Ed1wolf said:
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I do believe that our nature can change but only if God starts changing it but even God cannot change it all at one time. But you are wrong about people in general, no human can change their nature.
ken: Give me an example of a human nature that we are incapable of changing.
I already provided one, most people like to spend time with people like themselves in race, social status, intelligence, etc. Also people are by nature social beings who prefer living in groups rather than alone. That cannot be changed by other humans. Also, people by nature want a spouse and have children. These are unchangeable facts of human nature.
Ed1wolf said:
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Have you ever been to a school cafeteria? Even in so-called liberal colleges and high schools, the students generally will eat with people of their same race.
ken: I see people usually sitting with people from their neighborhood (which is often divided among race) but nobody is vilified for sitting next to someone of a different race.
It is true that people are not vilified for sitting next to someone of a different race, but that has only occurred due to social pressures based on Judeo-Christian principles that began to be accepted by the majority in America after Christians like MLK fought against it. God uses His people to sometimes change human nature, but without those changes going along with His principles they will not take root in a significant way.
Ed1wolf said:
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No, the Christian God is the moral standard and judge of the universe, irrespective of whether you believe in Him or not.
ken: So because you say so; that makes it so? Well 2 can play that game; how’s this!
I am the moral standard and judge of the Universe, irrespective of whether you believe it or not.
Sooo….are you convinced yet? (crickets)
In order to be the judge of the universe you have to have created the moral laws of the universe and since those laws are part of the universe, you would have to be the creator of the universe, but it can be shown that you are not, but the Christian God is. Also, you are another human whose moral standard just exists in your mind just like any other human and does not exist outside your mind, objectively.
Ed1wolf said:
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You dont know this, your bias is just making you assume this. Ancient Israel was one of the most morally and politically advanced societies at the time.
ken: Are you familiar with all of the societies 2000 years ago? Admit it; your bias is making you assume this.
All of the major societies, I have read a great deal about ancient history.
Ed1wolf said:
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She was taken from her home during the war, his fellow Hebrews would not fault him for taking a POW, that was allowed by God.
ken: Because somebody said God allowed it???
Not just somebody, Moses said it, who had demonstrated that He was chosen by God as their leader and God's prophet thru miraculous events, including hearing the voice of God Himself on Sinai.
ken: If his fellow Hebrews had an ounce of integrity, they would have defended the victim, cursed the kidnapper, and cursed anybody claiming God would allow this evil. Integrity is doing what’s right in regardless of what you are told.
Obedience is doing what you are told regardless of what’s right.
IMO they needed more integrity, and less obedience.
No, they knew she would have a much better life living as a Hebrew. They knew that women were treated much better than other nations in the area. Women were commanded to be treated as spiritual equals as I demonstrated earlier from Genesis 1. It would be similar to rescuing someone from living in the old Soviet Union or East Germany.
Ed1wolf said:
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Nothing in that verse or even the whole 32nd chapter says anything about rape, it doesn't even mention women.
ken:
Numbers 31:18
But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Numbers 31:18 but spare for yourselves every girl who has never had relations with a man.
In case you didn't notice, that is not chapter 32. But we already dealt with this when we discussed Deut. 21:14, she cannot be treated brutally, which obviously includes rape. You need to learn to stop repeating the same refuted claims. The reason young women were chosen because they would be less committed to the degraded culture of their old nation and more likely to learn the more advanced ideas of the Hebrew culture.
Ed1wolf said:
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No, it is well known that drugs, indigestion, and hormones can make people act very differently and even change their views on many things including morality during the period that they are exposed
to these things.
ken: That’s other people; I’m talking about me. Again; I know the difference between emotional pain and physical pain.
What are you? A god? I guarantee with the right drugs you could be made to do many things and believe things that you would not normally believe.