The question cessationists must answer.

[Hillsage]

You have a way with words! And yes, we HAVE to wait on the Holy Spirit when ministering and do what He shows us!

There is a lot that I share which has come from personal revelation from God. So many things done by 'rote', as taught by those spiritual fathers, on whose shoulders we stand....just don't work. Those things always bother me, sometimes to the point that I would have to diligently "seek/knock" for sometimes years before the Spirit of truth would reveal something I now cling to more tightly than the "doctrines and commandments of men". Am I error-less in my theology? I'm sure that I'm not. But since I don't know where I'm wrong I am inclined to not change either. So I'll just keep believing what I do until His enlightenment comes.

 

[swordsman1]

Edit: I guess Paul didn't get the memo! He raised a Gentile from the dead.

That was because Paul was a miracle working apostle, not just a regular disciple of Christ like you and I.

 

[Deborah D]

Matthew 13:13--"For this reason I speak to them in parables, because looking they do not see, and hearing they do not listen or understand."

Edit: I guess Paul didn't get the memo! He raised a Gentile from the dead.

Edit 2: This is what happened in Ephesus--"God was performing extraordinary miracles by Paul’s hands, so that even facecloths or work aprons that had touched his skin were brought to the sick, and the diseases left them, and the evil spirits came out of them." (Acts 19:11-12)

Oh, but you're going to say that Paul wasn't a "disciple." Right?

Edit: Ha! I was right. Your last post came in right before mine. Maybe you're "just a regular disciple," but I'm not!

 

[Deborah D]

There is a lot that I share which has come from personal revelation from God. So many things done by 'rote', as taught by those spiritual fathers, on whose shoulders we stand....just don't work. Those things always bother me, sometimes to the point that I would have to diligently "seek/knock" for sometimes years before the Spirit of truth would reveal something I now cling to more tightly than the "doctrines and commandments of men". Am I error-less in my theology? I'm sure that I'm not. But since I don't know where I'm wrong I am inclined to not change either. So I'll just keep believing what I do until His enlightenment comes.

We're ALL waiting to know fully even as we are fully known!

 

[Deborah D]

So, SM, I answered your question. Now you answer mine. What did Jesus mean by this: "I assure you: The one who believes in Me will also do the works that I do. And he will do even greater works than these, because I am going to the Father."

 

[Alithis]

Do you only go to the lost sheep of Israel to heal the sick, raise the dead, and cast out demons, and not the Gentiles, as Jesus commanded the twelve?

reply in this quote below

of course in reality Jesus told the disciples to do the great commission and the great commission says .. teaching THEM to do ALL i have commanded you .. which included the command of the great commission ... PROVING IRREVOCABLY the great commission is to ALL believers . but its not for the cessationist because . they don't believe it .

added reply -your saying or trying to say that Jesus only sent his disciples to the jews ..ONLY. but he did that at an earlier time because the way of salvation had not yet been made op to ALL men .. he had to die and rise again first.

LATER AFTER HE ROSE again.. he says the GREAT commission and you MUST note what he says as it contradicts everything YOU'VE been saying ...
--- ..."Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”.... "

yup you read it i put it in RED.. "of ALL NATIONS ....

 

[Alithis]

The Great Commission is to make disciples of ALL nations. These are the sheep "not of this fold" in John 10:16--"But I have other sheep that are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock, one shepherd." His sheep are His followers; His disciples are His followers....

emphasis ..on // OF ALL NATIONS .. not the jews only as they are mistakenly trying to present

 

[Deborah D]

reply in this quote below

added reply -your saying or trying to say that Jesus only sent his disciples to the jews ..ONLY. but he did that at an earlier time because the way of salvation had not yet been made op to ALL men .. he had to die and rise again first.

LATER AFTER HE ROSE again.. he says the GREAT commission and you MUST note what he says as it contradicts everything YOU'VE been saying ...
--- ..."Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”.... "

yup you read it i put it in RED.. "of ALL NATIONS ....

SM is stuck on what Jesus said to the 12 at that time. He's not considering everything Jesus said. It's a form of spiritual constipation. He needs prayer!

 

[swordsman1]

So, SM, I answered your question. Now you answer mine. What did Jesus mean by this: "I assure you: The one who believes in Me will also do the works that I do. And he will do even greater works than these, because I am going to the Father."

Well 'the works' cannot be miracles as charismatics like to think. The gift of miracles was a gift that not every Christians had (1 Cor 12:30). Yet this verse applies to all believers. Can every believer walk on water, turn water into wine, feed 5000 from five loaves and two fish, raise the dead etc? let alone greater miracles than these. So ‘works’ here cannot be miracles. More likely it is the propogation of the gospel. Eg Peter converting 3000 in one day. That is the concensus view among commentators.

 

[Alithis]

SM is stuck on what Jesus said to the 12 at that time. He's not considering everything Jesus said. It's a form of spiritual constipation. He needs prayer!

you did not just say .. spiritual constipation..?! hahahaha .
but you correct in that they are dissallowing for time line .that what Jesus said first ,at THAT time BEFORE his Crucifixion.. is fully reversed AFTER his Resurrection. but that has been pointed out to them now, so they cant use that and have ANY credibility. so lets hope they be honest and drop that argument too .

