The way of salvation

[Clare73]

This answer is unrelated to your main question about salvation. As you mention different versions of Christianity, you must have a classification of Christian branches just as you would classify Buddhism, Shenism, Hinduism, or Islam. So, here is a classification of the main branches of Christianity:
A) Non-Calvinist Christianity:
1. Greek / Eastern Orthodox.
2. Roman Catholics.
3. Non-Calvinist Protestants.

4. Non-Trinitarian groups.

B) Calvinist Christianity:
1. Calvinist Protestants.

You may think of these 2 divisions as a great vehicle and a small vehicle of Christianity. This distinction may help in your study.

1) You may think of these as one person's attempt to authorize one of the two in a so-called "division" of Christianity.
2) Non-Trinitarianism is not orthodox Christianity.
3) "Calvinist" Christianity is Reformation Christianity.

 

[hedrick]

Jesus seems to use the word in two ways, though they’re related:

• When someone turns from being opposed to God’s will to following him, Jesus says things like “salvation has come to this house.”
• Jesus often uses it to refer to “final salvation,” i.e. someone being accepted in the judgement.

He doesn’t use it in the sense many Christians do, a current state: “Are you saved?” For that Jesus speaks of being his follow, and Paul of being justified.

Jesus does actually answer your question directly. Unfortunately no major Christian tradition finds his answer acceptable. He points to the commandments. In context that seem to mean the 10 commandments, though elsewhere he summarizes the commandments as loving God and neighbor.

This answer is unacceptable to Protestants because it sounds like earning your way to salvation, whereas we think salvation is an undeserved gift. That problem can be at least partially dealt with by noting that Jesus also emphasizes God’s love for us and his willingness to forgive, and on our side, repentance. Surely he didn’t mean that we earn God’s love by perfect obedience, since humility and repentance wouldn’t be needed in that case.

A lot of traditional theology, particularly in the West, seems to say that we start out damned, because of original sin, and have to do something to get out of that. Maybe it’s baptism. Maybe it’s faith in Christ. I don’t see that in Jesus’ teaching, and not even in Paul (people find it there but I think they’re reading it into the text). We’re God’s children. We don’t have to earn his love.

But as his children, loved and forgiven, there’s still an expectation that we’ll act as his children. Jesus is not shy in talking about judgement, though given the 1st Cent context of the language he used, much of the punishment he talks about may not last forever, even though hell and its fires are spoken of as eternal. (In 1st Cent Judaism hell was eternal, but most people eventually got out of it.).

I don’t know where the boundary is. Jesus suggests that God won’t give up on anyone easily. But I suspect that there are some who are fundamentally opposed to God and his purposes.

Paul, of course, speaks of faith. But remember that /pistis/ can just as well be translated faithfulness. If you translate it as faith, it’s perhaps an older meaning of faith, as in phrases like “keep faith with.” I think you might be able to unify Paul’s perspective and Jesus’ by suggesting that there’s a sort of fundamental orientation in a person, that there’s a difference between being an imperfect follower and one of the enemy.

 

[Clare73]

Jesus seems to use the word in two ways, though they’re related:
-When someone turns from being opposed to God’s will to following him, Jesus says things like “salvation has come to this house.”
-Jesus often uses it to refer to “final salvation,” i.e. someone being accepted in the judgement.
He doesn’t use it in the sense many Christians do, a current state: “Are you saved?” For that Jesus speaks of being his follow, and Paul of being justified.

Jesus does actually answer your question directly. Unfortunately no major Christian tradition finds his answer acceptable. He points to the commandments. In context that seem to mean the 10 commandments, though elsewhere he summarizes the commandments as loving God and neighbor.

This answer is unacceptable to Protestants because it sounds like earning your way to salvation, whereas we think salvation is an undeserved gift. That problem can be at least partially dealt with by noting that Jesus also emphasizes God’s love for us and his willingness to forgive, and on our side, repentance. Surely he didn’t mean that we earn God’s love by perfect obedience, since humility and repentance wouldn’t be needed in that case.

A lot of traditional theology, particularly in the West, seems to say that we start out damned, because of original sin, and have to do something to get out of that. Maybe it’s baptism. Maybe it’s faith in Christ. I don’t see that in Jesus’ teaching, and not even in Paul

John 3:18 (unbelief "condemned already"), John 3:36 ("wrath remains" on unbelief); Romans 5:18 ("condemnation for all men")

(people find it there but I think they’re reading it into the text). We’re God’s children. We don’t have to earn his love.

But as his children, loved and forgiven, there’s still an expectation that we’ll act as his children. Jesus is not shy in talking about judgement, though given the 1st Cent context of the language he used, much of the punishment he talks about may not last forever, even though hell and its fires are spoken of as eternal. (In 1st Cent Judaism hell was eternal, but most people eventually got out of it.).

I don’t know where the boundary is. Jesus suggests that God won’t give up on anyone easily. But I suspect that there are some who are fundamentally opposed to God and his purposes.

