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The origins of atheism

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Ana the Ist

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I did already.

Well darn...I haven't read each and every page in this somewhat ridiculous thread.

Could you just repost it? Or copy and paste it? Or maybe type it all out again?

We are talking about knowledge/answers you got from god...so I'd think that if they're real they'd warrant repeating for anyone who hasn't read them yet.
 
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ScottA

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Personally, I would be impressed if someone could at least propose a method (or at least a starting point for developing such a method) how to determine the validity of exceptional/unfalsibiiable/"supernatural" claims.
And by that I don´t mean a post-hoc method fine-tuned to the claim of the respective believer.
The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
 
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ScottA

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What a hopelessly vague response.
Yes, because it has been repeated soooo many times.

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
 
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Atrum Angelus

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These flood stories predate the book of genesis by hundreds of years. Gilgamesh is almost identical to the story of Noah and was written much earlier.

Even the story of Jesus was borrowed from much older stories.
For example:

1. Asklepios healed the sick, raised the dead and was known as the savior and redeemer.

2. Hercules was born of a divine father and mortal mother and known as the savior of the world. Prophets predicted his birth and claimed he'd be a king. His last words were "It is finished" Sound familiar?

3. Dionysus was literally the "Son of God". Born of a virgin mother and depicted riding a donkey. He turned water to wine and healed the sick. He was killed, resurrected and became immortal. His greatest accomplishment was his own death.

4. Osiris did the same things as Dionysus.

5. Osiris' son Horus was known as "light of the world, the good shepherd, the lamb" and was referred to as "The way, the truth and the life" His symbol was a cross. Sound familiar?

6. Mithra's birthday is celebrated on December 25th. The birth was witnessed by shepherds who brought him gifts. Also had 12 disciples and also had a final meal before going up to heaven. The story also says he will return to pass judgement on the living and the dead. Good go to heaven, bad go to hell. Does this story sound familiar? It predates Christianity by 600 years.

7. Krishna had a miraculous conception and wise men were able to come visit as they were guided by a star. After he was born an area ruler tried to find him and have him killed. Sound familiar?

8. Apollonius of Tyana performed countless miracles. His birth was of a virgin foretold by an angel. He was crucified, rose from the dead and appeared to his disciples to prove his power before going to heaven. He is known as "The Son of God"

All of these stories predate Christianity.

Krishna, 900 BC, India
Born on 19, July, 3228 BC, according to the Hindu Puranic text the Bhagavata Purana. Born to mortal parents, Devaki and Vasudeva, through Vishnu. Krishna is Vishnu’s earthly form, however, Krishna is Devaki’s 8th son. Ie. Not a virgin. Krishna was he was a herder, albeit of cows, not sheep. His primary purpose was to kill Kansa, king of the Yadava clan. He is killed by a hunter, and ascends back to Goloka vrindavan.

Horus, 3000 BC Egypt
Horus was born of the 5th day of the Epagomenae (5 extra days at the end of the Egyptian year, that were a feast period and celebration). The Egyptian calendar is 365 days long, divided into 12 months of three weeks, each being 10 days long. If he was born on the 5th day of the Epagomenae, that would equate to New Year’s Eve, or Dec. 31. He was born of Isis, to Osiris. Not a virgin as the myth goes into how she used Osiris’ “appendage.” He was a star in the East, being the sun at dawn. Horus had followers, the shemsu-heru, they were the predynastic kings and they were more than 3 and 12. Osiris was the one betrayed, by Set, and Horus, after being born when Iris put Osiris back together, set about to avenge his father. Horus did die, from a scorpion that found him as a child, not from a betrayal. Both Osiris and Horus were resurrected with the help of Thoth, but that is a common theme in ancient myth. His symbol is not a cross.
Also, your information on Osiris is slim, but he was nothing like Dionysus.

