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BiffBuffering

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Hi, All.

Galatians 6:15
It doesn’t matter whether we have been circumcised or not. What counts is whether we have been transformed into a new creation.

Romans 2:28
For you are not a true Jew just because you were born of Jewish parents or because you have gone through the ceremony of circumcision.

1 Corinthians 7:19

Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi, All.

Galatians 6:15
It doesn’t matter whether we have been circumcised or not. What counts is whether we have been transformed into a new creation.

Romans 2:28
For you are not a true Jew just because you were born of Jewish parents or because you have gone through the ceremony of circumcision.

1 Corinthians 7:19

Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

Hi BB, wecome to CF! Great post. nice and simple but full of truth.

God bless
 
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Bob S

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Hi, All.

Galatians 6:15
It doesn’t matter whether we have been circumcised or not. What counts is whether we have been transformed into a new creation.

Romans 2:28
For you are not a true Jew just because you were born of Jewish parents or because you have gone through the ceremony of circumcision.

1 Corinthians 7:19

Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.
Hi Biff, Welcome to the fray, well not quite, but sometimes it does get a little heated. I welcome your response.

There are a whole lot of commands given by God throughout the ages. Are you able to know which commandments Paul is referring? Seems like, at least on this forum, it becomes a pick and choose what seems to fit ones agenda. You, being SDA, are focused on the Sabbath command. I, being a former SDA and now a new covenant believer, am focused on what is taught in the New Testament. One of my favorite passages concerning the subject is found in 1Jn 3:19-24. It starts out like this "19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth" Then it goes on to tell us what the truth is. The truth is: "believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us." That is the theme of the new covenant Jesus gave to all mankind at Calvary. I especially revere the book of John because he portrays the greatest theme in all of scripture, LOVE. In the New Testament rituals are not the theme like in the Old Testament. There were so many ritual laws in the old covenant that it seems like everything else was diminished. Sure they were important to the Israelites for many reasons. In the New covenant love is most important. Without love we will perish just as Israel did. Lack of love breeds sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. Gal 5

As a SDA my mind was fixated all week on preparing for the up coming Sabbath. Love was not foremost in my mind. Trying to get my Sabbath observance perfect was paramount. After all this is what the prophetess books hammered in my head. The same with sermons and Sabbath school topics. Everything seemed to revolve around the keeping of a ritual that was given only to one nation in all the World. Everything else was secondary. I knew in my mind that I was a complete failure just like those Israelites. The prophetess wrote that not one in twenty SDAs are ready to receive the gift of salvation, so since I knew I couldn't "keep" the ritual even tough I cried out to Jesus for help and that led me to start studying for myself, without the "books", to see what the scriptures said about the beliefs I had espoused.

I pray that all my SDA friends will do the same and continue to allow the Holy Spirit, as I did, to lead me.
 
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Bob S

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No, the new covenant does not abolosh Gods' 10 commandments it establishes them in those who are born again *1 John 3:6-9; John 2:3-7 by a new heart to love by faith in God's promises according to the scriptures *Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10; Matthew 22:36-40; James 2:8-10; Romans 3:31. Salvation is from sin (breaking God's commandments or not believing his Word; 1 John 3:4; Romans 14:23), not salvation to continue in sin *John 8:31-36 and sin is defined in the scriptures as the transgrassion of God's law *1 John 3:4 as through the law is the knowledge of what sin is *1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20 and according to God's Word in the new covenant if we knowingly break anyone of God's 10 commandments or do not believe and follow his Word we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11; James 4:17; Romans 14:23. Sin, therefore as defined in the scriptures as breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments and not believing and following his Word (1 John 3:4; Romans 14:23), according to the scriptures, is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:9-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12 and Revelation 22:14.

HEBREWS 4:9 THEREFORE IT REMAINS FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD TO KEEP THE SABBATH

Hope this is helpful
Once again a bunch of scripture not related to proving the writer was referring to the ten commandments. You can imply all you want with verses that do not, in any way, tell us it is the ten that they are referring. Wake up LGW and prove your point.
 
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BiffBuffering

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Hi Biff, Welcome to the fray, well not quite, but sometimes it does get a little heated. I welcome your response.

