The reason for homosexuality

[Jameskind]

Men, I want it made perfectly clear that I know there are men who are saved and Christ will someday see them face to face. I feel in my heart Christ completely understands the hurt in mens lives and understands why they reach out to other men in an attempt to validate a need in their life. For years I wanted to know what it really meant to be loved by another man. Sexualizing it I just never got enough and the longer you are in that type of relationship the more difficult it is to find freedom. (speaking for myself) It is like a whirlpool and the further you wade in the current gets stronger and stronger until you are in the vortex and pulling you down. I can tell you I was in that vortex and pulled right down to the bottom and somehow Christ pulled me out of it. Praise Jesus!! I believe all of my prayers and crying out to the Lord somehow was a part of His plan for my testimony. I am in a support group of men who also have tremendous testimonies of how Christ has worked in their life. Yes most of us had at least one relapse and there was times that it was like taking 2 steps forward and 3 steps back. I am being honest. Satan will not just quit and give up and go the other way. Satan absolutely knows how successful he has been in attacking men in areas of sexual sin. Not just SSA but everything else as well and that Churches and Christen men sit on their hands and do little if anything to reach out to US who have had such a painful life. I also believe in my heart that Christ is very hurt by this and that is why I have committed to serving him in this ministry. I have a very good friend who we have spent years hunting, fishing and enjoying the outdoors together. Yes he is a Christian and I can tell you he had a whole different attitude toward homosexuality until I was able to share my lifes story with him. I know there are a lot of Christian men who have or had this struggle in there life and have never told anyone about it. For those still struggling I know the pain you feel and so does the Lord! Keep your eyes on Jesus, pray, be in his word every day and find a mens group who have been there and can walk with you as a band of brothers. For those men who refuse to believe that they can experience what God's plan is in a healthy sexual relationship as He designed. I will assure you that someday you will know the truth. I have gone on long enough.... Guys, if you have a minute goggle the picture of Christ entitled "Forgiven". It is a man collapsed in the arms of Jesus. I have a copy of it in my wallet. Jesus loves you and so do I.

 

[faithfulmark]

Check out the recent thread about Homosexuality in the genes!

 

[soulfinder]

I am against homosexuality.

It is against God's law.

I have posted two or three threads on this.

Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Brieuse]

UberLutheran:
Very Interesting.
And Congratulations on 17 years in a committed relationship.

I lived in Homosexuality for 25+ years.
it was alway's about one night stands and selfish lusts.
I see many posts from gay men in relationships that are alway's on the look-out for play partners.
So if your in a monogamous loving relationship, where both of you truely love one another, then God Bless You.

But for me, it alway's felt like SIN!
I alway's felt Dirty.
Maybe I have issues or maybe I was never really gay?

Im 42 now and gave my life to christ.
Im torn apart by this whole gay/ anti-gay issue.
I could love a woman, be in a relationship with one and be faithful.
But why does the idea of Sex without love with a group of men still arouse me????
I don't want to marry a man or have a loving relationship with one.
the idea is kind of gross to me.
Im pretty messed up, I want the love of a good woman, to be faithful to her.
never cheat on her with another woman.
But, I get these desires to have sleazy relationships with a large group of men????
God tells me its a sin. through his word the bible and the holy ghost makes me feel like its a sin, by giving me great shame and guilt.
I hope I can work this out.
Currently Im not acting out on the sinful temptations.
I did at one time, but am fighting it off.

Be strong, God can can give you that strength

Are you attracted to women?

 

[Der Alte]

Check out the recent thread about Homosexuality in the genes!

Bintheredunthatgotthetshirtdontfit. The articles does NOT say what you claim it does.

 

[faithfulmark]

Ya, your right.

But lets weigh the evidence before we conclude that it is not true. THey published their results because all of their studies point to the theory that there is a "gay gene." First you have twins that are gay, implying that both inherent ed the same gene.
In the new study, scientists analyzed DNA from pairs of brothers, both of whom were gay, in nearly three dozen families with a history of homosexuality on the mother's side. Focusing on the female X chromosome that men inherit from their mother (they also get a male Y from their father), the researchers found that two-thirds of the gay siblings shared a distinctive pattern along a segment of their X chromosome. Scientists say the possibility is remote that this genetic pattern would appear by chance.

You have gays who have prayed, hoped, and begged God to help them with their sexuality. The commit suicide for the reason "they have failed God."

Many gays will tell you that there is not a cure and will never be a cure. They have tried so much to stop, but it no avail.

What are your thoughts on all of this?

 

[ReformedChapin]

Ya, your right.

But lets weigh the evidence before we conclude that it is not true. THey published their results because all of their studies point to the theory that there is a "gay gene." First you have twins that are gay, implying that both inherent ed the same gene.
In the new study, scientists analyzed DNA from pairs of brothers, both of whom were gay, in nearly three dozen families with a history of homosexuality on the mother's side. Focusing on the female X chromosome that men inherit from their mother (they also get a male Y from their father), the researchers found that two-thirds of the gay siblings shared a distinctive pattern along a segment of their X chromosome. Scientists say the possibility is remote that this genetic pattern would appear by chance.