Dionysus, 500 BC, Greece
Was not born of a virgin birth, but an affair between Zeus and a mortal woman (very common in Greek mythology, Zeus was eternally h0rny) named Semele. Hera, as usual, was angry and caused doubt in Semele. Semele demanded Zeus reveal his godhood, but in doing so killed her. Zeus rescued the unborn child and sewed Dionysus into his thigh. He was born from Zeus. Hence why he was called “twice born.” He had two birthdays, one in autumn during the harvest and one in January, when new wine is fermented. Dionysus was torn to pieces by a titan and eaten, and restored to life from the heart that remained uneaten. Zeus was the king of kings. He turned water to wine, but Dionysus was the GOD OF WINE.

Mithra, 1200 BC, Persia
Zoroastrianism doesn’t give a date for Mithra’s birth. It wasn’t until the rise of Mithraism in the Roman Empire in the 2nd Century AD did Mithra become associated with Sol Invictus (the “Unconquered Sun”). The earliest record of “Dies Natalis Solis Invicti” or birthday of the Unconquered Sun is 354AD, on Dec.25. Zoroastrian’s associated Mithra with the 16th day of the month and the 7th month of the year, but this relates to Mithra’s place in the hierarchy of their pantheon. He was born a) fully grown from a cave (Roman) or b) from the Goddes Anahita (Persian). There is no record of 12 disciples and he didn’t resurrect in bodily (mortal) form.
He was the Zoroastrian god of light and protector of Truth. Most of his "similarities" with Jesus arose after Jesus' time by a couple hundred years when the cult arose in Rome.

Modern scholars dispute the parallelism between Jesus and these other myths as superficial.

As someone who went to university to study these things, please stop using the references you did. They are wrong and a simple amount of research will show you that. The guy who wrote through book that your "facts" came from has been panned by nearly every academic who studies ancient people and their myths.
And I'm an atheist, so please don't think I say these things as a support for belief, only because your information is wrong.
 
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asherahSamaria

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Krishna, 900 BC, India
Born on 19, July, 3228 BC, according to the Hindu Puranic text the Bhagavata Purana. Born to mortal parents, Devaki and Vasudeva, through Vishnu. Krishna is Vishnu’s earthly form, however, Krishna is Devaki’s 8th son. Ie. Not a virgin. Krishna was he was a herder, albeit of cows, not sheep. His primary purpose was to kill Kansa, king of the Yadava clan. He is killed by a hunter, and ascends back to Goloka vrindavan.

Horus, 3000 BC Egypt
Horus was born of the 5th day of the Epagomenae (5 extra days at the end of the Egyptian year, that were a feast period and celebration). The Egyptian calendar is 365 days long, divided into 12 months of three weeks, each being 10 days long. If he was born on the 5th day of the Epagomenae, that would equate to New Year’s Eve, or Dec. 31. He was born of Isis, to Osiris. Not a virgin as the myth goes into how she used Osiris’ “appendage.” He was a star in the East, being the sun at dawn. Horus had followers, the shemsu-heru, they were the predynastic kings and they were more than 3 and 12. Osiris was the one betrayed, by Set, and Horus, after being born when Iris put Osiris back together, set about to avenge his father. Horus did die, from a scorpion that found him as a child, not from a betrayal. Both Osiris and Horus were resurrected with the help of Thoth, but that is a common theme in ancient myth. His symbol is not a cross.
Also, your information on Osiris is slim, but he was nothing like Dionysus.

Dionysus, 500 BC, Greece
Was not born of a virgin birth, but an affair between Zeus and a mortal woman (very common in Greek mythology, Zeus was eternally h0rny) named Semele. Hera, as usual, was angry and caused doubt in Semele. Semele demanded Zeus reveal his godhood, but in doing so killed her. Zeus rescued the unborn child and sewed Dionysus into his thigh. He was born from Zeus. Hence why he was called “twice born.” He had two birthdays, one in autumn during the harvest and one in January, when new wine is fermented. Dionysus was torn to pieces by a titan and eaten, and restored to life from the heart that remained uneaten. Zeus was the king of kings. He turned water to wine, but Dionysus was the GOD OF WINE.