Paul, of course, speaks of faith. But remember that /pistis/ can just as well be translated faithfulness. If you translate it as faith, it’s perhaps an older meaning of faith, as in phrases like “keep faith with.” I think you might be able to unify Paul’s perspective and Jesus’ by suggesting that there’s a sort of fundamental orientation in a person, that there’s a difference between being an imperfect follower and one of the enemy.

 

[James_Lai]

Welcome to CF! You need not read a word in scripture or seek out a particular denomination to know your Creator, Jesus Christ of Nazareth. You already know who He is. Now you just need to believe . The rest of your questions will be answered through His Holy Spirit. Blessings.

How do you believe about salvation? What it is and how one is saved?

 

[James_Lai]

This answer is unrelated to your main question about salvation. As you mention different versions of Christianity, you must have a classification of Christian branches just as you would classify Buddhism, Shenism, Hinduism, or Islam. So, here is a classification of the main branches of Christianity:

A) Non-Calvinist Christianity:
1. Greek / Eastern Orthodox.
2. Roman Catholics.
3. Non-Calvinist Protestants.
4. Non-Trinitarian groups.

B) Calvinist Christianity:
1. Calvinist Protestants.

You may think of these 2 divisions as a great vehicle and a small vehicle of Christianity. This distinction may help in your study.

Thank you. Different theologies

 

[James_Lai]

Here's a lesson from the Discipleship Course I have led over the years that is about the questions you've asked:

Discipleship Lesson 2: The Gospel of Salvation​

I. Salvation: Entering into relationship with God.

Why must one be saved?

1 John 1:5
5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all.

Psalms 5:4
4 For You are not a God who takes pleasure in wickedness, Nor shall evil dwell with You.

Romans 3:23
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Isaiah 59:2
2 But your iniquities have separated you from your God; And your sins have hidden His face from you, so that He will not hear.

John 3:19
19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

Psalms 1:5-6
5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
6 For the Lord knows the way of the righteous, But the way of the ungodly shall perish.

Ezekiel 18:4
4 "Behold, all souls are Mine; The soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine; The soul who sins shall die.

Romans 6:23
23 For the wages of sin is death...


How is one saved?

II. Repentance: Changing one’s mind.

Matthew 4:17
17 From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

Mark 1:14-15
14 Now after John was put in prison, Jesus came to Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."

Luke 5:31-32
31 Jesus answered and said to them, "Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.
32 I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance."

Acts 3:19
19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out...

Acts 3:26
26 To you first, God, having raised up His Servant Jesus, sent Him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from your iniquities."

Repentance is, at its heart, a change of mind, an alteration or amendment of one’s thinking. Is repentance always and only from sin in the Bible? No. In the Old Testament, God “repents” more than anyone else; but He does not, of course, repent from sin. Repentance, then, is not a turning away from sin. Repentance is the change in one’s thinking that gives rise to a turning away from sin. It is only as one hears the truths of the Gospel, recognizes one’s sinfulness, rebellion toward God, and need of a Saviour, and reorients one’s thinking in conformity to what one has heard – repents – that salvation is possible. This is why we see in the verses above that repentance is distinguished from and precedes believing the Gospel, conversion, and remission of sins. (Please read Addendum 3: Repentance)


III. Belief:

Romans 10:9-13
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
13 For "whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved."

John 3:3-7
3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"
5 Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'

John 3:16-18
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
18He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

John 3:36
36 He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.


IV. Confession of sin: Agreeing with God about your sin.

1 John 1:9
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

James 4:8-10
8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
9 Lament and mourn and weep! Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom.
10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and He will lift you up.

Proverbs 28:13
13 He who covers his sins will not prosper, but whoever confesses and forsakes them will have mercy.

Matthew 3:5-6
5 Then Jerusalem, all Judea, and all the region around the Jordan went out to him
6 and were baptized by him in the Jordan, confessing their sins.


From what is one saved?


Romans 6:22-23
22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life.
23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Romans 5:8-9
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.

Colossians 1:13-14
13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love,
14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

Galatians 1:3-5
3 Grace to you and peace from God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ,
4 who gave Himself for our sins, that He might deliver us from this present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father,
5 to whom be glory forever and ever. Amen.

Romans 8:2-4
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Romans 6:6-11
6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin.
7 For he who has died has been freed from sin.
8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,
9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him.
10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.
11 Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Galatians 3:13-14
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree"),
14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

To what is one saved?

John 4:13-14
13 Jesus answered and said to her, "Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again,
14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life."

John 5:24
24 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Galatians 5:13
13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.

Romans 5:1-2
1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,
2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Colossians 1:21-22
21 And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled
22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight--

What would be your own summary of what is salvation and how one is saved?

 

[James_Lai]

Saved from Hell it would seem or if one does not believe in Hell, then perhaps saved from Limbo or a long stay in Purgatory?

so you are not sure?

 

[James_Lai]

In a nutshell:

All mankind is born condemned by Adam's sin (Romans 5:18).

Salvation is from that condemnation to God's wrath (Romans 5:9) and to restored fellowship with him.

This salvation is through that mighty change of heart and mind (repentance) to faith in and trust on the person and atoning sacrifice (blood, Romans 3:25) of Jesus Christ for
the remission of your sin and right standing with God's justice; i.e.,
"not guilty," justified (declared righteous) by the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ to you (Romans 5:18-19),
and entering into a life of obedience in the Holy Spirit, leading to personal righteousness (Romans 6:16) which leads to holiness (Romans 6:19).