There are a whole lot of commands given by God throughout the ages. Are you able to know which commandments Paul is referring? Seems like, at least on this forum, it becomes a pick and choose what seems to fit ones agenda. You, being SDA, are focused on the Sabbath command. I, being a former SDA and now a new covenant believer, am focused on what is taught in the New Testament. One of my favorite passages concerning the subject is found in 1Jn 3:19-24. It starts out like this "19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth" Then it goes on to tell us what the truth is. The truth is: "believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us." That is the theme of the new covenant Jesus gave to all mankind at Calvary. I especially revere the book of John because he portrays the greatest theme in all of scripture, LOVE. In the New Testament rituals are not the theme like in the Old Testament. There were so many ritual laws in the old covenant that it seems like everything else was diminished. Sure they were important to the Israelites for many reasons. In the New covenant love is most important. Without love we will perish just as Israel did. Lack of love breeds sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. Gal 5

As a SDA my mind was fixated all week on preparing for the up coming Sabbath. Love was not foremost in my mind. Trying to get my Sabbath observance perfect was paramount. After all this is what the prophetess books hammered in my head. The same with sermons and Sabbath school topics. Everything seemed to revolve around the keeping of a ritual that was given only to one nation in all the World. Everything else was secondary. I knew in my mind that I was a complete failure just like those Israelites. The prophetess wrote that not one in twenty SDAs are ready to receive the gift of salvation, so since I knew I couldn't "keep" the ritual even tough I cried out to Jesus for help and that led me to start studying for myself, without the "books", to see what the scriptures said about the beliefs I had espoused.

I pray that all my SDA friends will do the same and continue to allow the Holy Spirit, as I did, to lead me.
Strange how people's lives while seeming to follow the same trajectory for so long can turn out so different in the end. I'm really sorry about your experience as an Adventist. I honestly look forward to the Sabbath much like I did Christmas as a child. I get to go on a little drive and see church family members, and the presence of God in the house of assembly is way better than my Grandparents', as thrilling as that was. Naturally, since I love Jesus, I want to improve my Christian conduct but I don't worry about being perfect in my Sabbath-keeping. I just see obedience as a thank offering. I don't believe it affords any merit towards the favor of God or towards salvation at all. That's all on Jesus. Only He is worthy of our salvation, right?
 
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BiffBuffering

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There were so many ritual laws in the old covenant that it seems like everything else was diminished.
But weren't they a loving God's way of dealing with mankind at the time they were in place?
I thought the book of Hebrews says that the fault with the old covenant lie with the people?
 
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Bob S

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But weren't they a loving God's way of dealing with mankind at the time they were in place?
I thought the book of Hebrews says that the fault with the old covenant lie with the people?
Of course it was. That doesn't take away the fact that their lives were complex. Why would Jesus tell them to come unto Him for their rest? It was because their burdens were heavy under the law. The Israelites had to observe the Sabbath in an entirely different way than how you say you observe it. SDAs do not observe the Sabbath according to the commandment. If you don't then why even try? I can go for a little ride any day and visit anyone I want any day. I cannot understand why you would think that doing those things is anymore special on Saturday than on any other day. It is obvious that you don't follow Is 58:13 ‘If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the Lord’s holy day honourable,
and if you honour it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, 14 then you will find your joy in the Lord, and I will cause you to ride in triumph on the heights of the land and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.’

I want you to know I certainly am not chastising you for the way you observe the Israelite Sabbath. We have to do what we believe is pleasing to God. I happen to believe God never required a gentile to observe the special day He gave to Israel. The New Testament doesn't teach Gentile Christians Sabbath observance, no requirement and no instructions.

Please do not feel sorry for my experience as an Adventist. Adventists are fine people and I had great times in fellow shipping and by the way still do plus I learned much from belonging.

You wrote the following: "I don't believe it affords any merit towards the favor of God or towards salvation at all." I presume "it" means Sabbath observance. Are you aware of what the SDA church teaches regarding the Sabbath? Do you believe in the writings of Ellen White? She wrote:
It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." {6T 356.4}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

Israel could not have been saved by observance of any of the commandments. Salvation is by God's grace and is and always has been, a gift to those who believe and have faith. Paul wrote over and over that man is not saved by anything he can do. Man is saved by what Jesus did.