Mithra, 1200 BC, Persia
Zoroastrianism doesn’t give a date for Mithra’s birth. It wasn’t until the rise of Mithraism in the Roman Empire in the 2nd Century AD did Mithra become associated with Sol Invictus (the “Unconquered Sun”). The earliest record of “Dies Natalis Solis Invicti” or birthday of the Unconquered Sun is 354AD, on Dec.25. Zoroastrian’s associated Mithra with the 16th day of the month and the 7th month of the year, but this relates to Mithra’s place in the hierarchy of their pantheon. He was born a) fully grown from a cave (Roman) or b) from the Goddes Anahita (Persian). There is no record of 12 disciples and he didn’t resurrect in bodily (mortal) form.
He was the Zoroastrian god of light and protector of Truth. Most of his "similarities" with Jesus arose after Jesus' time by a couple hundred years when the cult arose in Rome.

Modern scholars dispute the parallelism between Jesus and these other myths as superficial.

As someone who went to university to study these things, please stop using the references you did. They are wrong and a simple amount of research will show you that. The guy who wrote through book that your "facts" came from has been panned by nearly every academic who studies ancient people and their myths.
And I'm an atheist, so please don't think I say these things as a support for belief, only because your information is wrong.


Yes - Agree with your post 100% though he is right about the Noah story and the Epic of Gilgamesh parallels
 
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AirPo

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Either way, you do not know the truth, because the truth is not in you. If the truth were in you, you would not speculate, nor would you deny the truth when it is presented to you.
There is no such thing as "truth in you."
 
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ScottA

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Actual evidence that any god claim is true. Something that was indisputable.
People who know God have been saying down through all of history:

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
 
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ScottA

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There is no such thing as "truth in you."
Not until it is revealed to you:

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
 
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ScottA

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Well darn...I haven't read each and every page in this somewhat ridiculous thread.

Could you just repost it? Or copy and paste it? Or maybe type it all out again?

We are talking about knowledge/answers you got from god...so I'd think that if they're real they'd warrant repeating for anyone who hasn't read them yet.
I'll cut to the punchline:

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
 
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quatona

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The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
You asked me a question. I wasn´t aware that answering it would earn me this sermon. You could have entered your pulpit right away - without pretending to ask a question.
 
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AirPo

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"Reason is the proof of science, faith the proof of religion, logic the proof of philosophy, but revelation is validated only by human experience. Science yields knowledge; religion yields happiness; philosophy yields unity; revelation confirms the experiential harmony of this triune approach to universal reality." UB 1955
I hope you didn't pay for that, because none of it is true.
 
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Archaeopteryx

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Yes, because it has been repeated soooo many times.

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.
That still doesn't answer the question:
One of the two testimonies is wrong.
How do we determine which?
 
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AV1611VET

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Modern scholars dispute the parallelism between Jesus and these other myths as superficial.
I dispute those parallelisms as "diabolical mimicry."

But then, I'm not a modern scholar.
 
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asherahSamaria

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People who know God have been saying down through all of history:

The kingdom of God is within you. You must look inward. You will not find validity out in the world or in others, unless you first validate it within yourself.

There are other pursuits that will tell you the same, but still look in the wrong places: nature is "created" and therefore not at the core or root; philosophy is [only] of the mind and knows nothing more than you do; intellect is [only] the philosophy of others; inner peace is a loop going nowhere; other gods are outward, the creation of other people. The One True God is within you. Call on Him, and He will answer. But be patient, your whole life is a part of His plan. He has given you time, give Him time as well.


I'll pass on the voices in the head thanks
 
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ecco

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I don't believe you.

Especially since you said this:If I'm wrong, I'll ask a second time:

Why are you an atheist?
I spent one minute answering your previous question. I'll spend another two on this post. You have repeatedly demonstrated that you have no intention of entering into a serious discussion with anyone. When your "beliefs" are challenged, you try to deflect ("move the goalposts" as someone said), duck and dodge. You leave serious questions unanswered and pretend they were never asked. OK. Time's up.
 
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