Is it known what’s God’s wrath?

 

[James_Lai]

Matthew 7:13 - Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, (Greek word 'apóleia' - destruction, ruin, loss, perishing; eternal ruin) and there are many who enter through it.

Strong's Greek: 684. ἀπώλεια (apóleia) -- destruction, loss

We are not only to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God (Matthew 16:16; John 8:24) but we are also to trust in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation. (Romans 1:16; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4)

Destruction is complete annihilation? No eternal soul?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

How do you believe about salvation? What it is and how one is saved?

It starts with loving your Creator. From there He will reveal Himself to you.

 

[James_Lai]

It starts with loving your Creator. From there He will reveal Himself to you.

if you evade answering, why bother posting?

 

[aiki]

What would be your own summary of what is salvation and how one is saved?

That is my summary. I wrote the lesson.

The Good News of salvation cannot be reduced to a sound-byte or meme. When people try to do so, inevitably the Gospel is distorted in some way.

 

[aiki]

The problem with trying to obtain any clear consensus on the Gospel of salvation by the means you are here, James Lai, is that what you are getting, by and large, are responses that have filtered what the Bible says through the personalities, prejudices, and experiences of your respondents. You would do better in the long run to simply search the Scriptures for yourself and let them teach you the shape of the Gospel. Go to the source.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

if you evade answering, why bother posting?

I'm guessing your not happy with the simplest way of getting your answers. You see , no amount of scripute reading will give you your answers because the condition of your heart is hardened. You just won't see it. So I'm suggesting that you check yourself first. Do you Love Him? If and when you do, He will show you the way.
Blessings.

 

[Clare73]

Is it known what’s God’s wrath?

Good questions. . .

Jesus said it is eternal punishment (Matthew 25:46).

 

[James_Lai]

I'm guessing your not happy with the simplest way of getting your answers. You see , no amount of scripute reading will give you your answers because the condition of your heart is hardened. You just won't see it. So I'm suggesting that you check yourself first. Do you Love Him? If and when you do, He will show you the way.
Blessings.

I disagree that my heart is hardened. It’s very soft and open. I’m just trying to understand. I think it’s a simple question and the Bible asks believers to readily answer to anyone asking about their faith with gentleness and respect. Or else maybe you don’t have a clear answer yourself?

Some believers aren’t really sure what they believe in, or have a vague idea about certain matters being more focused on day-to-day practical applications, which is also good.

 

[James_Lai]

The problem with trying to obtain any clear consensus on the Gospel of salvation by the means you are here, James Lai, is that what you are getting, by and large, are responses that have filtered what the Bible says through the personalities, prejudices, and experiences of your respondents. You would do better in the long run to simply search the Scriptures for yourself and let them teach you the shape of the Gospel. Go to the source.

Absolutely. I know the Bible really well. The nature of the Biblical texts is that they’re open to multiple possible interpretations. For example, by vertical and horizontal study of the synoptical Gospels (with a limited knowledge of koine Ellinika, Ivrit and historic/religious/cultural context), it seems to me that Jesus did not preach a literal hell of eternal torture, but rather annihilation for the wicked. Being thrown into Gehenna or the Valley of Hinnom seems to me to indicate cessation of existence as opposed to being resurrected to glorious life in the coming Kingdom of God. Closer to the OT teaching of death being the final destruction of the soul, as a man is the soul.

I read read read a lot a lot a lot of times and study. I don’t like cut-and-paste approach of taking verses or short passages out of context. That way almost any doctrine can be proposed.

I see different teachings as to the afterlife under the cover of the Bible. The later Egyptian/Zoroastrian/Greek ideas of duality, immortal soul, judgement, eternal hell of torture and heavenly paradise of eternal bliss and reward are an addition to the indigenous Jewish Sheol/Abraham bosom/bodily resurrection to live on the new earth Apocalyptic ideas. All syncretized and progressively developed…

H’aidis (Hades) seems to be a different place and is synonymous with a state of sleep, forgetfulness… To be thrown into the lake of fire - another act of annihilation, a total destruction once and for all

 

[Clare73]

I disagree that my heart is hardened. It’s very soft and open. I’m just trying to understand. I think it’s a simple question and the Bible asks believers to readily answer to anyone asking about their faith with gentleness and respect. Or else maybe you don’t have a clear answer yourself?

However, not all believers are teachers.

Some believers aren’t really sure what they believe in, or have a vague idea on certain matters being more focused in a fee day-to-day practical applications, which is also good.

 

[James_Lai]

However, not all believers are teachers.

Yes, but I think the idea of this Explore Christianity forum is for people trying to understand the faith better? Then if a question is asked, why answer “go with peace, God will reveal”? It’s like what James said about those who come to you needing clothing and food and you tell them “go and feed and warm yourselves”

 

[ldonjohn]

How do you believe about salvation? What it is and how one is saved?

Search for the sermon by the late Dr. John R Rice, "How to Come to Jesus?" He offers a simple explanation for "believing" the Gospel.