You have gays who have prayed, hoped, and begged God to help them with their sexuality. The commit suicide for the reason "they have failed God."

Many gays will tell you that there is not a cure and will never be a cure. They have tried so much to stop, but it no avail.

What are your thoughts on all of this?

Again I want to see a study that indicates this with all the samples.

Scientist can say whatever they want in the studies in sexuality and I wont care. Several of these studies have come in the past declaring the "gay gene" and have been falsified.

 

[faithfulmark]

Again I want to see a study that indicates this with all the samples.

Scientist can say whatever they want in the studies in sexuality and I wont care. Several of these studies have come in the past declaring the "gay gene" and have been falsified.

Please give me resources showing the scientists have falsified information. Thats a huge claim.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Please give me resources showing the scientists have falsified information. Thats a huge claim.

Sure, just look at the other thread that I posted.

here's the article if you want to look at it straight from this post

 

[faithfulmark]

Great, you showed me an article that says science has proved nothing. We all agree on that. Yet we must agree that they also have reasonable reasons for posting theories on the matter. This article has not showed the bias you claim scientists have.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Great, you showed me an article that says science has proved nothing. We all agree on that. Yet we must agree that they also have reasonable reasons for posting theories on the matter. This article has not showed the bias you claim scientists have.

It showed how scientist used flawed data..how does NOT show they are biased?

You sure you read the article?

 

[faithfulmark]

It is funny how you will dismiss all scientists as biased, yet one someone from "family and culture" institute posts something, you accept it as fact.

I'm not saying it is not true, but look at what I'm saying.

 

[ReformedChapin]

It is funny how you will dismiss all scientists as biased, yet one someone from "family and culture" institute posts something, you accept it as fact.

I'm not saying it is not true, but look at what I'm saying.

ROFL

Obviously you didn't read my post when I said they are subjected to their biases as well. Talk about being biased and misrepresenting me. So sad, so very sad. Keep defending sin with your low tactics, it will get you no where no matter how much you attack me.

 

[faithfulmark]

You may be consciously aknownledging what us gay-supporter are saying, but you are sub-consciously throwing them out of your brain. Listen to what I say. PEOPLE KILL THEIR SELVES BECAUSE THEY CANNOT QUIT! They have tried for years, praying, repenting, EVERYTHING! They cannot quite. Bottom line. Accept it. There are def people who can overcome, but this does not account for everyone. You must understand this.

You dismissed this asking for proof. I showed proof from CNN. You must aknowledge this and take it into consideration. Also take into the considerations that scientists in their reports are saying "The chances are remote that this happens by accident." when they speak of family lines and gays.

 

[ReformedChapin]

You may be consciously aknownledging what us gay-supporter are saying, but you are sub-consciously throwing them out of your brain. Listen to what I say. PEOPLE KILL THEIR SELVES BECAUSE THEY CANNOT QUIT! They have tried for years, praying, repenting, EVERYTHING! They cannot quite. Bottom line. Accept it. There are def people who can overcome, but this does not account for everyone. You must understand this.

You dismissed this asking for proof. I showed proof from CNN. You must aknowledge this and take it into consideration. Also take into the considerations that scientists in their reports are saying "The chances are remote that this happens by accident." when they speak of family lines and gays.

Again...CNN is not a reliable source of information.

Secondly, if people are killing themselves they have greater issues to deal with than with homosexuality. They can live celibate lives battling their sins like the rest of us.

Scientist have been known to fake data and are subject to flaws as clearly stated before. Even other secular scientists will tell you that.

You got nothing...Zero. You need to stop attacking me about how I'm not "accepting facts" because there is NO Facts. I suggest you wake up and accept the Gosple, not liberal arguments which are deeply flawed.

 

[UberLutheran]

UberLutheran:
Very Interesting.
And Congratulations on 17 years in a committed relationship.

I lived in Homosexuality for 25+ years.
it was alway's about one night stands and selfish lusts.
I see many posts from gay men in relationships that are alway's on the look-out for play partners.
So if your in a monogamous loving relationship, where both of you truely love one another, then God Bless You.

But for me, it alway's felt like SIN!
I alway's felt Dirty.
Maybe I have issues or maybe I was never really gay?

Im 42 now and gave my life to christ.
Im torn apart by this whole gay/ anti-gay issue.
I could love a woman, be in a relationship with one and be faithful.
But why does the idea of Sex without love with a group of men still arouse me????
I don't want to marry a man or have a loving relationship with one.
the idea is kind of gross to me.
Im pretty messed up, I want the love of a good woman, to be faithful to her.
never cheat on her with another woman.
But, I get these desires to have sleazy relationships with a large group of men????
God tells me its a sin. through his word the bible and the holy ghost makes me feel like its a sin, by giving me great shame and guilt.
I hope I can work this out.
Currently Im not acting out on the sinful temptations.
I did at one time, but am fighting it off.

Not to minimize anything you just said — and I really, truly appreciate the honesty which came with your post!

Your desires for sleazy relationships with a large group of men sounds sort of like why occasionally I want a pint of sweet cream vanilla ice cream, even though I'm a brittle diabetic (my blood sugar can vary hundreds of points in a day).