 

[swordsman1]

reply in this quote below

added reply -your saying or trying to say that Jesus only sent his disciples to the jews ..ONLY. but he did that at an earlier time because the way of salvation had not yet been made op to ALL men .. he had to die and rise again first.

LATER AFTER HE ROSE again.. he says the GREAT commission and you MUST note what he says as it contradicts everything YOU'VE been saying ...
--- ..."Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”.... "

yup you read it i put it in RED.. "of ALL NATIONS ....

But we are not talking about the Great Commission. We are talking about the commandment to "Go nowhere among the Gentiles...but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel...and "heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse lepers, cast out demons" (Mat 10:5-8), which you said you obeyed.

 

[Hillsage]

Jesus said, "I assure you: The one who believes in Me will also do the works that I do. And he will do even greater works than these, because I am going to the Father." This is what I live by.

I was at a men's retreat in New Mexico a month ago. We were having a time of intense worship when I felt like He was speaking "a word" to me. It so impacted me that I got up from kneeling on the floor and sit in my chair to type what He said in my phone, which was; "I said you would do greater things than I. The reason you will be able to do so, is because you will have access to the authority I never had until I was given 'the name above every name'".....after my resurrection!"

Hopefully you know scripture well enough to know more than just what He said. I was jubilated and shared it with several brothers (MEN'S retreat sis ) One of which was our pastor, and one other was the lead pastor of the retreat. He was from the mega church who put on this retreat which our little church was one of many invited. Upon sharing it and understanding the impact of it he looked and me and said; "Man THAT'S from God!" and again, I believe
As candidates now so shall WE then stand , as those who 'believe and obey on that glorious day'.

I'm done for tonight. God be on you.

 

[Alithis]

But we are not talking about the Great Commission. We are talking about the commandment to "Go nowhere among the Gentiles...but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel...and "heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse lepers, cast out demons" (Mat 10:5-8), which you said you obeyed.

are you going to be so belligerent as to ignore Jesus said that to them well before his Resurrection and after his Resurrection he gave the great commission to the SAME MEN .. i mean really? surely you have the intellectual capability to differentiate between two different things at two different times ...
the great commission is exactly what we are talking about

 

[swordsman1]

are you going to be so belligerent as to ignore Jesus said that to them well before his Resurrection and after his Resurrection he gave the great commission to the SAME MEN .. i mean really? surely you have the intellectual capability to differentiate between two different things at two different times ...
the great commission is exactly what we are talking about

You said Jesus commanded "us" to heal the sick, raise the dead, cast out demons, etc. He didn't give that command at the Great Commission. He said that in Matt 10 to the Twelve. And in the same command he said go to the Jews only, and not the Gentiles.

 

[W2L]

The Holy spirit still fills and guide christians among other things, you are in the 'ignorant' part of the side, and believing because of that that is a lie what we say, because you have not experienced this.

I believe in Gods Spirit guiding us. He guided me away from the WOF teachers.

 

[Alithis]

You said Jesus commanded "us" to heal the sick, raise the dead, cast out demons, etc. He didn't give that command at the Great Commission. He said that in Matt 10 to the Twelve. And in the same command he said go to the Jews only, and not the Gentiles.

read matt 28 ..pleas .. this is getting embarrasing .. in it he tells the great commission
and yes it pops your bubble completley ...

he tell them to go to ALL nations ..not only the jews and he tells them as recorded across the gospel accounts .. to make more disciples (of ALL nations) teaching them to observe ALL Jesus commanded them .. and he commanded the great commission thus we are also to learn to do the great commission and to make more disciples of Jesus teaching them also to observe ALL Jesus commanded .and in ACTS we see they begin with the Jews then the lord specifically send peter and later Paul .. to the gentiles and they do MANY signs and wonders among the gentiles also and they convert and then they learn into the next generation after the apostles were martyred and so it has continued for THOSE THAT BELIEVE unto this very day .

 

[W2L]

Usually some churches agree on each other very well actually, some preachers branch off to different controversial theachings like wof or prosperity gospel which i don't like either, is error evidence that God is not present at all in all churches? NO.

Christians get online here everyday and argue disagreements over theology. Its the same old stuff, fighting over whos right and whos wrong. These people are claiming to be spirit filled but cant even agree with each other? I find that hard to swallow.

 

[swordsman1]

read matt 28 ..pleas .. this is getting embarrasing .. in it he tells the great commission
and yes it pops your bubble completley ...

he tell them to go to ALL nations ..not only the jews and he tells them as recorded across the gospel accounts .. to make more disciples (of ALL nations) teaching them to observe ALL Jesus commanded them .. and he commanded the great commission thus we are also to learn to do the great commission and to make more disciples of Jesus teaching them also to observe ALL Jesus commanded .and in ACTS we see they begin with the Jews then the lord specifically send peter and later Paul .. to the gentiles and they do MANY signs and wonders among the gentiles also and they convert and then they learn into the next generation after the apostles were martyred and so it has continued for THOSE THAT BELIEVE unto this very day .

There is no mention of healing the sick, raising the dead, and casting out demons in the Great Commission. That command was in Matt 10:5-8.

 

[W2L]

drop your false teaching and repent of it

You first.

 

[Alithis]

jesus healed the sick .. commended his diciples to do the same .. and then commanded them to teach more disciples( from ALL nations ) to do the same . if you cant put it all together i guess its as anther suggested .. spiritual constipation