT - cash was not the primary basis for wealth then. If I had sheep, I would give sheep. If I had spices, I would give spices. What little "wealth" I have is in the form of money, so I give money.

I have found that God enables us to live much better, and do more, on the 90% we have left than we ever did on the 100% before I started tithing.

But God doesn't want someone to reluctantly give. If you can't give with joy, keep your money. God is perfectly capable of running His church without a resentful tithe.

But as I implied earlier, you cannot expect your church pastors to drop everything and help you if they are having to work an additional job because people won't support him.

 

[SplendidTree]

I think tithing is very important to show your trust to God as well as appreciation to the church. That is how the church keeps going! To me sometimes it is hard...however it feels good to tithe and help out.

 

[DoveEyes]

sorry ive been tardy about getting to the board lately. im still searching and seeking about the tithing thing.

 

[louella]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

Gosh I think I know how you feel. Sometimes when I go to churches and always hear a 2 minute talk about how we should put money down, it puts me off even if the talk is good, valid, and biblical.

I'm a struggler when it comes to tithing... which in reality, I'm a struggler when it comes to giving. And when I think about how I find it hard to give just a portion of my income, my conscience hits me, and I know that has to change. Then when I see people giving $50-$100 each week, honestly makes me feel like my $1 coin is not worth throwing in the bucket.. so I wait for the time when I have more to give. Which is so unbiblical. Coz the matter is the giving and not how much you give. I guess that's why it talks about being a joyous giver, otherwise don't give anything.

I guess now, I don't put any money down without checking my motives first. If I'm putting down money vecause I feel guilty I don't do it. If I do it because I have that $50-$100 note instead of that $1 coin I won't do it. If deep down I really don't want to give it even though I should, I won't.

But I'd really like to get to that point where I'm giving because I love God and I care for his church. Not just because it's some rule, but because I know it's a good thing to do.

 

[Yitzchak]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

There is a lot more to the subject of giving than just tithing. I think that it is difficult or impossible to fully understand tithing outside of it's full context. Many teachings and sermons are meant to be inspirational so that a person will be motivated to study the issue and seek G-d for answers.

As some posts have mentioned , the issue of trusting G-d for our finances is a huge one. All of decisions should be made on the basis of faith.

Rom 14:19 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.
Rom 14:20 For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
Rom 14:21 It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
Rom 14:22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Even neutral subjects , in and of themselves , should be seen through eyes of faith. In this case , even if a person is technically correct in their arguement that a person is not obligated to tithe , if they push someone in the direction of acting against their conscience or not acting in faith , then it becomes wrong for that person. A person's heart has to be right. We need to be pure in our heart about what our role is financially in the church.


On the other hand , leaders who try to obligate people to give by implying divine threats thrown out form the pulpit , are bordering on spiritual abuse. These subjects should be worked out in the context of relationship. Discipleship is bit by bit. There has to be a strong foundation built that can explore these types of issues.

In healthy churches , a lot of money is given by the members willingly and those in full time ministry and the poor within the church are not neglected.

If you look up the full teaching of tithing in the Old Testament , you will find that one out of three years , the tithe actually went to the poor. The idea of the tithe was for those who could work and earn wealth to share it with those who were unable to do so. Whether that inability was because of service to the Lord or another valid reason that they could not earn for themselves. If you research it out , you will find that tithing was an instruction from a loving G-d who was interested in what was fair and right.

Selfish people seeking their own interests and not sharing while others in the community struggle is not the way we are to live as Christian Communities. How this is worked out in the details is what I spoke about in the beginning part of this post.

One of the posts made a good point that if we attend a church where we believe that some should minister full time and thus not work a full time job like the rest of us , the n it would seem fair that we would share some of our extra with them rather than heaping luxeries upon ourselves while they struggle. Whether that is 10% or not is another question. And whether that should only include certain staff members and neglect the poor and other workers in the church is another question.

