Time For This Challenge Again

[HitchSlap]

Maybe God should have just stayed out of the picture and let the Canaanites chew them up and spit them out, eh?

Well, it's as if he did.

 

[Greg Merrill]

This is why a lot of people dislike Christianity. So ignoring the implication that this would mean abortion is actually a good thing because it would guarantee that child goes to heaven. Same with all childhood deaths. But this is saying I'm doomed to burn FOREVER in a flaming lake of sulfur based on not believing. The thing that is so pernicious about that is that I don't get to choose what I believe. I'm either convinced or I'm not. So if I were to profess my belief and devotion to Jesus without first being convinced of the truth of Christianity I would be bearing false witness. So I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't, literally.

I didn't become an atheist because I wanted to. I became an atheist because none of God's followers have been able to convince me that they know what he wants of us or whether or not God even exists.

Interesting that you say "you became an atheist". God created man in such a way that he believes in God (Romans chapter 1). Some people then become professing atheists because out of rebellious thought they choose not to believe in God. You are just another piece of evidence for the validity of the Word of God. God even uses the devil for His own righteous purposes, though I would expect you to understand that.
You are wrong to make the statement "abortion is a good thing". It might guarantee the child goes to heaven, but God said not to commit murder, which is what an intentional abortion is. A baby going to heaven also misses the opportunity to choose to live for God on earth, and obtain eternal rewards for this that those that get to heaven having died as a baby won't. Just another example of an unbeliever making the wrong conclusion on abortion.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Maybe God should have just stayed out of the picture and let the Canaanites chew them up and spit them out, eh?

Oh, he gave David a choice and that was among them. The other was a three year famine.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Oh, he gave David a choice and that was among them. The other was a three year famine.

The choices were SEVEN years of famine, fleeing 3 months before his enemies, or 3 days of pestilence. 2 Samuel 24:13.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Interesting that you say "you became an atheist". God created man in such a way that he believes in God (Romans chapter 1). Some people then become professing atheists because out of rebellious thought they choose not to believe in God. You are just another piece of evidence for the validity of the Word of God. God even uses the devil for His own righteous purposes, though I would expect you to understand that.

When I say I became an atheist I mean that before I didn't think about the subject to really know what I was. After learning more I realized that I am indeed an atheist. That's why I say it like that.

So what righteous purpose is there for me and billions of other people getting sent to a burning lake of fire for eternity simply because we weren't convinced of the truth of Christianity?

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

The choices were SEVEN years of famine, fleeing 3 months before his enemies, or 3 days of pestilence. 2 Samuel 24:13.

Oh because that is so much better!

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Oh because that is so much better!

The point was why not just punish David and the woman rather than the whole kingdom?

 

[AV1611VET]

Interesting that you say "you became an atheist". God created man in such a way that he believes in God (Romans chapter 1). Some people then become professing atheists because out of rebellious thought they choose not to believe in God. You are just another piece of evidence for the validity of the Word of God. God even uses the devil for His own righteous purposes, though I would expect you to understand that.

My take on this is that Paul warns them not to embrace evolution, else they end up becoming atheists.

Notice how he words it:

Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

In other words, professing themselves to be wise men (Homo sapiens), they ended up leaving Christianity to embrace atheism.

 

[Greg Merrill]

When I say I became an atheist I mean that before I didn't think about the subject to really know what I was. After learning more I realized that I am indeed an atheist. That's why I say it like that.

So what righteous purpose is there for me and billions of other people getting sent to a burning lake of fire for eternity simply because we weren't convinced of the truth of Christianity?

You and (billions?) were made by a perfect God, in the best way possible, with a free choice, and a spirit that will exist forever. If you choose to rebel against God, as a rebel that lives forever, you are not fit for heaven and a new, righteous earth, or will you be allowed to spoil it for those that have chosen not to continue to reject the salvation God offers. A true atheist would be one that says there is no God. But to be able to "rightly" and correctly say that you would have to know what everyone else knows, and you don't, for millions KNOW that there is a God, millions on earth, and those that are presently living with Him in heaven.

