The Ten vs the 603

[Gary K]

Amen to the principles of the Ten Commandments! That's what we keep isn't it? The principles.

The principles are love to God and love to man. Thus they include obedience to all 10 of His commandments as well as loving others as ourselves.

 

[Leaf473]

The principles are love to God and love to man. Thus they include obedience to all 10 of His commandments as well as loving others as ourselves.

Well, that may be where we see it differently. I believe that the 10 and the other 603 are all fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself.

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

Well, that may be where we see it differently. I believe that the 10 and the other 603 are all fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself.

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

I guess of you want to accept the philosophy Pharisees as binding that's what you need to do.

 

[Leaf473]

I guess of you want to accept the philosophy Pharisees as binding that's what you need to do.

I have no idea what you're saying there. Please explain, if you wish

 

[Gary K]

I have no idea what you're saying there. Please explain, if you wish

The Pharisees believed their salvation was based upon their line of descent. So they thought their salvation was earned by their dna. They had no room for Jesus in their hearts for the idea that it was the power found in Jesus to set them free from the power of sin and so multiplied their rules many times over.

 

[Leaf473]

The Pharisees believed their salvation was based upon their line of descent. So they thought their salvation was earned by their dna. They had no room for Jesus in their hearts for the idea that it was the power found in Jesus to set them free from the power of sin and so multiplied their rules many times over.

Okay... and how does that apply to this?

Well, that may be where we see it differently. I believe that the 10 and the other 603 are all fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself.

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

Okay... and how does that apply to this?

Find any verse in the Bible that says it is not OK to rob openly which strongly implies it is OK to rob secretly.

 

[Leaf473]

Find any verse in the Bible that says it is not OK to rob openly which strongly implies it is OK to rob secretly.

I don't think there is a verse.

 

[Gary K]

I don't think there is a verse.

There isn't. It's an invention of the Pharisees.

 

[Leaf473]

There isn't. It's an invention of the Pharisees.

Okay... Do you want to explain more, or just leave it there?

 

[Gary K]

Okay... Do you want to explain more, or just leave it there?

I thought by now you would have understood this with all the stuff I've posted from the Talmud and from the Jew who became an SDA. But here goes, again, for about the third time,

The Talmud was not scripture but it was what the Pharisees followed far more than the Bible. They held themselves up as God to the people. They taught that they must be believed even though they said a person's left hand was their right hand they must be believed. And it they weren't the person who didn't believe them was to be excommunicated. That was a very serious thing back them for the person was ostracized from all Jewish society and from worshiping in the temple. They were as ostracized as much as a leper except they didn't have to announce themselves as unclean.

 

[Gary K]

I thought by now you would have understood this with all the stuff I've posted from the Talmud and from the Jew who became an SDA. But here goes, again, for about the third time,

The Talmud was not scripture but it was what the Pharisees followed far more than the Bible. They held themselves up as God to the people. They taught that they must be believed even though they said a person's left hand was their right hand they must be believed. And it they weren't the person who didn't believe them was to be excommunicated. That was a very serious thing back them for the person was ostracized from all Jewish society and from worshiping in the temple. They were as ostracized as much as a leper except they didn't have to announce themselves as unclean.

Here is a quote from F.C Gilbert's book, The Jewish Problem. It's from a chapter titled, THE LONG-LOOKED-FOR HOUR ARRIVES.

FOR well-nigh four centuries the voice of a true prophet
of God had not been heard in the land of Israel. Only once
before during the many centuries of Israel's covenant rela-
tion with God had there been so long a period when Israel
heard not the voice of the seer. The words of the psalmist
doubtless were in the minds of many of the people : "We see
not our signs : there is no more any prophet : neither is there
among us any that knoweth how long." Ps. 74 :9.
The self-appointed leaders of Israel were busy discuss-
ing technicalities of Scripture. They gave much thought
and study to the writings of Moses, not so much to follow his
teachings, as to avoid what he taught. They discussed the
Sabbath, the tithe, the feasts, the sacrifices, and other subjects
upon which instructions had been given the nation through
the great prophet ; but the purpose of these discussions was to
add to or diminish from them, rather than to obey them.
Nevertheless, they were bent on being disciples of Moses.
Many of the teachers claimed that Moses should have in-
structed their forebears in counsel that he left unspoken; they
often inserted what to them were the omissions. Those
teachings which they considered not clear, they amplified and
exaggerated, until the original instruction given their an-
cestors by the prophets of Israel was darkened and well-nigh
obliterated.
The teachings of the prophets were interpreted variously.
Some of the wise men asserted that the prophecies must not
be considered literally; they were allegorical, they were para-
bolic, they were mystical, they were visionary. The real
meaning of the prophets' forecast depended upon the scholarly
ability of the expositor. Nevertheless, there were hundreds
in Israel who had faith to believe that the teaching of the
seers should be literally understood.
Certain outstanding men advocated that Messiah would
come as predicted by the prophets. However, other teachers
maintained that the interpretation of many of those Mes-
sianic prophecies was applicable only to the Jews. The
people of Israel would benefit by His advent. The Gentiles,
or heathen, would have no share in the glory which Messiah
would bring to Israel; for the prophet Isaiah had written:
"Thy people also shall be all righteous : they shall inherit
the land forever, the branch of My planting, the work of My
hands, that I may be glorified." Isa. 60 :21.
Said the rabbi: Israel was God's people. The Lord chose
no other nation but the descendants of Abraham; therefore
when Messiah came, all the glory and the manifestation of
His power were for the children of the covenant. Rome
would be destroyed; the heathen would bow down to Israel;
the land of Israel would be the glorious resting place for the
sons of the covenant ; and never again would they be removed
out of the land.