It's kind of like, "I don't CARE if I'm an insulin-dependent diabetic, NOBODY is going to tell me what I can or cannot eat!"

Never mind the fact that I'm sick for two days after ingesting that much sugar!

And then there's the guilt which comes with doing such a self-destructive action. I do know the feeling you described in your post!

Gay people, straight people, diabetics, whomever — we all get caught up in this thing of, "I'm going to run my life the way I want to!" — and sometimes, God teaches us the lesson by getting out of the way and letting us run right into the wall of our own choosing!

I had to learn, and come to terms with the fact that I hated the feeling of loss of control which came with regulations on what I could or could not eat. I can only speculate (and I'm not a trained therapist!) maybe that could be what is going on with you?

I found talking with a Christian therapist very helpful in my case. It might be something you might want to explore.

 

[Der Alte]

If homosexuality is NOT genetically determined, how come identical twins always have the same sexual orientation? (Kallmann, F. J. 1952. Comparative Twin Study on the Genetic Aspects of Male Homosexuality. J. Nerv. Ment. Dis. 115:283-298)

Is this for real? A 55 year old “study,” which OBTW you have never seen, that has been thoroughly trashed by recent research.

What we got here is a failure to communicate. Some men you can't reach, that is they just don't listen when you talk reasonable so you get what we had here last week, which is the way he wants it, well he gets it, and I don't like it any better than you men.​

Here is proof beyond any doubt or argument, now or ever, that homosexuality, whatever it may or may not be, it is NOT genetic. End of story!

Bailey and Pillard (1991): occurrence of homosexuality among brothers

52% of identical (monozygotic) twins of homosexual men were likewise homosexual
22% of fraternal (dizygotic) twins were likewise homosexual
11% of adoptive brothers of homosexual men were likewise homosexual

J.M. Bailey and R.C. Pillard, “A genetic study of male sexual orientation,” Archives of General Psychiatry, vol. 48:1089-1096, December 1991

http://www.worldpolicy.org/globalrights/sexorient/twins.html

Better research, however, was based on twins who were recruited for other reasons, and only subsequently asked about their sexual orientation. These are known as "registry" studies, and they similarly gave a concordance rate between identical twins of less than 50%. There have been two major published registry studies (4,5), one based on the Minnesota Registry, the other on the Australian Registry. The larger of the two registry studies is the Australian one, done by Bailey, Martin and others at the University of Queensland. Using the 14,000+ Australian twin collection, they found that if one twin was homosexual, 38% of the time his identical brother was too. For lesbianism the concordance was 30%. Whether 30% or 50% concordance (snowball samples), all the studies agree it is clearly not 100%.

The critical factor is that if one identical twin is homosexual, only sometimes is the co-twin homosexual. There is no argument about this in the scientific community.

http://www.narth.com/docs/whitehead2.html

The distribution of sexual orientation among cotwins of the monozygotic probands appeared to be bimodal. In other words, most subjects classified themselves as heterosexual or homosexual, with very few giving evidence of significant bisexuality. This finding is in agreement with other recent studies (e.g. Buhrich et al. 1991).
According to their data, 52% (29/56) of monozygotic cotwins, 22% (12/54) of dizygotic cotwins, and 11% (6/57) of adoptive brothers were homosexual. Heritabilities of homosexuality were calculated using these results under a wide range of assumptions of the population base rate and ascertainment bias. Under all conditions considered, heritabilities were substantial (h2 was between .31 and .74 in all cases). However, "the rate of homosexuality among nontwin biological siblings, as reported by probands, 9.2% (13/142), was significantly lower than would be predicted by a simple genetic hypothesis and other published reports."

http://www.tim-taylor.com/papers/twin_studies/studies.html#sotmtsoh

Bailey-Pillard

In December of 1991, Michael Bailey of Northwestern University joined Richard Pillard of the Boston University School of Medicine in publishing a study of homosexuality in twins. Their conclusion is that sexual orientation is something one is born with.

Bailey and Pillard surveyed homosexual men about their brothers, and they found some statistics that were rather unexpected. Of the homosexuals who had identical twin brothers, 52 percent of those twins were also homosexual. 22 percent of those who had fraternal twins said that their twin was gay, and only eleven percent of those who had adopted siblings said that their adopted brothers were also homosexual.

Bailey and Pillard attributed the differences in these percentages to the difference in the amount of genetic material shared. Since identical twins have the same genetic code, they are far more likely to share sexual orientation than fraternal twins. In the same way, it is obvious that fraternal twins have more in common genetically than do their adopted siblings.

http://www.leaderu.com/orgs/probe/docs/homosex1.html
​

 

[UberLutheran]

Again...CNN is not a reliable source of information.

For what reason?

Please don't tell me that CNN is "liberal": CNN is "Fox-Lite" and I consider CNN to be every bit as unreliable and biased as Fox.

 

[RMDY]

That's where you're wrong... barring the fact that even if we were all in the garden that some of us would pbly still be gay... assuredly some of the animals would be gay... it is natural behavior.

There is no indication that homosexuality in the Garden of Eden.

 

[RMDY]

Any kind of sex in the brown log hole is disturbing...