Church tradition has built this system of the head pastor getting a certain amount , the associate pastor a lesser amount , the children's pastor an even smaller amount , and the volunteer workers nothing. Personally , I think this goes against the spirit of the tithe. Those who sacrifice personal gain to work for The Lord should be either fully supported or partially supported according to that sacrifice. Not according to the status of their office.

But at the end of the day , unless the rest of the Christian community that is out pursuing wealth and their own dreams shares generously , there will not be enough to support the work of the ministry.

I would not argue for the tithe. I would argue for doing what is right. Meaning we all should contribute our fair share to building and maintaining our churches. Pastors should not be in the place of begging or even asking for money. But if Pastors reach the place of bullying members to give , they should look at deeper problems than the money that people are not giving.

 

[Lily_Among_Thorns]

i keep going to different churches and all i hear is give this amount, put this in the bucket, is tithing biblical for today. will we still be blessed financially if we dont tithe?

God is not your accountant, rather give to the poor and seek no reward out of it, then you will be called righteous.

 

[GodDreamer]

God is not your accountant, rather give to the poor and seek no reward out of it, then you will be called righteous.

I like what LAT said and agree with it. It's not about God blessing you or about doing it because you have to. It's about loving God and others. I do tithe, however I do not tithe to my church, if i have extra money, then i give it as an offering to the church. However I tithe my income to a friend of mine who is in financial need and in full time ministry. She uses that money so she can continue to do ministry. Now do i think everyone should do that....not necessarily...it's important to give to the church too...they also have bills and salaries to pay so they can continue to meet and serve the community.Tithing is another way to show love to one another and care of each of our needs.
I don't believe that tithing is an individual issue....it's a community issue....by not sacrificing that part of your income for the good of the Christian community, then the community is lacking in resources that can further the kingdom of God. When we give, the whole Christian community is blessed, as well as those who the church is trying to reach. Hope that makes sense.

 

[luchsgud]

I tithe because I want to, not because I have to, and I love doing it.

 

[emixt]

Just to directly answer the question asked in the OP: Yes, if we don't tithe, we're still financially blessed. I don't view the term 'financially blessed' as 'God gives us money', though: I view it as what we need that costs money, we will find a way, thanks to God giving us a way. I have absolutely no income at the moment, so I often don't even five cents in my wallet when I go to church - so I don't tithe.

However, my uni course costs a lot of money (vaccinations, uniforms, et cetera) and I still find that I'm getting the things that cost money. It's a bit chaotic and everything's coming together so close to their various deadlines that it's a little nerve-wracking, but it still happens: I needed a uniform for a particular class but I couldn't afford it, so my friend lent me a uniform. She's two sizes smaller than I, but the uniform somehow fit quite well. Immunity tests usually cost a bit of money, but today I couldn't get into the medical centre so I went to the hospital instead, and I got a test for free (well, bulk-billed). I wouldn't have gotten that if the medical centre hadn't been 'coincidentally' booked out the whazoo.

So, yes. I think we still get 'financially blessed' if we don't tithe - but 'financial blessing' doesn't necessarily mean 'monetary gain'.

 

[stormdancer0]

God is not your accountant, rather give to the poor and seek no reward out of it, then you will be called righteous.

I agree, 100%. But as I've said, if you don't support your local church and your pastor, don't expect him to drop everything and run to your side - though most will anyway. But he also may be at work, or exhausted working two jobs - pastor and a secular one - but getting paid for only one, and he may not be able to respond as quickly as you'd like.

We've lost several members because they were angered by the fact that my pastor could not take time off his job and rush to the side of their family member when she got sick. Well, maybe if people would support him with a tithe, he wouldn't have to work full-time at a second job, and he could have been there.

Just because someone has been called by God to minister at a church doesn't mean they can live off of nothing. Sorry, this is a sore spot with me. I can't tell you how many times I've heard, "Why should I tithe? What has the church/pastor done for me?" They mistakenly believe that the purpose of the church is to fulfill their needs. That's not why God created the church.