 

[Leaf473]

I thought by now you would have understood this with all the stuff I've posted from the Talmud and from the Jew who became an SDA. But here goes, again, for about the third time,

The Talmud was not scripture but it was what the Pharisees followed far more than the Bible. They held themselves up as God to the people. They taught that they must be believed even though they said a person's left hand was their right hand they must be believed. And it they weren't the person who didn't believe them was to be excommunicated. That was a very serious thing back them for the person was ostracized from all Jewish society and from worshiping in the temple. They were as ostracized as much as a leper except they didn't have to announce themselves as unclean.

I believe I understand that, but how does it relate to this?

Well, that may be where we see it differently. I believe that the 10 and the other 603 are all fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself.

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

I believe I understand that, but how does it relate to this?

Is it loving to rob your neighbor secretly?

 

[Leaf473]

Is it loving to rob your neighbor secretly?

No, it isn't loving to secretly rob your neighbor.

Nor is it loving to secretly slander them.

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 101:5 - New American Standard Bible

Whoever secretly slanders his neighbor, him I will destroy; I will not endure one who has a haughty look and an arrogant heart.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

No, it isn't loving to secretly rob your neighbor.

Nor is it loving to secretly slander them.

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 101:5 - New American Standard Bible

Whoever secretly slanders his neighbor, him I will destroy; I will not endure one who has a haughty look and an arrogant heart.

www.biblegateway.com

Then how is it loving to not rob someone openly? The inventions of the Pharisees have nothing to do with loving God or our fellow man. Unless you think being a Pharisee is a good thing I don't understand your objections.

 

[Leaf473]

Then how is it loving to not rob someone openly?

It is loving to not rob someone openly or secretly, because that's how I want to be treated as well.

Did you definitely mean to have the "not" in there?

The inventions of the Pharisees have nothing to do with loving God or our fellow man.

I don't understand what the Pharisees have to do with

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

Unless you think being a Pharisee is a good thing I don't understand your objections.

No, I don't think that being a Pharisee is a good thing.

One thing I object to is the idea that we have to keep only the Ten Commandments, that there is nothing in the other 603 that apply to us today.

Another thing that I object to is the idea that the Ten Commandments are the only moral commandments in the law of Moses.

Yet another thing I object to is that there is a reasonable, scriptural way to divide up the law of Moses into today and yesterday.

Does that help?

Peace be with you, my man

 

[Leaf473]

Unless you think being a Pharisee is a good thing I don't understand your objections.

Another objection would be to this idea in an earlier post

The principles are love to God and love to man. Thus they include obedience to all 10 of His commandments as well as loving others as ourselves.

God gave the Israelites more than 10 Commandments

Bible Gateway passage: Leviticus 27:34 - New American Standard Bible

These are the commandments which the LORD commanded Moses for the sons of Israel on Mount Sinai.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

It is loving to not rob someone openly or secretly, because that's how I want to be treated as well.

Did you definitely mean to have the "not" in there?



I don't understand what the Pharisees have to do with

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

No, I don't think that being a Pharisee is a good thing.

One thing I object to is the idea that we have to keep only the Ten Commandments, that there is nothing in the other 603 that apply to us today.

Another thing that I object to is the idea that the Ten Commandments are the only moral commandments in the law of Moses.

Yet another thing I object to is that there is a reasonable, scriptural way to divide up the law of Moses into today and yesterday.

Does that help?

Peace be with you, my man

I definitely meant to have the not in the sentence as the law I was quoting was to not rob openly.

The Pharisees broke the law to love our neighbors as ourselves law every day. It was the sure result of their teachings.

The law involved in the Sabbath is:

Deuteronomy 6: 4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:
5 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

If we do not love God supremely we cannot love our neighbor as ourselves. And if we love God supremely we will not object to keeping His commandments which includes the Sabbath. If we do that we object to Him ruling over our lives.

 

[Leaf473]

I definitely meant to have the not in the sentence as the law I was quoting was to not rob openly.

The Pharisees broke the law to love our neighbors as ourselves law every day. It was the sure result of their teachings.

The law involved in the Sabbath is:

Deuteronomy 6: 4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:
5 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

If we do not love God supremely we cannot love our neighbor as ourselves. And if we love God supremely we will not object to keeping His commandments which includes the Sabbath. If we do that we object to Him ruling over our lives.

Are there any commandments other than the 10 involved in Deuteronomy 6:4? Any other commandments from the 603?