Friend, Ellen's theory is salvation by works in Toto. You may not believe it and I hope you don't, but if the church is honest it should tell you everything it believes. I couldn't support something I didn't believe. Ellen White is the guiding light when it comes to the teachings of the SDA church. Her writings are the final word.

Thanks for answering my post.

 
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BiffBuffering

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Are you aware of what the SDA church teaches regarding the Sabbath?
44 years after baptism you would think so. It's been a joyous experience for me. But I don't understand why God's people would need rest from something He gave them out of love. I thought the rest Christ gives is from the weight of the guilt of sin and from the junk the Pharisees piled on top of the Tanakh.

And Ellen White is most definitely the lesser light when it comes to the teachings of the church. I've studied that much out quite thoroughly. The amount of time spent on Ellen White in Evangelism averages about 1-in-50. That hardly seems to amount to guiding light to me. Much of the Evangelism we do are 7 to 10 night programs that contain nothing at all about her. I barely knew who she was when I was baptized. I've read practically everything she wrote since, and I don't find legalism taught anywhere.

Romans 2:13
For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.

To me, this just means that those who are saved by grace will naturally want to be obedient to God. Simple, right?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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LoveGodsWord said: No, the new covenant does not abolosh Gods' 10 commandments it establishes them in those who are born again *1 John 3:6-9; John 2:3-7 by a new heart to love by faith in God's promises according to the scriptures *Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10; Matthew 22:36-40; James 2:8-10; Romans 3:31. Salvation is from sin (breaking God's commandments or not believing his Word; 1 John 3:4; Romans 14:23), not salvation to continue in sin *John 8:31-36 and sin is defined in the scriptures as the transgrassion of God's law *1 John 3:4 as through the law is the knowledge of what sin is *1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20 and according to God's Word in the new covenant if we knowingly break anyone of God's 10 commandments or do not believe and follow his Word we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11; James 4:17; Romans 14:23. Sin, therefore as defined in the scriptures as breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments and not believing and following his Word (1 John 3:4; Romans 14:23), according to the scriptures, is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:9-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12 and Revelation 22:14. HEBREWS 4:9 THEREFORE IT REMAINS FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD TO KEEP THE SABBATH
Your response here...
Once again a bunch of scripture not related to proving the writer was referring to the ten commandments. You can imply all you want with verses that do not, in any way, tell us it is the ten that they are referring. Wake up LGW and prove your point.
Hi Bob. The scriptures provided above in the post you were quoting from proves the points being made as they are Gods' Word not mine. All your post does here is disagree with the scriptures provided which are your words and not Gods. Why do you disagree with the scriptures shared with you?
 
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Bob S

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44 years after baptism you would think so. It's been a joyous experience for me. But I don't understand why God's people would need rest from something He gave them out of love. I thought the rest Christ gives is from the weight of the guilt of sin and from the junk the Pharisees piled on top of the Tanakh.
I don't understand why God had the man that picked up sticks stoned to death. That was not "junk". Why is the Sabbath any less important today. Where does it tell the Israelites that now it is okay to pick up sticks on the Israelite Holy day. God was not kidding then, so what is any different now? If I thought the Sabbath is binding on all mankind today I certainly wouldn't be dishonoring it by doing my own pleasure, but the fact is when I believed the Sabbath was binding I did try to keep it Holy. My desire was to please God, but I failed every week. I could not keep my mind on Holy topics. I initiated conversations that caused others to also fail. When Joe came into the church lot, on Sabbath, with his new car my mind forgot everything except my desire to get one too. Yes, I was very serious about pleasing God and Sabbath was a drag that continued to pull me down. Mrs White wrote that not one in twenty SDAs are ready for an eternal reward. Not even one in twenty. Where did that leave me? When I finally discovered that Jesus fulfilled the laws of the Sinai covenant and gave all mankind the new and better covenant you better bet I rejoiced. I was not bound to observe a day that I failed to keep for forty years. It seems like SDAs today are not interested in upholding the laws that God gave to the Israelites. They have made up their own standards as what is right to do on Israelite Holy day. I worked in an Adventist hospital and had, at times, Sabbath duties. I saw employees doing work that made me cringe. It was like any other day for them yet the church teachings are that if one doesn't "keep" the Sabbath they will loose their eternal life. Well, I could go on and on and I guess if SDAs consciences do not bother them then all is bliss. Maybe I tried too hard.


