The question cessationists must answer.

[Francis Drake]

I think you are conflating two things, both called prophecy.

Sorry, but I don't understand what you mean.

I don't think Dave is saying that God leaves us directionless but for Scripture; he admits to the indwelling and eye-opening and guidance of the Holy Spirit.

In reality, Dave denies that.
He admits to the indwelling spirit, but denies visions etc, so it could never be called "eye opening"
Dave also constantly insults those who hear the voice of that Holy Spirit.
Thus by his own proclamation, Dave is both blind and deaf, a great example of the blind leading the blind. Lol

I also think you will admit that there is danger in the acceptance of any and all "signs" as from God. Aaron wasn't the only one whose rod turned into a snake.

I have never said that and do not believe it.
Look at my previous posts and you will see me calling for discernment in understanding of both prophetic words, and bible teaching.

 

[Anto9us]

We Continuationists do not hear voices in our heads telling us that "that which is PERFECT has come";
look around, nothing is complete, perfect, or mature like we expect things to be when it's REALLY over...

It aint over til it's over
- Yogi Berra

 

[W2L]

That's YOUR answer; how do you know that's the reason?

What other reason could there be? healing those kids would glorify God, causes men to repent, and heal children too. Why not do that?

 

[NBB]

No, I say God speaks through love and tells us which way to go according to that. We do not hear voices in our heads like you read about every so often.

With the Holy spirit is more like a little touch from him in your inside that let you know something, not a voice in your head. But the point is that you are saying that God is incapable of communicating with humans, why mute God if he was never like that before?
And you are limiting God in his interaction with us with this cessationism, because he can't even order us to do something.

 

[W2L]

Sorry about the double post.

 

[Anto9us]

from Chuck Smith's commentary on C2000 Series on Acts 1-2 by Chuck Smith

"What promise? The promise that God made to pour out His Spirit on all flesh. Who is it for?

It's for you, and it's for your children, and to all that are far off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call (Act 2:39).

No mention of just being good for the apostolic period, but on down through the church ages. "As many as the Lord our God shall call."

So I ask again -- was the Lord DONE with CALLING PEOPLE at the time that "the perfect' was alleged to have COME by the Cessationists? Nobody being CALLED now?

If THE PROMISE was over with, modern Christians do NOT have a Baptism in the Holy Spirit

 

[Anto9us]

And you are limiting God in his interaction with us with this cessationism, because he can't even order us to do something.

Yep. They have got the Holy Ghost IN A BOX -- and won't let Him out!

 

[Strong in Him]

Acts does not show the Charismatic Gifts dispersed in any other way than the two outpourings and through an apostle's hands. You add to scripture to say otherwise.

Acts doesn't cover every event and conversion in the church, even then; never mind now.
1 Corinthians 12, Romans 12 and Ephesians 4 say that the Spirit gives gifts to the church.
The church is still present on earth - where does it say that the Spirit has stopped giving gifts and helping God's children to serve him?

Christians today have gifts from the Spirit to serve God -fact. If you are saying that such gifts, like prophecy and tongues, are fraudulent, then you are saying that they are not from God.
What did Jesus say about attributing the works of God to the devil? (You didn't use those words, but if something's not from God, there's only one other source it can be from.)

 

[swordsman1]

With the Holy spirit is more like a little touch from him in your inside that let you know something, not a voice in your head. But the point is that you are saying that God is incapable of communicating with humans, why mute God if he was never like that before?
And you are limiting God in his interaction with us with this cessationism, because he can't even order us to do something.

Where in scripture does God communicate by a 'a little touch in your inside'? Prophecy was never described as simply being a feeling. It was always "Thus says the Lord...". What could be more dangerous than someone being told they have a 'word from the Lord' for them and thus being compelled to obey it when really it was nothing more than a feeling.

 

[Strong in Him]

What other reason could there be? Healing sick kids would glorify God, causing men to repent and follow the Lord, and would heal sick kids. Why wouldn't they heal them if they could?

Firstly, it's God who heals, not humans.
Secondly, you seem to be saying, "Lord it MUST be your will for all the sick to be healed. These people aren't being healed physically, therefore healing doesn't exist and is not possible today." That's illogical. What of all the people who have been miraculously healed by God? We don't always understand why God does things or lets them happen. Struggling with questions and doubt is one thing; flatly denying that God is working and healing today, is
another.

 

[Anto9us]

Act 18:24
And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
Act 18:25
This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.
Act 18:26
And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.