 

[AV1611VET]

Oh, he gave David a choice and that was among them. The other was a three year famine.

God expected too much of them, did He?

After performing miracle after miracle after miracle, He should have just excused their sins?

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

My take on this is that Paul warns them not to embrace evolution, else they end up becoming atheists.

Notice how he words it:

Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

In other words, professing themselves to be wise men (Homo sapiens), they ended up leaving Christianity to embrace atheism.

Sorry but the scientists were more convincing than the preachers. Besides that doesn't explain all of the Christians who accept the theory of evolution.

If I were a Christian I wouldn't pit evolution against Christianity.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Oh because that is so much better!

Better or not, it is accurate, unlike your statement of a "3 yr famine." If you are wrong on the details, it is no surprise you are wrong in conclusions.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

God expected too much of them, did He?

After performing miracle after miracle after miracle, He should have just excused their sins?

Why punish a whole city for the sins of two people?

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Better or not, it is accurate, unlike your statement of a "3 yr famine." If you are wrong on the details, it is no surprise you are wrong in conclusions.

How does that detail make my line of reasoning incorrect?

 

[bhsmte]

Why punish a whole city for the sins of two people?

Fear factor. Fear helps keep people in line.

You know how it is; buy the story, or else.

 

[Greg Merrill]

Why punish a whole city for the sins of two people?

Possibly for the same reason He promised to spare cities if only 10 people could be found righteous, Genesis 18:32. All sinners deserve punishment, not just two. God is so gracious to allow anyone to live, for all have sinned, Romans 3:23 and all are born sinners.

 

[Greg Merrill]

How does that detail make my line of reasoning incorrect?

Saying this kindly, if I can't' trust you to even get the simple facts (evidence) right, why should I trust your reasoning, which is a more complex, higher level of understanding? Regardless, your reasoning is still incorrect, whether you get these facts correct or not.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Better or not, it is accurate, unlike your statement of a "3 yr famine." If you are wrong on the details, it is no surprise you are wrong in conclusions.

You and (billions?) were made by a perfect God, in the best way possible, with a free choice, and a spirit that will exist forever. If you choose to rebel against God, as a rebel that lives forever, you are not fit for heaven and a new, righteous earth, or will you be allowed to spoil it for those that have chosen not to continue to reject the salvation God offers. A true atheist would be one that says there is no God. But to be able to "rightly" and correctly say that you would have to know what everyone else knows, and you don't, for millions KNOW that there is a God, millions on earth, and those that are presently living with Him in heaven.

Everyone who doesn't accept Jesus will go to hell right? So that means all Jews, Muslims, Hindus and atheists will be wading in that lake together. I didn't choose to "rebel." How can I rebel against something I don't think exists? Show me evidence so I can make an informed choice about whether or not to worship God. According to the bible many people knew of God's existence and still rebelled. The golden calf is an example of that.

And I think some mothers are going to have heaven spoiled for them by sending their child to hell just because they didn't pick the right religion.

Atheist does not by itself mean "I KNOW there is no God." It's a blanket term that covers both Gnostic Atheists (I know there is no God) and Agnostic Atheist (I'm not convinced God exists). From what I have seen most tend to fall into the latter category, and I do as well.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Saying this kindly, if I can't' trust you to even get the simple facts (evidence) right, why should I trust your reasoning, which is a more complex, higher level of understanding? Regardless, your reasoning is still incorrect, whether you get these facts correct or not.

That's a cop out, because it does not in any way change the premises of my position. In fact being corrected on this point only strengthens my point because I mistakenly lessened the punishment God threatened.

 

[TheFriendlyAtheist]

Possibly for the same reason He promised to spare cities if only 10 people could be found righteous, Genesis 18:32. All sinners deserve punishment, not just two. God is so gracious to allow anyone to live, for all have sinned, Romans 3:23 and all are born sinners.

Don't get me started on the Sodom and Gomorrah story. I could go on all day about my objections to that.