And Ellen White is most definitely the lesser light when it comes to the teachings of the church. I've studied that much out quite thoroughly.
I take issue with your statement. The teaching are there, but the members most definitely choose not to take them seriously. Studying and putting what you have learned into action are two different things.

The amount of time spent on Ellen White in Evangelism averages about 1-in-50. That hardly seems to amount to guiding light to me.
Wow! that is amazing since every member takes a vow to uphold Ellen when they join the church:
Spirit of Prophecy[edit]
The church believes the spiritual gift of prophecy was manifested in the ministry of Ellen White, whose writings are sometimes referred to as the "Spirit of Prophecy". The church's 28 Fundamental Beliefs state: "her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested."

That indicates that the church is trying to hide her under a bushel. The co-founder of the remnant is now becoming obsolete? Is the church becoming ashamed of her?

Much of the Evangelism we do are 7 to 10 night programs that contain nothing at all about her. I barely knew who she was when I was baptized. I've read practically everything she wrote since, and I don't find legalism taught anywhere.
That sounds like they snagged you and then started to feed you the meat of their teachings.

Romans 2:13
For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous.

To me, this just means that those who are saved by grace will naturally want to be obedient to God. Simple, right?
Obey the law. Please tell us what law Paul is referring. Immediately SDAs will believe it is the ten commandments, but is that what Paul is indicating? Sure I want to obedient to God. God made a covenant with Israel, He did't make that covenant with their ancestors nor did He make it with any other nation. The covenant laws were for Israel alone. Gentile nations were never asked to keep the ritual laws given to Israel. How did the Sabbath law become salvational for Gentiles and Christians? Need I be obedient to a law that God never expected me to observe? How about the laws concerning feast days. SDAs don't observe them, why? Were they not part of the ''law"?

Since you posted Rom 2:13 allow me to use it to compare it with the Sabbath practices of the membership. The Sabbath laws leave no leeway as to how they are to be observed. I know that SDAs are hearers of the law, but are they obeying the Sabbath requirements? When it comes to the law lip service does not get it.
 
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BiffBuffering

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I don't understand why God had the man that picked up sticks stoned to death. That was not "junk". Why is the Sabbath any less important today. Where does it tell the Israelites that now it is okay to pick up sticks on the Israelite Holy day. God was not kidding then, so what is any different now? If I thought the Sabbath is binding on all mankind today I certainly wouldn't be dishonoring it by doing my own pleasure, but the fact is when I believed the Sabbath was binding I did try to keep it Holy. My desire was to please God, but I failed every week. I could not keep my mind on Holy topics. I initiated conversations that caused others to also fail. When Joe came into the church lot, on Sabbath, with his new car my mind forgot everything except my desire to get one too. Yes, I was very serious about pleasing God and Sabbath was a drag that continued to pull me down. Mrs White wrote that not one in twenty SDAs are ready for an eternal reward. Not even one in twenty. Where did that leave me? When I finally discovered that Jesus fulfilled the laws of the Sinai covenant and gave all mankind the new and better covenant you better bet I rejoiced. I was not bound to observe a day that I failed to keep for forty years. It seems like SDAs today are not interested in upholding the laws that God gave to the Israelites. They have made up their own standards as what is right to do on Israelite Holy day. I worked in an Adventist hospital and had, at times, Sabbath duties. I saw employees doing work that made me cringe. It was like any other day for them yet the church teachings are that if one doesn't "keep" the Sabbath they will loose their eternal life. Well, I could go on and on and I guess if SDAs consciences do not bother them then all is bliss. Maybe I tried too hard.



I take issue with your statement. The teaching are there, but the members most definitely choose not to take them seriously. Studying and putting what you have learned into action are two different things.