I take this to mean that Apollos had not got the Ghost yet when he came to Ephesus -- but that Aquilla and Priscilla (both "non-apostles", right?) got Apollos beyond just the Baptism of John -- so the tripe about "only an apostle can initiate the giving of the gifts" falls to the ground.

 

[NBB]

What other reason could there be? Healing sick kids would glorify God, causing men to repent and follow the Lord, and would heal sick kids. Why wouldn't they heal them if they could?

I don't know what to think but i think Jesus did not go to where the sick were to heal everyone, or the bible do not mention it? or at least most people in the bible went to him to get help.

 

[W2L]

Firstly, it's God who heals, not humans.
Secondly, you seem to be saying, "Lord it MUST be your will for all the sick to be healed. These people aren't being healed physically, therefore healing doesn't exist and is not possible today." That's illogical. What of all the people who have been miraculously healed by God? We don't always understand why God does things or lets them happen. Struggling with questions and doubt is one thing; flatly denying that God is working and healing today, is
another.

I agree with another poster who said that the gifts were meant to be signs.

The true healing isn't physical but is from sin and death which is described as a disease in scripture. Thats my personal opinion.

 

[Hillsage]

The above has no cut off date, and was given before the cross, and still applies after the cross and after Pentecost.
The promise is still in force and available to all those who ask.

Scriptural proof confirming what you say, with a bit of clarification;

The "promise" 'of the' Holy Spirit in Acts 2:39 was not 'the Holy Spirit', it was 'supernatural power' FROM the Holy Spirit that was manifested. The Greek word for "of the" is the same in 2 Cor and it does not mean you received "the Lord" or "the Holy Ghost" when you received their "grace" and "communion";

2CO 13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

That same Greek word is used below;

ACT 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the (Gr. from) Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

ACT 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

So those today who also manifest that which was "seen and heard" on the day of Pentecost were also candidates to receive because they were believers who were "afar off and called of God."

So also, "the promise of the Father" wasn't the person of the Father or the person of the Holy Spirit which was given, it was the PROMISE from the Father which was "POWER" from the Holy Spirit. That's what Jesus said it would be before Pentecost.

LUK 24:49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

Those today who refuse to believe are simply in the category of being spiritually "UNGIFTED" by their own doctrinal confession of disbelief.

1CO 14:23 Therefore if the whole church assembles together and all speak in tongues, and ungifted men or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are mad?

 

[NBB]

Where in scripture does God communicate by a 'a little touch in your inside'? Prophecy was never described as simply being a feeling. It was always "Thus says the Lord...". What could be more dangerous than someone being told they have a 'word from the Lord' for them and thus being compelled to obey it when really it was nothing more than a feeling.

I'm not a prophet, or something, i describe what happens to me only, obviously if you are going to pay attention to everything that tells you something spiritually then you will start to listen to God knows what, you need to test if it is truly the Holy spirit.

 

[W2L]

I don't know what to think but i think Jesus did not go to where the sick were to heal everyone, or the bible do not mention it? or at least most people in the bible went to him to get help.

Scripture says that He healed the sick wherever He went.

 

[NBB]

Scripture says that He healed the sick wherever He went.

Ok, i don't know. The bible still mentions believers will heal praying for the sick, alongside casting out demons speaking in tongues etc.

 

[Strong in Him]

I agree with another poster who said that the gifts were meant to be signs.

The true healing isn't physical but is from sin and death which is described as a disease in scripture. Thats my personal opinion.

I can tell you for a fact that I was healed physically, overnight after prayer.

 

[Francis Drake]

What bothers me is that cessationists say God doesn't speak at all, you have only the bible, why make such an annoying statement? He spoke in the entire OT and NT why stop now?
If God can't speak, then you have no guidance in things that are not covered by the bible, which is a lot of things, the Holy spirit can't remind you of Jesus words like the bible said becuase he is mute now, he can't call anyone to minister, since nobody will get notified by God... etc etc etc...

Amen, cessationists love to celebrate their blindness and deafness.

I have lived over 50 years of hearing the Lord speak to me in one way or another. I love his quiet, still small voice whispers, words of direction, his visions etc.
Why do these arrogant people constantly rant against the voice of His Holy Spirit?

They are doing exactly what Adam did in the Garden of Eden, exalting their own knowledge above life in the spirit.

 

[Anto9us]

Act 19:2
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

I understand what you are saying, Hillsage, making distinction between POWER of HS and HS Himself --
but in Acts 19:2 no such distinction is made.

Also verses like that one show that sometimes getting the Ghost happened AFTER salvation - not simultaneous with it as at Cornelius' house, where those believers were Spirit-baptized before they were water baptized...

The Holy Ghost is WILD and does what He wants to.