Wow! that is amazing since every member takes a vow to uphold Ellen when they join the church:
Spirit of Prophecy[edit]
The church believes the spiritual gift of prophecy was manifested in the ministry of Ellen White, whose writings are sometimes referred to as the "Spirit of Prophecy". The church's 28 Fundamental Beliefs state: "her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested."

That indicates that the church is trying to hide her under a bushel. The co-founder of the remnant is now becoming obsolete? Is the church becoming ashamed of her?


That sounds like they snagged you and then started to feed you the meat of their teachings.


Obey the law. Please tell us what law Paul is referring. Immediately SDAs will believe it is the ten commandments, but is that what Paul is indicating? Sure I want to obedient to God. God made a covenant with Israel, He did't make that covenant with their ancestors nor did He make it with any other nation. The covenant laws were for Israel alone. Gentile nations were never asked to keep the ritual laws given to Israel. How did the Sabbath law become salvational for Gentiles and Christians? Need I be obedient to a law that God never expected me to observe? How about the laws concerning feast days. SDAs don't observe them, why? Were they not part of the ''law"?

Since you posted Rom 2:13 allow me to use it to compare it with the Sabbath practices of the membership. The Sabbath laws leave no leeway as to how they are to be observed. I know that SDAs are hearers of the law, but are they obeying the Sabbath requirements? When it comes to the law lip service does not get it.
Did I mention I've been an Adventist for 44 years now? Of course, evangelism is different now than it was when I was baptized at 12 years old. There were no 28 fundamental beliefs and there wasn't an official set of baptismal vows, unless my local conference had gone rogue.

Respectfully, after reading back through this thread it becomes apparent to me that a further discussion along these lines would result in repetitive, argumentative tit-for-tat, which is something I look upon with great dread. It seems likely that you'll say I'm conceding to your view of the situation, but my reputation here is of no consequence. I didn't come here to contend ad nauseum with a single individual who is obviously diametrically opposed to what I believe and practice. I came for fellowship and friendly discussion about doctrine. I've enjoyed becoming briefly acquainted with you, but it appears there is a great gulf fixed between us.

God Bless.
 
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Your response here...

Hi Bob. The scriptures provided above in the post you were quoting from proves the points being made as they are Gods' Word not mine. All your post does here is disagree with the scriptures provided which are your words and not Gods. Why do you disagree with the scriptures shared with you?
Hi LGW,
Have you noticed that the tendency to claim God gave the Sabbath to Israel only never carries over into the new covenant being given to Israel only?
 
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I came for fellowship and friendly discussion about doctrine.
Brother, happy Sabbath! Have you considered my point of view on the Sabbath? Can you see, as our people saw it from the beginning, that the first day in Genesis is from the first light to light again in the morning at sunrise, and the days after from morning to morning until the first Sabbath from morning to morning? As the church thought about this for 8 years, simplified was the matter to Israel's instructions and what Genesis reveals was forgotten. It is time to visit the overlooked truth in Genesis that simplified what is more complicated. We have not fully understood the truth about the Sabbath revealed in God's word that our prophetess told us that we would understand more in the future.

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi LGW,
Have you noticed that the tendency to claim God gave the Sabbath to Israel only never carries over into the new covenant being given to Israel only?
Hi Biff this is an interesting study if you follow both the old and new testament scriptures through.
Take a look at this here linked and let me know your thoughts?

God bless
 
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Bob S

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Did I mention I've been an Adventist for 44 years now? Of course, evangelism is different now than it was when I was baptized at 12 years old. There were no 28 fundamental beliefs and there wasn't an official set of baptismal vows, unless my local conference had gone rogue.
Hi Biff, You were six years old when My wife and I joined the church. There were twenty seven fundamental beliefs at that time. We had to agree to accept all of them before we could be baptized. I wonder why you were not introduced to all of them. I presume you were raised in an Adventist family and probably knew all of the beliefs.

I write on the forum to inform SDAs and others of what I have learned since I started seeing cracks in the foundation of the church. Those cracks are so large that I could not continue to do personal evangelism and support the church. I couldn't belong to an organization that I didn't fully believe. Many "lurkers" read our posts and I feel the need to inform them of what they might be getting into if they decide to join and inform members that have no idea of the other side of the issue. SDAs have accused me of everything imaginable when I expose the things I have gleaned since finding those cracks.

I see that you are not interested in debating the issues. At least you know that there is another side and I wish you well.

Respectfully, after reading back through this thread it becomes apparent to me that a further discussion along these lines would result in repetitive, argumentative tit-for-tat, which is something I look upon with great dread. It seems likely that you'll say I'm conceding to your view of the situation, but my reputation here is of no consequence. I didn't come here to contend ad nauseum with a single individual who is obviously diametrically opposed to what I believe and practice. I came for fellowship and friendly discussion about doctrine. I've enjoyed becoming briefly acquainted with you, but it appears there is a great gulf fixed between us.
No, there are no winners or losers as far as I am concerned. I do not believe any of us have all the answers. We are all sinners saved by the grace of Jesus our Savior. Adventist tell us they are the only true church and that makes it a debatable issue. I hope you understand and do not feel like I have built a barrier. You are a brother or sister in Christ. I glory in that fact. In Christ, Bob
 
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Hi Biff, You were six years old when My wife and I joined the church. There were twenty seven fundamental beliefs at that time. We had to agree to accept all of them before we could be baptized. I wonder why you were not introduced to all of them. I presume you were raised in an Adventist family and probably knew all of the beliefs.

I write on the forum to inform SDAs and others of what I have learned since I started seeing cracks in the foundation of the church. Those cracks are so large that I could not continue to do personal evangelism and support the church. I couldn't belong to an organization that I didn't fully believe. Many "lurkers" read our posts and I feel the need to inform them of what they might be getting into if they decide to join and inform members that have no idea of the other side of the issue. SDAs have accused me of everything imaginable when I expose the things I have gleaned since finding those cracks.

I see that you are not interested in debating the issues. At least you know that there is another side and I wish you well.

No, there are no winners or losers as far as I am concerned. I do not believe any of us have all the answers. We are all sinners saved by the grace of Jesus our Savior. Adventist tell us they are the only true church and that makes it a debatable issue. I hope you understand and do not feel like I have built a barrier. You are a brother or sister in Christ. I glory in that fact. In Christ, Bob

In all due respect, we have had many discussions over the years I do not believe what your presenting is biblical Bob. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
 
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pasifika

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In all due respect, we have had many discussions over the years I do not believe what your presenting is biblical Bob. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
Hello LGW, maybe others here believe in some of what Bob is presenting to be Biblical.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hello LGW, maybe others here believe in some of what Bob is presenting to be Biblical.
Today many believe in traditional Christianity over biblical. For me though only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it *Romans 3:4; Acts of the Apostles 5:29. Jesus warns us about this in Matthew 15:3-9. What do you think those scripture is talking about? I believe God is calling His people where ever they are to come out from following the religious teachers of today and return back to the pure Word of God. BABYLON has fallen it is time to come out. God is calling but who will hear? Many are called but few will be chosen.
 
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pasifika

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Today many believe in traditional Christianity over biblical. For me though only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it *Romans 3:4; Acts of the Apostles 5:29. Jesus warns us about this in Matthew 15:3-9. What do you think those scripture is talking about? I believe God is calling His people where ever they are to come out from following the religious teachers of today and return back to the pure Word of God. BABYLON has fallen it is time to come out. God is calling but who will hear? Many are called but few will be chosen.
Hello LGW, Romans 3:4 state that ONLY God is TRUE, and EVERY HUMAN BEINGS (that’s you and me) being a Liars..
Regarding Matthew 15:3-9, you cannot find in the OT man made traditions written down....Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees and teacher of the law of things they teach not written down in the Law or Prophets (OT)..

Yes many are called and few will be chosen...so the One who called us is also the One who chose us...
 
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Bob S

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In all due respect, we have had many discussions over the years I do not believe what your presenting is biblical Bob. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
Ditto! LGW. I felt the same way toward other churches when I was a SDA. I was programmed and thought all other church were "Babylon". Our pastor preached that the World would end before 1965 and it was a sin to cook peas on the Sabbath. Funny that is what I gleaned from him that I can remember. I remember the sermons I hear now. Jesus saves and love our fellow man.
 
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